Cruise Ship Terminal

[irishseashipping.com]

True but the ferry trips seem so limited from Liverpool, stretching out to the North Wales coast not just Mostyn would be good.

It should be remembered that when the present ROYAL DAFFODIL was rebuilt in 1999 it was intended that it would be able to operate short cruises along the north Wales coast.

This has never materialised. Though a berthing trial was undertaken at Llandudno Pier around three summers ago.

Now the berthing head at Llandudno has been damaged by bad weather during the 2006/7 and 2007/8 winters even the occasional visit by Waverley Steam Navigation Co's BALMORAL is unable to use Llandudno.

John

[Max]

It should be remembered that when the present ROYAL DAFFODIL was rebuilt in 1999 it was intended that it would be able to operate short cruises along the north Wales coast.

This has never materialised. Though a berthing trial was undertaken at Llandudno Pier around three summers ago.

Now the berthing head at Llandudno has been damaged by bad weather during the 2006/7 and 2007/8 winters even the occasional visit by Waverley Steam Navigation Co's BALMORAL is unable to use Llandudno.

John

Thats a shame, I would much prefer to ferry to North Wales than getting the train to Chester first.

Going to wait till I can drive though.

[gregs dad]

Heres the Saga Rose heading for the Langton Dock in July, imagine looking
over the rail of the ship at your port of call and seeing all that scrap.

[Paddy]

I have a question does anyone remember a huge amount of wreckage on the mersey in the late fithties or early sixties

[Waterways]

Heres the Saga Rose heading for the Langton Dock in July, imagine looking
over the rail of the ship at your port of call and seeing all that scrap.

All because Thatcher decided to ruin the Sheffield steel industry.

[Paddy]

Thats how it appeared to me on the ferry as a kid rusty mess.

[Howie]

Fred Olsen Line ready to quit city
Nov 28 2008
Barry Turnbull

A SECOND cruise line is set to snub Liverpool in a new row over berthing facilities.

Fred Olsen is ready to pull out because it is unable to base a ship at the Cruise Liner Terminal, at the Pier Head, and is currently forced to tie up alongside eyesore scrapyards in Bootle?s docklands.

The company says it can no longer expect passengers to start a dream holiday in a dismal industrial area.

A few weeks ago, Thomson Cruise pulled the plug on a 30- voyage programme after trialling the unsightly berth at Langton Dock.

Both lines claim they thought the terminal at the city?s waterfront would be available to use, but it has neither the necessary Customs or baggage handling facilities. At the moment, it can only be used as a port of call.

More...

[Max]

Competition laws dictating development hand outs. Liverpool could not have a terminal because Mostyn on the North Wales/River Dee coast had just financed a terminal from public money. This is what happens when everything has to wait for a hand out - there are always conditions. Mostyn got the money for a proper terminal, so Liverpool had to make do with a "port of call facility'. Amazing when Liverpool was the major ship passenger port of the UK.

Ships have to approach Mostyn through a very narrow channel - the River Dee is little more than a very wide ditch. It does not have the capacity to take a number of large cruise ships. Mostyn is little more than a village. Practical aspects like ships not able to use the grant funded terminal project don't come into it.

The old Pier Head passenger processing facilities were extensive - they were taken apart in the 1970s. They echoed the facilities in Ellis Island in New York - a fantastic sight.

Back in the 1960's a similar situation arose with the Mersey Docks and Harbour Board, when asked by the shipping companies to improve the facilities at the Pier Head for passengers. They said they were not interested, and were going to close the Riverside rail station too.

After around 200 years, the last scheduled trans-Atlantic passenger service left Liverpool in 1972, a Canadian Pacific Liner to Montreal - 1/2 million people lined the river see to her off. So, on the surface it appeared that MHDB were right. However, even then the cruise liner business was clearly an upcoming market. HDHB, even closed the south end docks prematurely. The large Brunswick Dock could have easily have gone on to this day - the further up river Garston Docks are still operative, even via an expensively dredged channel. Business students could have done more, their business acumen was so poor.

After seeing the Dee again today I agree that the Dee Is a very wide ditch. It dries out worse than the Mersey does near the Speke end.

Some Liverpool documentry on yesterday went on about the Mersey being a crazy place to put a port strangely too but the Mersey handles ships no problem.

[Broliv]

The Mersey originally was only intended as a spring anchorage that is where we get our name from (le = the, ver = spring, pool= anchorage. Latin if anyone is interested).

During the winter its almost untenable even now. Its only through the astute business foresight from the people who paid for the original docks (the city i believe) and engineering prowess of the people who designed and built it that we made the river a tenable place to dock ships.

[Bernie]

[QUOTE=Broliv;157061]The Mersey originally was only intended as a spring anchorage that is where we get our name from (le = the, ver = spring, pool= anchorage. Latin if anyone is interested). [QUOTE]

There is no seperate word for "The" in Latin.

[Broliv]

true, got mixed up with the french

[Waterways]

Some Liverpool documentry on yesterday went on about the Mersey being a crazy place to put a port strangely too but the Mersey handles ships no problem.

200,000 ton tankers pass the Liver Buildings. The Mersey is one of the few rivers that is not funnel shaped. The river has narrows which widens out to a large estuary basin. The 4th highest tidal range means water rushes past the narrows between Liverpool centre and Birkenhead. This rush of strong current water keeps the narrows clear and deep - a tidal scour. Sand from Liverpool Bay is dumped in the estuary basin - it is taken out on the ebb tide. Why the Mersey has that brown colour to the water, except when the tide turns and it is still. The Mersey is only place on the north west coast where a large sheltered deep water port can be located.

The port is well sheltered from the Irish sea winds and storms. In the olden dayes, ships were not that big and the depth did not matter too much. The shelter and easy overland access to the towns in the hinterland mattered. Also, smaller barges (Mersey flats), could sail way inland, up the Mersey and Weaver, and even up canals.

The port got bigger and better when the steam engine was invented and docks could be impounded (deepened) and large river-lock gates opened and closed. All this would be useless unless the river was naturally deep as ships became much bigger with deep draughts below the waterline - unlike todays ships which have shallow draughts and flat bottoms.

Many important and busy ports virtually disappeared when the steam engine and large ships came about, Lancaster and Bristol to name two.

Entering the port was difficult as ships tended to sail past the end of the Wirral and turn right into the river - over time sand banks shifted, so channels shifted too. Some came in via Formby point which was a straight run in. Large ships could only sail in via Formby. The Crosby Channel was deepened and underwater training walls built, which create a strong current, to keep the channel clear. This is the prime run in now.

[Paddy]

I have been perusing a picture in the Walker that depicts the new look Liverpool. It is more than a sparsley populated depiction, there ain't any people in it at all. Bring back Lowry I say. However it is quite interesting. Having owned a boat on the Grand Union I noticed that the canal has quite lenghty tunnels around the Pier Head, when it is up and running it will be interesting. It looks like once you have got out out the darkness you have four locks to negotiate.

[Broliv]

I'm hoping to take a rib up the canal when it opens from Brunswick to Stanley dock

[gregs dad]

Not till you reach the Stanley Dock Paddy here`s the locks
canal locks,liverpool on Flickr - Photo Sharing!