Ringo Starr should be ashamed

[ChrisGeorge]

What EXACTLY did Ringo say that has upset so many here? Does anyone know of a transcript I can read? If you were him, and been living on the west coast of the USA, you need to understand that Liverpool is a shock, I mean a real shock.

The agressive attitudes, poor service and quality in restaurants and pubs, is bad for the most part, the taxis are now all driven by people who speak little English and rely on GPS for God's sake! Most men dress in the now regulation trainers, "tracky bottoms" or this new "hoodie" stuff, and overall the impression one gets is of a city that has lost its indviduality and become a slave to reatilers.

Even if you just lived in the US (as I have) the shock factor is big, let alone being a millionaire like him, so you need to understand what he was saying. He may have been undiplomatic, I need to read the transcript to decide myself, bet lets not pretend there are no problems, sometimes a bad word or two form someone with status can do good, but I dont know if this was his motive.

Hello Barratie

Nice to meet you. You don't need a transcript to know and appreciate what Ringo said, though I think you can find it on YouTube. He was on the Jonathan Ross show immediately after his appearance in Liverpool to open the Capital Culture Year.

Ross asked him, "What do you miss about Liverpool?"

Ringo answered, "Nothing."

That is what has upset Scousers. And it's highly ironic because in his title track song on his "Liverpool 08" CD, the lyrics read, "Liverpool, I left you but I never let you down."

Yet I see the remark, which was unfortunate and ill advised, as one of a piece with the one-liners the Beatles always said in interviews:

"Are you a mod or a rocker, Ringo?"

"No, I'm a mocker."

"How do you find the United States."

"Go to Greenland and turn left." And so on.

Also as you indicated, the remark has to be seen in context of the fact that he no longer lives in Liverpool.

Where do you live, Mate? You mentioned that your wife is from Baltimore. As you can see from my profile, I am a Liverpool ex-pat living in Baltimore. Maybe once you return Stateside we could get together some time. Let me know.

All the best

Chris

[shoequeen13]

"Smug and arrogant" (in a lovable Scouse way) was what the Beatles were all about, and, apart from the music, made them stand out from the other groups.

the beatles way back when were very off the cuff and had that whole witty sarcasm thing going (that us scousers do so well!) they were young, talented,in demand & enjoying the ride but they weren't smug or arrogant not then anyway though that may have come later for some of them...

[shoequeen13]

Hello Barratie

Nice to meet you. You don't need a transcript to know and appreciate what Ringo said, though I think you can find it on YouTube. He was on the Jonathan Ross show immediately after his appearance in Liverpool to open the Capital Culture Year.

Ross asked him, "What do you miss about Liverpool?"

Ringo answered, "Nothing."

That is what has upset Scousers. And it's highly ironic because in his title track song on his "Liverpool 08" CD, the lyrics read, "Liverpool, I left you but I never let you down."

Yet I see the remark, which was unfortunate and ill advised, as one of a piece with the one-liners the Beatles always said in interviews:

"Are you a mod or a rocker, Ringo?"

"No, I'm a mocker."

"How do you find the United States."

"Go to Greenland and turn left." And so on.

Also as you indicated, the remark has to be seen in context of the fact that he no longer lives in Liverpool.

Where do you live, Mate? You mentioned that your wife is from Baltimore. As you can see from my profile, I am a Liverpool ex-pat living in Baltimore. Maybe once you return Stateside we could get together some time. Let me know.

All the best

Chris

the difference is the one-liners you mentioned were funny & witty, what ringo said was misjudged, hurtful & amusing only to those who don't have anything good to say about the city in the first place. some kind of ambassador he is who stoops to insults to get a laugh! i don't know all the details of his visit i hope he appeared for free & wasn't paid as that would make it far worse & just spiteful. talk about bite the hand that feeds you...

as for those who think its his choice to speak ill of the city if he likes - he is not just some run of the mill person as one of the beatles he is still reveered by many in liverpool & around the world thats how strong the beatles legacy is. but what does that say about him as a person that he could be so quick to make such a comment before he jets back to his pampered life in monaco...

& yet despite his many homes & wealth he is becoming increasingly known as a grouch (to put it mildy) he can be unpleasant to autograph hunters and who didn't cringe with embarrassment on hearing that he got really angry while appearing on a top rated show in the US because they asked him to cut his 5 min song down to 2 1/2 mins? the same song btw that he sings 'liverpool, i left you but i never let you down' well not till now that is...

i love the beatles i really do. i have most of their albums and like the vast majority of scousers i feel a certain smugness that one of the greatest bands of all time came from our little city. but as for the beatles themselves i feel they could have all done a lot more for liverpool over the years. when they first started they were known as much for their scouse humour & for being the four cheeky lads from liverpool, as for their music. the city shaped them.

[Barratie]

the difference is the one-liners you mentioned were funny & witty, what ringo said was misjudged, hurtful & amusing only to those who don't have anything good to say about the city in the first place. some kind of ambassador he is who stoops to insults to get a laugh! i don't know all the details of his visit i hope he appeared for free & wasn't paid as that would make it far worse & just spiteful. talk about bite the hand that feeds you...

as for those who think its his choice to speak ill of the city if he likes - he is not just some run of the mill person as one of the beatles he is still reveered by many in liverpool & around the world thats how strong the beatles legacy is. but what does that say about him as a person that he could be so quick to make such a comment before he jets back to his pampered life in monaco...

& yet despite his many homes & wealth he is becoming increasingly known as a grouch (to put it mildy) he can be unpleasant to autograph hunters and who didn't cringe with embarrassment on hearing that he got really angry while appearing on a top rated show in the US because they asked him to cut his 5 min song down to 2 1/2 mins? the same song btw that he sings 'liverpool, i left you but i never let you down' well not till now that is...

i love the beatles i really do. i have most of their albums and like the vast majority of scousers i feel a certain smugness that one of the greatest bands of all time came from our little city. but as for the beatles themselves i feel they could have all done a lot more for liverpool over the years. when they first started they were known as much for their scouse humour & for being the four cheeky lads from liverpool, as for their music. the city shaped them.

Well I dont see why they, any of them, should do anything in particular for "The City", I really dont know what they could do that would actually have prevented urban decay, destruction of historic properties and communities, rise in drug use and crime etc.

Liverpool and it's population need to take control of their City, and stop allowing self important administrators to do what they please. We tend to attach too much significance to The Beatles, really we do, we need to move on.

I bet Ringo is really glad that he managed to "escape" the place, it had massive poverty problems back in their day too recall, although it had a much stronger bohemian nature back then, it was a city that meant something.

As is typical in modern "democracies" we tend to sit back and just let our "leaders" set the agenda, define policy, define objectives and all do pretty much nothing about it.

The whole Capital of Culture thing is one big gravy train for some well connected companies and individuals, and little else in reality. I know a lot of people, decent people have been and are working hard on projects associated with this, but ultimately it is about exploting investment opportunities.

I was dismayed to see that the old aviary in sefton park, was not being renovated or even cleaned up for this 2008 celebration. What kind of impression do these councillors want to make on visitors? What has Phil Redmond done here? in fact why do we even have a person that writes dull TV soaps in any position of influence at all?

Imagine visiting sefton park, encountering the avaiary and seeing what is there? a load of filthy, junk filled cells, covered in rust with the roof collapsing. Utterly shameful, a few grand would have fixed that up nicely, I loved it when I was a kid.

The Beatles owe us nothing in my view, they certainly owe me nothing.

[knowhowe]

Yes, the Daily Mail (not my normal read!) did a two page spread last week upon the theme of "Why is Ringo so bad tempered these days?" citing numerous examples of his rudeness to minions, journalists, fans etc.

I'm reminded of the TV show 'Grumpy Old Men'. Very amusing but every 'grumpy' featured is rich and successful in their respective fields. Is it having lots of money that makes them that way?

Maybe that's why I'm such a ray of sunshine..

[shoequeen13]

Well I dont see why they, any of them, should do anything in particular for "The City", I really dont know what they could do that would actually have prevented urban decay, destruction of historic properties and communities, rise in drug use and crime etc.

Liverpool and it's population need to take control of their City, and stop allowing self important administrators to do what they please. We tend to attach too much significance to The Beatles, really we do, we need to move on.

I bet Ringo is really glad that he managed to "escape" the place, it had massive poverty problems back in their day too recall, although it had a much stronger bohemian nature back then, it was a city that meant something.

As is typical in modern "democracies" we tend to sit back and just let our "leaders" set the agenda, define policy, define objectives and all do pretty much nothing about it.

The whole Capital of Culture thing is one big gravy train for some well connected companies and individuals, and little else in reality. I know a lot of people, decent people have been and are working hard on projects associated with this, but ultimately it is about exploting investment opportunities.

I was dismayed to see that the old aviary in sefton park, was not being renovated or even cleaned up for this 2008 celebration. What kind of impression do these councillors want to make on visitors? What has Phil Redmond done here? in fact why do we even have a person that writes dull TV soaps in any position of influence at all?

Imagine visiting sefton park, encountering the avaiary and seeing what is there? a load of filthy, junk filled cells, covered in rust with the roof collapsing. Utterly shameful, a few grand would have fixed that up nicely, I loved it when I was a kid.

The Beatles owe us nothing in my view, they certainly owe me nothing.

i'm afraid we'll just have to agree to disagree...otherwise we'll just go back & forth! i just feel that the beatles were very unique in that the city they came from was very much a part of their identity & when it suited them they milked the connection especially for US audiences who loved the cheeky lad appeal.
(just realised i said lets agree to differ then added a last word... i'm a woman so i would wouldn't i...)

[snappel]

but as for the beatles themselves i feel they could have all done a lot more for liverpool over the years

I disagree. Perhaps you should count yourselves lucky they left such a legacy. I mean, look at the number of tourists who flock to Liverpool to visit Beatles-related attractions. The city is profiting from them, and will be after they're all gone.

In all honesty, I don't see what they owe Liverpool at all.

[PhilipG]

the beatles way back when were very off the cuff and had that whole witty sarcasm thing going (that us scousers do so well!) they were young, talented,in demand & enjoying the ride but they weren't smug or arrogant not then anyway though that may have come later for some of them...

Wasn't "We're more popular than Christ",
(to quote myself): " "smug and arrogant" (in a lovable Scouse way)"?

[Ged]

It would have been if it wasn't true - or that Maureen Cleeve hadn't misinterpreted how Lennon meant it.

Regarding another comment above. I'd say they never said look at me i'm a cheeky chappie from Liverpool, they were just from Liverpool which made them intrinsically what they were regarding their humour and cockiness. They never used the city to make a play on it.

[christy]

It would have been if it wasn't true - or that Maureen Cleeve hadn't misinterpreted how Lennon meant it.

Regarding another comment above. I'd say they never said look at me i'm a cheeky chappie from Liverpool, they were just from Liverpool which made them intrinsically what they were regarding their humour and cockiness. They never used the city to make a play on it.

Agree totally mate. They were what they were because they were from the city and that was it, end of. I have never heard any of them from interviews at the time playing up the 'scouse wit' thing. They were just 4 cocky lads.

And as you said, the fact is they were more popular than Jesus at the time so Lennon was just saying what he observed, not what he believed.

[Ged]

Yeah, that quote was 6 months old and caused not a ripple when published here - fast forward 6 months to the bible belt southern states of America and beatles bonfires, death threats and dj's pronouncing Lennon as the devil. It could only happen out there of course. Christianity was falling, the promiscuous society was raging, pot smoking hippies and the LSD summer of love around the corner, church congregations falling and the Beatles achieving number one after number one whilst getting m.b.e's and sell out tours. It's true that he was commenting on his observations. If they really wanted to speak out about what they thought politically - but were banned by Epstein - Apartheid and vietnam - then fireworks would have gone off - they might've acted the goat as moptops but they had brains too.

[PhilipG]

I wasn't criticising the Beatles when I said:

"smug and arrogant" (in a lovable Scouse way)"

Just replace it with the word "Cocky", if it gives offence.

(Besides, this thread is getting very "old".)

[Ged]

No offence taken by me Philip

The Beatles can look after themselves.


It would appear though that Lennon's 'observation' was given to Cleave off the record and it wasn't a boast, more of an amazement at the way things were going that they were more popular than Jesus - a reluctant acceptance of sorts.

[PhilipG]

No offence taken by me Philip

The Beatles can look after themselves.


It would appear though that Lennon's 'observation' was given to Cleave off the record and it wasn't a boast, more of an amazement at the way things were going that they were more popular than Jesus - a reluctant acceptance of sorts.

Obviously, I chose that quote as an extreme example, but I remember the Beatles from when I wrote in my Diary: "Saw the Beetles at the Floral Hall tonight" (note the spelling) and they never were "shrinking violets", for which I was eternally grateful after being reared on the Holy Cliff Richard (and the creepily weird Bill Haley).

[shoequeen13]

Wasn't "We're more popular than Christ",
(to quote myself): " "smug and arrogant" (in a lovable Scouse way)"?

but i think it was john just being john. it wasn't said with any malice. he didn't mean they were better than or really comparing themselves with christ. but they were soooo huge at the time (still are) so he was really just stating the obvious that they were in fact more popular than christ/religion with the 'masses' as it were.