Julia Wallace Murder Case

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Originally Posted by DaisyChains

I understand what you mean AP, but I personally would like to go to Kew to research.
I just think you would have a great sense of achievement and a fantastic feeling holding certain documents in your hands.

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Exactly. Not trying to put you off at all. Go for it mate, just allow yourself a couple of days minimum. I think there are three big files down there. You can check for yourself online and pre-reserve them afore ye visit.

Thanks for that but I'd rather get them first hand.
I agree totally with you DC. I actually have copies of one of the boxes so I won't have to copy that one. I have a digital camera and if I have to, I'll make several visits!

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Originally Posted by Mark R

Thanks for that but I'd rather get them first hand.
I agree totally with you DC. I actually have copies of one of the boxes so I won't have to copy that one. I have a digital camera and if I have to, I'll make several visits!

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It might sound weird, but I think to write a book on a murder case of such high standing as Wallace, you have to sort of make your own journey to get to a conclusion.

I just bought that Wallace book you recommended Mark a few posts back. Ta for the tip.:)

Have you contacted the people who live in the Wallace house?
Have you been inside?

Couldn't agree more DaisyChains.
What book did you get?
Yes, I wrote two different letters to 29 Wolverton Street (some months ago); one came back as 'not at this address' and the other was unanswered. Guess the owners want their privacy.

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Originally Posted by Mark R

Couldn't agree more DaisyChains.
What book did you get?
Yes, I wrote two different letters to 29 Wolverton Street (some months ago)
one came back as 'not at this address' and the other I didn't receive a reply. Guess the owners want their privacy.

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Wallace: The Final Verdict I bought off Amazon..... looking forward to it.
I had a little look at the house a few weeks ago on a rainy saturday afternoon. Just drove down the street and hovered and back again. I was looking at the kids playing in the street and just thinking they probably had no idea what history that street holds.
It's a shame the residents won't respond. If it was me living there, I would be made up for people to take an interest in where I lived.
Must be spooky living there when you know all the details though!

type in 29 wolverton street into google.co.uk and have a look at the 5th result!:)

Glad you got a copy of Wilkes' Final Verdict. I think it is an excellent book. Some of the illustrations are fantastic. I wrote to Roger a few months ago and he wrote an interesting (and kind) reply.
Yes, it was Kevin Firth I wrote to (which came back as 'not at this address'). I think the second letter I wrote was to the current occupant Julie... something or other (not Julia!). Yes, I have to admit, I would live there (would be quite weird though).
Wolverton Street had had a tragic history even before the Wallace murder. By 1930 there had been 5 deaths concerning its residents: 3 suicides, plus one resident had died at a football match and one fell to his death from the Great Orme in Llandudno. I know my mother always told me that my grandmother said that Wolverton Street was always an eerie street, and that you would never see a front door open. Suppose this could have been down to the Anfield Housebreaker though...

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Originally Posted by Mark R

Glad you got a copy of Wilkes' Final Verdict. I think it is an excellent book. Some of the illustrations are fantastic. I wrote to Roger a few months ago and he wrote an interesting (and kind) reply.
Yes, it was Kevin Firth I wrote to (which came back as 'not at this address'). I think the second letter I wrote was to the current occupant Julie... something or other (not Julia!). Yes, I have to admit, I would live there (would be quite weird though).
Wolverton Street had had a tragic history even before the Wallace murder. By 1930 there had been 5 deaths concerning its residents: 3 suicides, plus one resident had died at a football match and one fell to his death from the Great Orme in Llandudno. I know my mother always told me that my grandmother said that Wolverton Street was always an eerie street, and that you would never see a front door open. Suppose this could have been down to the Anfield Housebreaker though...

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ooohhh i didn't know the history of the house. That's very spooky!
This is why your book will be grand! hehe:) Plus you have relatives who have lived around that area and you have yourself, always the best position to be in i think

It's true that Wolverton st was always very quiet and some might say it was an eerie street. I'd heard about those other deaths and we used to say that maybe it was an unlucky road.

I enjoyed my childhood there though, and I wish I still lived in that street today as it is clean with well kept houses and still quiet. It is one of the nicer streets in Anfield. The surrounding area is deteriorating rapidly, but Wolverton street has remained as nice as it always was - away from the noisy main roads and shops - and as it is tucked away only people who live there go in and out.

I wouldn't live in no 29 though - no way !!
The houses on that side were a tad smaller the ones on our side. Our side had bigger back yards and bigger kitchens. :)

we looked over to the Wallace house. I lived there for 14 years.



Mark, do any of your family remember the big house at the far end ? The Campbells lived there since at least the 1920's until late 60s/early70's and they held dance classes there, also ballroom dancing evenings - my grandmother used to tell me about it.

The dances had stopped by the time I was growing up there but the family remained living there. I think it must have been early 1970's when the place was demolished. (there are new house there now on the site - Richmond Park - was the front of the house with the drive way, and the ones at the back - Redcar Mews - are where the back gardens of the house used to be.)
What a shame it was pulled down. It was a fine big house like the villas in Breckside park. I wish we had taken some photos of it - - but you didn't bother in those days. :rolleyes:
In fact, I wish we'd taken more photos of the whole street. I only have two photos of the street with my mum and cousin on them ( so I won't post them) :ninja:

I have searched high and low on the net for any old pics or info on the place but I've never found anything.
Mark, ask any older members of your family if they remember it.
I'd love to see a picture of it.

I wonder if Mr & Mrs Wallace ever went there for ballroom dancing :)

When we were kids we made a den in the bushes at the side of the house .. Mr & Mrs Campbell would chase any kids who wandered up their driveway .. but we used to sneak over the wall which divided it from our street. We would take butties and a bottle of lemmo and hide in our den undetected :)
I have very fond memories of Wolverton st.

ps,

the bit about the doors never being open - is probably true.
The street was what you might call rather staid, even in later years when we lived there. Neighbours didn't leave their doors open and you seldom seen them chatting on the steps. it was more likely to be a passing ''good morning'' and that was that :)
We kids did play out in the street but the neighbours didn't mix a lot.

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Originally Posted by lindylou

It's true that Wolverton st was always very quiet and some might say it was an eerie street. I'd heard about those other deaths and we used to say that maybe it was an unlucky road.

I enjoyed my childhood there though, and I wish I still lived in that street today as it is clean with well kept houses and still quiet. It is one of the nicer streets in Anfield. The surrounding area is deteriorating rapidly, but Wolverton street has remained as nice as it always was - away from the noisy main roads and shops - and as it is tucked away only people who live there go in and out.

I wouldn't live in no 29 though - no way !!
The houses on that side were a tad smaller the ones on our side. Our side had bigger back yards and bigger kitchens. :)

we looked over to the Wallace house. I lived there for 14 years.



Mark, do any of your family remember the big house at the far end ? The Campbells lived there since at least the 1920's until late 60s/early70's and they held dance classes there, also ballroom dancing evenings - my grandmother used to tell me about it.

The dances had stopped by the time I was growing up there but the family remained living there. I think it must have been early 1970's when the place was demolished. (there are new house there now on the site - Redcar Mews.)
What a shame it was pulled down. It was a fine big house like the villas in Breckside park. I wish we had taken some photos of it - - but you didn't bother in those days. :rolleyes:
In fact, I wish we'd taken more photos of the whole street. I only have two photos of the street with my mum and cousin on them ( so I won't post them) :ninja:

I have searched high and low on the net for any old pics or info on the place but I've never found anything.
Mark, ask any older members of your family if they remember it.
I'd love to see a picture of it.

I wonder if Mr & Mrs Wallace ever went there for ballroom dancing :)

When we were kids we made a den in the bushes at the side of the house .. Mr & Mrs Campbell would chase any kids who wandered up their driveway .. but we used to sneak over the wall which divided it from our street. We would take butties and a bottle of lemmo and hide in our den undetected :)
I have very fond memories of Wolverton st.

ps,

the bit about the doors never being open - is probably true.
The street was what you might call rather staid, even in later years when we lived there. Neighbours didn't leave their doors open and you seldom seen them chatting on the steps. it was more like a passing ''good morning'' and that was that :)
We kids did play out in the street but the neighbours didn't mix a lot.

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Fascinating stuff Lindy!:)

Hi lindylou

Excellent memories of your growing up in the street. I don't remember Campbell's but I think you're right regarding it being demolished in the 1970's. I have heard of it during the case (Campbell's Dance Hall) and I think I have a photo somewhere (looking up Wolverton Street from the other end and a good distance from the house itself though). There is what looks like a large house at the cul-de-sac end. I am assuming it is that...
Yes, it is a nice street irrespective of its history. Yes, you can almost hear yourself think there.

I traced where the Telephone Exchange (from where the phone-call from Box 1627 was recorded). It was on Richmond Street (off Breck Road) but sadly the building has been demolished.

That will be Richmond terrace (rather than street) off Breck rd. :)

Yes, the big house was at the cul-de-sac end. (Although officially it wasn't a cul-de-sac as you could walk throught the alley into Richmond Park. No traffic could pass through it though.
It was the grounds of the house that separated it from Wolverton and made the street a dead end (excuse the pun):unibrow:


I'm surprised that I could never find anything about Campbells Dance Hall on the internet - you'd think it would be listed somewhere!


I remember me and my mate telling two lads that we were sisters and we lived there in that big house :D :D .. when they walked us home we told them they had to leave us at the drive way 'cos our dad was so strict he would chase them if he saw them -ha! We pretended to walk down to 'our' front door but we hid at the back until the lads had gone :smirk:

I only saw a bit of the interior of the house when it was left empty.
The hallway had typical Victorian style tiled floor and a sweeping staircase if my memory serves me correctly.
There was a games room in there with a snooker table.

Oh, if only I'd taken pictures:rolleyes::(

Yes, Richmond Terrace. I think it was numbered 5 and on the left on entering (from Breck Road end).

Hi Mark good luck with the research and like the others I look forward to reading your results.
If at all possible could you post the actual telephone conversation between Qualtrough and Beattie as it appears in Beatties' statement please.
I understand if you don't want to due to your ongoing research.

Hi All if anyone is interested I am selling two studies in crime and Murderer Scott-Free send me a message if you are interested

Hi Steve,

Yes, I'll try and get the statement up here. There are actually two statements made by Beattie.

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Originally Posted by Mark R

Hi Steve,

Yes, I'll try and get the statement up here. There are actually two statements made by Beattie.

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Hi Mark,

Are you working with Slemen on this ? And have you contacted any publishers to see if there's any interest in putting out another Wallace book ?

AP.

No, I'm not working with Slemen. I'm doing it single handed. I'm awaiting responses from publishers I've wrote to.

Out of all the photographs connected with the Wallace Case this is my favourite. Taken in 1969 in conjunction with the publishing of Jonathan Goodman's classic The Killing of Julia Wallace. It shows (from l to r); Hector Munro (Wallace's solicitor), Jonathan Goodman, Dr Robert Coope (Honorary Assistant Physician to the Liverpool Royal Infirmary and Lecturer in Clinical Chemistry and Acting Demonstrator in Medical Pathology at the University of Liverpool in 1931) and James Henry Dible (Professor of Pathology at Liverpool University at the time of the Wallace Case).
The photo would have been greatly enhanced by the presence of Wallace's Junior Defence Counsel Sydney Scholefield Allen but he was unable to attend the press conference due to ill health.

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Originally Posted by Mark R

Out of all the photographs connected with the Wallace Case this is my favourite. Taken in 1969 in conjunction with the publishing of Jonathan Goodman's classic The Killing of Julia Wallace. It shows (from l to r); Hector Munro (Wallace's solicitor), Jonathan Goodman, Dr Robert Coope (Honorary Assistant Physician to the Liverpool Royal Infirmary and Lecturer in Clinical Chemistry and Acting Demonstrator in Medical Pathology at the University of Liverpool in 1931) and James Henry Dible (Professor of Pathology at Liverpool University at the time of the Wallace Case).
The photo would have been greatly enhanced by the presence of Wallace's Junior Defence Counsel Sydney Scholefield Allen but he was unable to attend the press conference due to ill health.

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A brilliant piece of historical photography!
I am sure there is alot of scope for another Wallace book
When was the last one published?

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Originally Posted by Mark R

No, I'm not working with Slemen. I'm doing it single handed. I'm awaiting responses from publishers I've wrote to.

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Hope all things go well for you Mark. :)

Thanks lindylou

DS. The last full-length study on the Wallace Case was James Murphy'sThe Murder of Julia Wallace (published by Bluecoat Press in 2001). The previous one to that was The Insurance Man by Richard Waterhouse and published in 1994. Both books were paperback.

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Originally Posted by Mark R

Thanks lindylou

DS. The last full-length study on the Wallace Case was James Murphy'sThe Murder of Julia Wallace (published by Bluecoat Press in 2001). The previous one to that was The Insurance Man by Richard Waterhouse and published in 1994. Both books were paperback.

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Brilliant stuff.
I think there is definitely an opening in the market for another book, there are little things you will probably pick up on the way and your own perspectives on things.

I think so too. It could be a long laborious trek though...Goodman took three years to write his book and Murphy, seven I believe. Now I know why. I've been at it two years now!

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Originally Posted by Mark R

I think so too. It could be a long laborious trek though...Goodman took three years to write his book and Murphy, seven I believe. Now I know why. I've been at it two years now!

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Don't fret! All good works take time!
If there's any help you need, just ask!

Thanks DaisyChains

Will do!

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Originally Posted by SteH

I've read that book Ged, really enjoyable. Am I right in remembering that Murray concluded by saying Wallace was the murderer and had got the timing absolutely spot on, discrediting the evidence of a milk or paper boy by saying he could have misread the clock when saying what time he had seen Julia alive.

The man From the Pru was released on video in USA but doesnt appear to have been done so here.

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Hi all,

I am a newbie on the block and feeling my way around and noticed this subject.

My parents rented a council house in Agar Road, West Derby, Liverpool 11 in 1923 when I was born.
As a small boy I remember there were times when my Mum did not have enough to pay the rent or other commitments collected at the door. We would all go into the back room when a collector knocked on the door and lie on the floor hiding behind the sofa!

One of those collectors was in fact a Mr. Wallace from the Prudential Insurance Company and sometimes he would peer through the back window to see if we were there! Scary! I seem to remember that he looked very much like Neville Chamberlain. Later my parents used to talk about him as the murderer - all a bit scary.

So for what it is worth you heard it from someone who was involved in a small way with him.

Cheers

Ken

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Originally Posted by Royal Navy Medic

Hi all,

I am a newbie on the block and feeling my way around and noticed this subject.

My parents rented a council house in Agar Road, West Derby, Liverpool 11 in 1923 when I was born.
As a small boy I remember there were times when my Mum did not have enough to pay the rent or other commitments collected at the door. We would all go into the back room when a collector knocked on the door and lie on the floor hiding behind the sofa!

One of those collectors was in fact a Mr. Wallace from the Prudential Insurance Company and sometimes he would peer through the back window to see if we were there! Scary! I seem to remember that he looked very much like Neville Chamberlain. Later my parents used to talk about him as the murderer - all a bit scary.

So for what it is worth you heard it from someone who was involved in a small way with him.

Cheers

Ken

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wow!
that's an amazing bit of info ken!
I am sure Mark will be pleased with that!:)

Hi Ken,

Interesting reading your comments regarding Wallace. My great aunt used to say that Wallace was guilty. When he was arrested (and convicted) she would say; "I always knew there was something about him - he always had cold hands when I paid him" (Forget that it could have been the middle of winter!!).

Regards

Mark

Hi Mark,

Just want to wish you all success in your research for another possible book on the Wallace subject.

I know that anyone who is a fan of Laurel and Hardy is sure to succeed and right now, I am having a little chuckle as I visualize these two master of comedy bringing that piano down all those stairs!

But what about the demolition of their car?

Good luck and good fortune

Ken

Hi Ken

Thanks for your kind words. Yes, Laurel & Hardy with the piano reminds me of something that occured here in the U.K. some months ago. A company was delivering a piano and, you've guessed it, the deliverymen dropped it causing considerable damage. The piano was only a Bosendorfer and cost £45,000!! Needless to say, the media compared it to The Music Box!!

Busy Bodies is another favourite where they accidentally saw their car in half in the saw mill!

Regards

Mark

The Post Office on Allerton Road. WHW went into the shop to look at a directory, but they didn't have one.

Keep plugging away Mark, you'll get there and just as I eagerly await PhilipG's cinema book which I hope he will persue, so I do with yours too.

ps. My fave L&H film (though I don't think they made a bad one) is Sons of the desert. How to get caught out or what!

Hi Ged
Thanks for your kind words.
Yes, I've always been a big fan of L&H. Like you say, I don't think they made a bad film. I agree that Sons Of The Desert is probably their best feature (Blockheads is excellent though). I also like the short Busy Bodies.
Another of my favourite comedians is Will Hay.

Regards

Mark

I have all the L&H too. I'm not particularly that fond of the silents though you can see how they progressed and some were remade when talkines came in. You can also see that the likes of Russ Abbott, the two Ronnies and Morecambe & Wise have 'borrowed' parts of the L&H act for their sketches such were their class. I like them all that you've mentioned as well as Brats, Helpmates, County Hospital, Dirty work and Our relations. My wifes fave is Fra Diavlo, the bandit one. http://www.laurel-and-hardy.com/index.html

Sorry it's off topic.

For anyone researching the Wallace case these may help.
As most know he was taken to Anfield Rd police Stn and his trial
was in St Georges Hall Crown Court, found guilty sentenced to hang
but freed on appeal, went back to work but due to ILL health moved
to the wirral and he died in Clatterbridge Hospital. Buried in Anfield Cem
along with Julia.

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o...4/jwallace.jpg

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o...4/wwallace.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o...4/walgrave.jpg

Saw this in a local brochure - (I'll definitely be going to this):

Hi Mark,

Here is a scoop for you, for your upcoming book.

My Dad was a policeman and I mention this in my Trilogy.
He was stationed at ANFIELD! He was of course there when the Wallace case was on and although he never spoke about the case to me or my sisters, I now remember that my Mother mentioned something to me about my father being involved with the arrest of Mr. Wallace!

I have a rare photo from my archives that shows the full complement of the Anfield Police station during the Wallace period. My now long gone Dad is on the right in the back row and, as a mobile cop on a bike did not wear the normal Bobbies helmet but a peaked cap,.

You can use this in your book if you wish with my permission and a credit as is usual but I cannot understand the protocol for attaching it to this note as it asks for the picture URL and not the file name, strange!

Can yiou help?

Good Luck

Ken Williams

Ken
put it on photobucket and use the IMG tag ie copy and paste the tag
into your message. Did you like my photo of the headstone in Anfied ?
It is free to use as long as credit is given

Hi Ken,

That is very interesting. Yes it would be great to include the photo (I would of course give full credit). I take it your Dad's surname was Williams? Any relation to Fred Williams (the first policeman at the Wallace house on the murder evening)? Did your Dad live in the Anfield area?

Regards

Mark

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Originally Posted by Mark R

Saw this in a local brochure - (I'll definitely be going to this):

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hiya mark

when is this?

Fri, sat and sun of the coming week - see a seperate thread on the big history festival.