World War II air raid shelters and defenses in the Liverpool area

[ChrisGeorge]

Hi,

I have a map on my website of the area you refer to www.worldwar2defences.co.uk The structures are part of old Fort Crosby and it did defend the estuary. The site was built before both world wars but was beefed up during the second world war to defend the North Western Approaches. If you're interested in WW2 Pillboxes and defence structures in merseyside there are more on my website. I am constantly adding locations there are so many it is going to take me a long time to photograph and add them all!

Hope that helps

Derek

Hi Derek

Thanks for pointing us to your very interesting site. I had a look at the interactive map. I seem to remember dragon's teeth in the fields to the south of the railway bridge on Speke Hall Road. They would have been across the road from the Retail Park but south of the bridge. Am I remembering correctly? This would have been in the Fifties or early Sixties.



I am sure you can answer DaisyChains query about whether there are any other air raid shelters still about in Liverpool. Of course, the Western Approaches Command Centre at Derby House would be one, but I wonder if there might be other air raid shelters in Liverpool still in existence but derelict or put to other uses? In the postwar years, my grandfather used my family's old Anderson shelter as a toolshed and I am sure other Liverpudlians did likewise, so there may be a few of those around as well.

Chris

[marky]

I know 3 pillboxes in Liverpool. Clarke Gardens, 2 at Garston Docks. One of the Garston ones can be seen from the very Southern end of Cressington Esplanade. You have to lean out over the raillings and look left to see it.
I have heard there are a couple more around Hunts Cross/Speke (or used to be).
There used to be a pillbox at the rear of the Army base at Aigburth Road, but with all the new houses around St Michaels, I guess it went years ago. I last saw that one about 30 years ago.
I have a distant memory of seeing those pyramid defenses around Oglet beach, possibly around the 'dungeon'. There are also modern-day copies of these pyramids, to keep motorbikes out of parks etc.

[PhilipG]

The Park Nook site in Ullet Road/Princes Park had what I'm sure were air-raid shelters until a couple of years ago when they built new flats on the site.

[Degsy_b]

Hi,

Erm there's so much information coming thick and fast I don't know where to start answering! Firstly I'd be very grateful if people here would submit pictures and locations of pillboxes they know of and aren't on my site. As for any remaining air raid shelters there are some recorded in the British Archaeological survey, any one interested can check out http://ads.ahds.ac.uk/catalogue/search/map.cfm I haven't managed to track any down myself, but I think there's one in Kirkby and there are a few recorded on the Wirral. Again if anyone can pinpoint these structures for me I'd be hugely appreciative. I love the pictures of the basement shelter, is it the royal Liverbuildings? Can I use the pictures on my site? Can people visit them?

I know of a Pillbox at Garston docks right by the shore line. I don't know of the other one, so if you could tell me where that is? that would be great! I had a look for the pillbox at St Michael's hamlet behind the TA barracks about 5 months ago and I think it has been lost to housing development, it was a a Type 23 anti aircraft pillbox and it still recorded on the Brit Arch Survey.

Thanks for everyones contibutions what a fabulous response!

Derek

[snappel]

I love the pictures of the basement shelter, is it the royal Liverbuildings? Can I use the pictures on my site? Can people visit them?

It's the Royal Insurance Building - it's got a gold dome on the top, and has been vacant for some years now. It's not publicly accessible I'm afraid - my access was through a basement window, which unfortunately has now been boarded up as I'd love to have another look round.

I'll sort you out some better quality photos if you like - I have better ones than those above. I'm happy for photos to be used on other peoples' websites free of charge - all I ask is that they retain my small watermark so that people know where they came from.

PhilipG - are these the ones you meant? I went to photograph them back in 2004, but builders were already on site. All gone now.

http://www.williamsontunnels.com/articles/martineau.htm

[Degsy_b]

It's the Royal Insurance Building
I'm happy for photos to be used on other peoples' websites free of charge - all I ask is that they retain my small watermark so that people know where they came from.

http://www.williamsontunnels.com/articles/martineau.htm

Thanks so much.

I will of course incliude the water mark and the a credit in the pop up window (what an accolade hey)? Is it the royal Insurance Building Liverpool? Near the Pier Head?

Thanks

Derek

[peter]

up till a few years ago booker avenue school in allerton had shelters in the playground. i work sometimes at heron eccles playing fields and the headmaster sometimes let us store machinery in them. been in them a few times they were above ground, long and low ,and had thick concrete roofs.
inside they had seperate rooms which were staggered to confine any blasts.
unfortunately they have now been demolished to upgrade the playground.i am sure the school will have some pictures of them. there is an old man who lives by us who claims to have been one of the few survivors of the blast in clint road school by durning road . unfortunately i believe the boilers received a direct hit and most victims were scalded to death. Harry said he dragged himself out of the rubble and staggered to his grans house who then told him off because he was filthy. hope this helps. pete.

[knowhowe]

I remember Fort Crosby very well. we used to go there a lot as kids. Used to get there either via Hall Road (though i can't for the life of me remember the route from there now) or by crossing the Liverpool-Southport railway line somewhere beyond S n i g g e r y Woods in Little Crosby. The return trip was always via Hall Road as there was a tap mounted on a wooden pole there that we'd descend upon with delight after a day playing in the arid old fort.
(To my astonishment, actually photographed by Sirob- http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/sho...?t=8390&page=6)
It was a massive concrete construction set back from the seashore and half-buried by dunes. If you climbed to the top there was a wide circular groove in the concrete where a gun mounting used to be. There were lots of odd nooks and corners and rooms whose walls were inscribed with mysterious words in white paint.
Another source of wonder for me was that the place was strewn with the bones and skulls of rats, all bleached white- except for the yellow teeth. Thousands of them. I used to fill my pockets with them but my mam always kicked up a stink when she found them and chucked them out. We never ever saw a live rat though- what the beggars lived on there anyway I have no idea, there was nothing but sand...
The place was a wonderland of imagination for us, the perfect setting for all manner of war games. I've no idea when it was demolished or why. It would have been an interesting building to have preserved as a memory of the war in Merseyside. It was in pretty good nick the last time I saw it in the mid-60s. Anyone know what's there now, if anything?

On the subject of pill boxes, there's one tucked into the rural back lane that links Little Crosby village with the Southport by-pass. A quiet spot even today, hard to imagine Nazi invaders passing that way.

[ChrisGeorge]

A pic of the Allerton pillbox on Springwood Avenue:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/lsauld/...2242121198@N01

[christy]

There was an air raid shelter in Croxteth park near the bridge over the river Alt heading out from the Mansion towards Crocky and past the old tree. It was a big mound of built up earth with a concrete surround doorway that at the time you had to drop into. It is well away from the house and in the middle of some trees next to the river. Must still be there?

[PhilipG]

PhilipG - are these the ones you meant? I went to photograph them back in 2004, but builders were already on site. All gone now.

http://www.williamsontunnels.com/articles/martineau.htm

That's it.
Thanks for the photo.
All the times I took the dog to that park, and I never took any photos!

[Cadfael]

That's it.
Thanks for the photo.
All the times I took the dog to that park, and I never took any photos!

Managed to get in those - it really was a 40ft long tunnel with lovely brickwork inside and certainly looked like it went much further.
Didn't take any pictures but it's a shame that they've gone now - there used to be large sandstone blocks scattered about the place too.

[PhilipG]

Managed to get in those - it really was a 40ft long tunnel with lovely brickwork inside and certainly looked like it went much further.
Didn't take any pictures but it's a shame that they've gone now - there used to be large sandstone blocks scattered about the place too.

I didn't know they went that far, but doesn't 40 feet still indicate an air-raid shelter?
It was also said that it was the cellars of the house called Park Nook which were used as air-raid shelters.
Park Nook was the only building ever on the site, which is part of the original Toxteth Park.

[Cadfael]

I didn't know they went that far, but doesn't 40 feet still indicate an air-raid shelter?
It was also said that it was the cellars of the house called Park Nook which were used as air-raid shelters.
Park Nook was the only building ever on the site, which is part of the original Toxteth Park.

They may well have been used for air raid shelters at some point - although access to them was via crawling on your stomach to get in to them a few years ago.

But when FOWT visited them and did some background work, it was realised that they were built along with the house for James Martineau for his children to play in. There were various blocked off archways underground which indicated a much larger area rather than just the one tunnel system which was actually quite narrow. I only wish I had taken more pictures back then but while I think they may have been fairly extensive, they were nothing like the elaborate Williamson's Tunnels.

They themselves were looked at by the City Council to see if they were suitable for air raid shelters but decided against them.

The picture below shows chaps from LCC exploring the tunnels to see if they were of use during the war:



Source - LCC

[PhilipG]

Thanks, Brother Cad.
That all sounds logical.
There is an early painting of Princes Park taken from Martineau's, but I never did find out exactly where Martineau's was.