Wirral Part of Liverpool's City Map?

[Kev]

AS PART of our Liverpool Map campaign, today we ask one of the most controversial questions of all – is Wirral part of the city’s identity? Should we brick up the Mersey tunnels, or do Wirralian’s deem themselves as Scousers? Read

[Waterways]

AS PART of our Liverpool Map campaign, today we ask one of the most controversial questions of all – is Wirral part of the city’s identity? Should we brick up the Mersey tunnels, or do Wirralian’s deem themselves as Scousers? Read

The Wirral would not exist if Liverpool was not there. Wallasey is a sleeper town for Liverpool - a suburb, just as Bootle and Kirkby are.

Birkenhead was a village until Liverpool Docks came about. Then Wallasey Pool was docked in to create Birkenhead Docks - which were deeper than Liverpool's Docks and very near to Liverpool's centre, as Liverpool's docks were stretching along the river north and south away from the centre.

The Liverpool accent is spoken in Liverpool, Bootle Knowsley and the north part of the Wirral . That gives an indication of how close the Wirral is to Liverpool.

What kept the Wirral from being incorporated into Liverpool was:

1. A river (difficult to cross as it is wide)
2. Counties (Liverpool in Lancashire and the Wirral Cheshire - city did not cross county boundaries)

The transport infrastructure is now excellent with an underground rail system incorporating Wirral to Liverpool and two road tunnels. If the Mersey Barrage goes ahead then there is another transport crossing linking the two sides of the river and bringing the two even closer.

Many families are split between the two sides of the river. Everton FC have 1/3 of their season ticket holders with Wirral post codes.

It is clear the Wirral should be incorporated within the city. Council offices could be split between the two sides of the river with new offices on Birkenhead docks to ensure the Wirral residents they are not under some sort of domination from the big city opposite. A new town hall maybe on the the Liverpool waterfront.

The Wirral has a lot to gain by being a part of a world famous city. Then maybe the river front will be developed being a part of Liverpool planning Dept - their riverline is boring. Come to that, how many buildings on the Wirral stand out?

The Wirral is clearly in the Liverpool socio/economic sphere and always has been. About time they came in from the cold.

[Kev]

Love the post WW

[ChrisGeorge]

Hi Waterways

I agree with Kev that your post is excellent: meaty and informative.

Chris

[Kev]

In addition, many Wirralites, when asked where they live when overseas, often say 'Liverpool'.

[Devo]

This Quote in the Daily Post about the play "Brick up the Mersey Tunnels" made me chuckle

The play was sparked off by a woman who wrote to the Liverpool Echo from Wirral, complaining about the Scouse accent and how it lets down the city that has been chosen as Capital of Culture.

“She worked in Liverpool and used the city when it suited her but, like many others, distanced herself from it.

I bet if she was on holiday and was asked where she was from, she would say she's from Liverpool....

I was once asked "where does the Mersey Ferry go?"
My reply was "To where the Posh Scousers live!"

I know the Wirral is connected to Liverpool by the Ferry, and the rail & road Tunnels, but it is still not Liverpool.
But just what are the City Limits? St Helens is said to be in Merseyside but is much futher away than Birkenhead, even the home of the Grand national horserace is futher away, and Southport futher still. If it is to be a map of "Greater Merseyside" then yes it should get a mention, but if it is going to be a city centre map then most definetly not!

[jonnyb1978]

I live in Liverpool but born and bred in Wirral. I am not a scouser i am from Wirral. I have nothing against Liverpool but i wish to keep my roots. My brother lives in Scotland and when i go up there and talk to people asking where im from. Either i say Wirral and get the reply "Oh the posh area of Liverpool" or i will say Liverpool as not many people have heard of the Wirral, especially the younger generation. So i have to explain that its really over the water from Liverpool. This is very so annoying!

I dont think people are really that bothered what they class it as. I have a lot of scouse mates at work who say wirral people are just scouse wannabe's.
My view is that is very far away from the truth.

The golf open last year was plugged by a lot of companies advertising the Open golf at Hoylake, Liverpool. I understand why as its good marketing but its not in Liverpool so Liverpool was taking advantage of the Wirrals status on that occasion
This will obviously always be the case as the Wirral wants to establish itself and grow and will use the bigger cities name to improve its credibility.

Now im older and wiser i now realise why my old boss used to get so peeved when i called him a cockney when he was from Tunbidge wells.

I dont really care what it called, part of, counties etc. I will always be from the Wirral near Liverpool. And i can also see why my Mum wont put Merseyside on her address as she was born and brought up when it was Cheshire.
But the most important is we all get along as one community without all the silly rivalry.

[marky]

^^^ Re: Open Golf, Hoylake

Quote: "I understand why as its good marketing but its not in Liverpool so Liverpool was taking advantage of the Wirrals status on that occasion"

I thought the advertising situation was the exact opposite...Hoylake kept getting mentioned, with the name Liverpool being ommited, many times, by the media. The golf club is called "Royal Liverpool Golf Club"
http://www.royal-liverpool-golf.com/
I personally don't know anyone, on either side of the River Mersey, who regards Wirral as part of Liverpool.

[PhilipG]

I lived in Bromborough in the late 1950s, and Liverpool was somewhere else, over the water, and in a different county.
In fact, Chester seemed as near as Liverpool.
Obviously, Birkenhead and Wallasey are nearer Liverpool, but the river is an effective boundary.

[Ged]

Take a look at this lengthy discussion.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=536689

I hope Kev doesn't mind me blaspheming by putting this on and can remove it if he wants but I think it is very relevant and many issues are discussed.

I sense the Wirralites feel patronised somewhat as they did exist and do have their own identity without Liverpool and as such Birkenhead was not contrived as a newtown overflow like Kirkby or Skem.

I think it is fantastic that we can compliment each other in our nearness.

[Waterways]

I sense the Wirralites feel patronised somewhat as they did exist and do have their own identity without Liverpool and as such Birkenhead was not contrived as a newtown overflow like Kirkby or Skem.

Ged, You have it wrong. The Wirral is tied to Liverpool whether anyone thinks so or not. Its identity is latched to Liverpool. It does NOT have a clear identity of its own. It is in the same socio-economic sphere of Liverpool. The Wirral IS an overspill of Liverpool and has been since Birkenhead Docks were built. Wallasey is clearly a sleeper town of Liverpool.

Communications between both sides of the river are excellent and may be improved if the Mersey barrage goes ahead.

Wirralites pretending the Wirral has a clear entity in its own right are kidding themselves.

The Wirral should all be incorporated within Liverpool as a city state. Both sides of the river then benefit greatly.

[Steven]

We built the Mersey tunnel lads,

way back in 33.

Dug a hole in the ground,

until we found a hole called Wallasey.


I put in for that job but I couldn't get a skip ...

[Ged]

It's not me that has it wrong John, don't shoot the messenger, i'm telling you what Wirralites think on that discussion. Try telling the monks of Birkenhead who started the ferry that they didn't exist all those years ago in spite of Liverppool not because of it. However, you are right that both benefit from each other like I said in my earlier post.

[Waterways]

It's not me that has it wrong John, don't shoot the messenger, i'm telling you what Wirralites think on that discussion. Try telling the monks of Birkenhead who started the ferry that they didn't exist all those years ago in spite of Liverppool not because of it. However, you are right that both benefit from each other like I said in my earlier post.

Ged, the Wirral existed and still does. If Liverpool was not there it would resemble the North Wales coast on the other side of the River Dee - empty and full of fields. In its current form it is a defacto suburb of Liverpool, whether they think so or not. They need a dose of reality.

[Ged]

I too believe this, but for the natural seperation by the river (take that out of the equation), then Birkenhead could be seen as adjoining Toxteth/Dingle and Seacombe could be adjoining Vauxhall. Those districts for instance are nearer the Liver Buildings than say Kirkdale or Kensington. They do however, as you know have their own dock system utilising/operating many services like Stanlow, Irish crossings and ship building. There is a huge argument on that thread about Liverpool council and where money is/isn't or would be/wouldn't be directed and about Wirralite using the tunnel for jobs over here but then disowning the place when questioned about it. Liverpool is a world brand name that they should want to be associated with but a lot of them don't like that one bit.