The Liverpool Irish ( A Happy Thread )

[Gnomie]

Just starting this for anyone who would like to chat about the Irish history in Liverpool. Its meant as a happy thread. Talk about Liverpool Irish and Irish in general.

I enjoy the Irish history, so this is the place i can talk about it, please join in if you would like to celebrate the Irish culture. but please its a happy thread, not a thread for having a go at the Irish.

[GingerTheCat]

I did make a few quick visits to the angry Irish thread but it was too depressing. Good luck with this one.

Just wanted to say that does everyone know St Patrick's day has been moved this year. Its 15th March 2008 instead of the usual 17th.

The reason is the unusually early Easter week and apparently there is a rule that both can't be in the same week.

There will still probably be events on the 17th. I think its just the religious festival that has moved.


http://www.goireland.com/BLOG/Article/St-Patricks-Day-In-Ireland-2008.html

[Steven]

I did make a few quick visits to the angry Irish thread but it was too depressing. Good luck with this one.

Just wanted to say that does everyone know St Patrick's day has been moved this year. Its 15th March 2008 instead of the usual 17th.

The reason is the unusually early Easter week and apparently there is a rule that both can't be in the same week.

There will still probably be events on the 17th. I think its just the religious festival that has moved.


http://www.goireland.com/BLOG/Article/St-Patricks-Day-In-Ireland-2008.html

I am desperate to join you here and I've got tons to tell you about. I thought the other 'nasty' thread had gone to rest but it was brought up again by Lindylou. I am fuming !!!

[Howie]

Prince's Landing Stage with the City of
Dublin Steam Packet Company office in
the foreground
© Courtesy of Liverpool Record Office

Irish cultural expression in Liverpool

Liverpool has a long standing public image as an Irish city, so much so that it is often jokingly referred to as the ‘Capital of Ireland’. For many Liverpool-born second and third-generation Irish people traditions of music and dance are ways in which they can connect to a sense of Irish identity and heritage and link up with other community members.

More...

[lindylou]

I am desperate to join you here and I've got tons to tell you about. I thought the other 'nasty' thread had gone to rest but it was brought up again by Lindylou. I am fuming !!!

when are you going to shut up !

have you got nothing else to worry about ??

[Waterways]

Liverpool has a long standing public image as an Irish city, so much so that it is often jokingly referred to as the ‘Capital of Ireland’. For many Liverpool-born second and third-generation Irish people traditions of music and dance are ways in which they can connect to a sense of Irish identity and heritage and link up with other community members.

All new to me. I knew no one who engaged in Irish traditions, dancing and the likes. I have Irish in me and we never did any of that. I'm sure those of Irish parents may have done those sort of things, I never knew any. Once a generation passes the connection is lost and all that stops.

The myth gets stronger as time goes on.

[Howie]

Tracing your Irish roots
Jan 12 2008
by Martin Rigby, Liverpool Echo

MANY Liverpool families are inextricably linked with Irish emigration after thousands of families from the Emerald Isle settled here during the mid-late 19th century.

The reason for the mass emigration was basically poverty, fuelled for the most part by the great potato famine of 1847.

The resulting inflow of population into cities such as Liverpool and Glasgow presented the authorities with huge social problems – living conditions were intolerable with families crammed into the courts and cellars of the city centres, and all living alongside the horrendous realities of poor public sanitation, disease and infant mortality.

Searching for Irish ancestral links can present problems, though not always insurmountable ones. Irish genealogy is a complex subject but to start with here is some general information:

One of the first points of research for the family historian is usually the Census returns, but unfortunately, the Irish returns from 1821-1851 were mostly destroyed in a blaze in Dublin in 1922. The 1861 and 1871 returns were destroyed soon after they were made, while the Censuses for 1881 and 1891 were lost during World War I. So all in all, the Irish census returns are not a great basis on which to start your research!

Fragments of some of the surviving returns from 1821 and 1831 are available at the National Archives of Ireland and at the Public Record Office of Northern Ireland in Belfast which contains the surviving Fermanagh returns. The records for County Derry are the only ones that survive for 1831 and can be accessed at both the Dublin and Belfast archives. Fragments of later censuses also survive, including the 1851 returns for most of Antrim.

Twentieth century returns – for 1901 and 1911 – are available and are now being made available on-line by the National Archives of Ireland at www.census.nationalarchives.ie

As far as Liverpool research is concerned, if you have Irish ancestors who lived in the city in the 19th century, you will of course find them listed in the English Census.

When you find an ancestor, look at ALL the Census returns available, for although mostly the place of birth is listed as simply ‘Ireland’, some will go into more detail, listing the actual place.

There are many Irish town directories which can be used in the hunt for your ancestors and these can provide a valuable substitute for the Census returns.

There is an excellent website by Jo McCann and Marie McQuade called Irish Family History Research in the Liverpool Area at http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb....cords/iril.htm which goes into detail about the types of records available for Irish family history research.

Another useful starting point is the Emerald Ancestors website: www.emeraldancestors.com

This provides access to one of the largest collections of Irish genealogy records available. It specialises in Northern Ireland genealogy and has a database containing birth, marriage, death, and census records for more than one million Irish Ancestors in Counties Antrim, Armagh, Down, Fermanagh, Londonderry and Tyrone.

For a good overview of Irish family history a new book by Anthony Adolph: Tracing Your Irish Family History is well worth reading. It is published by HarperCollins and gives a very readable overview of solutions to problems facing the genealogist.

See Picture Archive Page 32

Useful links and addresses

National Archives of Ireland: Bishop Street, Dublin 8, Ireland. www.nationalarchives.ie/genealogy/index.html

Public Record Office of Northern Ireland (PRONI) 66, Balmoral Avenue, Belfast BT9 6NY. www.proni.gov.uk

www.irishorigins.com is a pay-per-view site includes lots of useful data including an index of the heads of household in Dublin from the 1851 Census.

Eneclann (www.eneclann.ie) offers a number of family history CDs for sale and is a useful site from which to explore further your Irish ancestry.

www.myirishancestry.com includes an extensive database of records, including the Griffiths Valuation of the mid-nineteenth century – an invaluable substitute for the missing census returns.

Source: Liverpool Echo

[PhilipG]

All new to me. I knew no one who engaged in Irish traditions, dancing and the likes. I have Irish in me and we never did any of that. I'm sure those of Irish parents may have done those sort of things, I never any. Once a generation passes the connection is lost and all that stops.

The myth gets stronger as time goes on.

We did have the Irish Centre for years, of course, and the RC Cathedral is "Paddy's Wigwam", after all.
There are a lot of 'Irish' pubs in Liverpool, and a lot of them have been newly created in the past few years, so the Irish element is still very strong in Liverpool.

[Waterways]

We did have the Irish Centre for years, of course,

Which is not that big and caters mainly for people who were born in Ireland.

and the RC Cathedral is "Paddy's Wigwam",

I head that said on the TV an dread it, but I never heard anyone actually say that. Another myth that gets blown up. Like we all said "whack". I never once heard anyone ever say that. I was born and brought up in L8.

after all.
There are a lot of 'Irish' pubs in Liverpool, and a lot of them have been newly created in the past few years, so the Irish element is still very strong in Liverpool.

Irish pubs. Some recent themed Irish pubs you mean, which could be in Munich or Nottingham or wherever, with the obligatory diddly-dee band and harps on the wall. I knew of a pub in Windsor St nicknamed the Irish House. No Irish went there, they did in the 1800s and then melted in like everyone else.

[Gnomie]

All new to me. I knew no one who engaged in Irish traditions, dancing and the likes. I have Irish in me and we never did any of that. I'm sure those of Irish parents may have done those sort of things, I never any. Once a generation passes the connection is lost and all that stops.

The myth gets stronger as time goes on.

HAPPY THREAD is written at the start. this thread is for people who enjoy Irish culture.

Why do you have to keep having a go? explain it?

you really do have a problem dont you.

Everyone should ignore every post he makes here.

THIS IS A HAPPY IRISH THREAD. FOR PEOPLE WHO ENJOY IRISH CULTURE
NOT A PLACE TO INSULT THE IRISH. IS IT SO HARD TO GET YOUR HEAD AROUND

I tried to keep this peaceful by opening these threads for Irish, Welsh and Scottish.

Sadly as you see this fool is coming here to stir it up again.

Am i right or wrong. you decide

[Howie]

Irish pubs. Some recent themed Irish pubs you mean, which could be in Munich or Nottingham or wherever, with the obligatory diddly-dee band and harps on the wall. I knew of a pub in Windsor St nicknamed the Irish House. No Irish went there, they did in the 1800s and then melted in like everyone else.

I was in the Dart and Shamrock (corner of Kempston St. and Gildart St.) last night and there were a lot of Irish drinking in there.

[Waterways]

HAPPY THREAD is written at the start. this thread is for people who enjoy Irish culture.

Why do you have to keep having a go?

I am not having a go. I am saying it as it is. I never knew any Welsh who did Welsh things either. Even the Jews did the same as us - the only difference was that their Sunday was on Saturday for those went to church/synagogue.

Liverpool developed its own culture out of the different contributors of which none stood out in the culture. The only outward sign of influence is in the accent which is heavily Welsh influenced, by even rising in pitch at the end of a sentence. And Scouse ...which is from Scandinavia.

[Howie]

It is inevitable that all the various waves of immigration to this city have had some influence upon its cultural development. However, can we please restrict this thread to discussion of the Irish experience. Thank you.

Howie (Moderator)

[Howie]

• Institute of Irish Studies
  
• James Larkin Republican Flute Band
  
• Liverpool Irish Festival
  
• St. Michael's Irish Centre

Remember forum rule 2 - Try to stay on topic!

[Gnomie]

It is inevitable that all the various waves of immigration to this city have had some influence upon its cultural development. However, can we please restrict this thread to discussion of the Irish experience. Thank you.

Howie (Moderator)

Nice one Howie

The thread is for Irish culture, A Happy Thread.

If you want a negative Irish Thread then start one elsewhere.

I loike the way them Oirish say you big EEjit

Please keep it to the thread from now on.