Liverpool Waterloo Tunnel Update 10th Feb 2008

Thanks for those links Ged.Very interesting indeed !

As a country-dweller, I couldn't survive in a city such as Liverpool,in fact I wonder how anyone can !The wealthier members of society who prefer to live in leafier surroundings will continue commuting and for this reason improved links to the Liverpool hinterland are essential and probavly more important than any inner-city project. Extentions to the Merseyrail electric network could result in thousands of cars being left in the garage,something that inner-city improvements would not provide.

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Originally Posted by Waterways

I always wondered how they were going to get to the airport, as Garston Docks and Grassendale are in the way. Also when you leave the docks, the monorail will parallel the Northern Line. They could go up Jericho Lane and down Aigburth Rd - where people live.

I think this is just wish list from Peel - to get the scheme noticed.

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I do not know the area well, despite having used John Lennon Airport regularly. Would it not be possible to run tram-trains from the airport to Liverpool Central with a link at Cressington Jnc ? Perhaps recent urban developement in the Garston area exclude this possibilty.

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Originally Posted by Ged

Remember this

http://videos.icnetwork.co.uk/iclive...ntralDocks.wmv

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Nice Ged. There wasn't much water, just a canal. They even have West Waterloo Dock filled in here, just under the helicopter. The locals are fighting it...again!!!

http://i25.tinypic.com/e665wy.jpg

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Originally Posted by andyk

Thanks for those links Ged.Very interesting indeed !

As a country-dweller, I couldn't survive in a city such as Liverpool,in fact I wonder how anyone can !The wealthier members of society who prefer to live in leafier surroundings will continue commuting and for this reason improved links to the Liverpool hinterland are essential and probavly more important than any inner-city project. Extentions to the Merseyrail electric network could result in thousands of cars being left in the garage,something that inner-city improvements would not provide.

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I disagree. As transport communications became better, the wealthy moved to the outskirts deserting the city. The city then became a rather working class place with wealth on the rims. The road tunnels did no good to the city as the wealthy could drive to villages in the Wirral, so more moved out.

Best do what Ken Livingstone is doing with London. Fed up with people who live in Surrey being given excellent transports links and the inner cities ignored, he went to improve the quality of life for those living in London. The right way to go.

Liverpool should do the same. Concentrate on the city centre and inner cities and work out. Get the wealthy back in the city, instead of just being their work place.

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Get the wealthy back in the city, instead of just being their work place

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You show me somewhere in Liverpool City Centre that offers as much land and garden as say Fulwood Park or Sandfield Park and we'll all move back to Liverpool like a shot.

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Originally Posted by Nightowl

You show me somewhere in Liverpool City Centre that offers as much land and garden as say Fulwood Park or Sandfield Park and we'll all move back to Liverpool like a shot.

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You assume a garden is the prime criteria. A well laid out large flat with superb views would suit many people, in or near the centre. Many squares in London, as they were in Liverpool, have gardens in the centre of the squares for the residents.

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Originally Posted by Waterways

You assume a garden is the prime criteria. A well laid out large flat with superb views would suit many people, in or near the centre. Many squares in London, as they were in Liverpool, have gardens in the centre of the squares for the residents.

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I agree - I have no reason to want a garden that I have to maintain.

A reasonable balcony (from a decent sized flat/apartment) is quite ample for myself, having public greenery is just a bonus.

Of course everyone is different, and I appreciate those with children may want a garden etc.

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Originally Posted by robt

I agree - I have no reason to want a garden that I have to maintain.

A reasonable balcony (from a decent sized flat/apartment) is quite ample for myself, having public greenery is just a bonus.

Of course everyone is different, and I appreciate those with children may want a garden etc.

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Our population is getting older and more people are living alone via divorces, etc. Many of these people are not poor and want suitable accommodation. The centre beckons.

Each to their own naturally but as Liverpool expanded, the Gentry moved out where they had cleaner air and parks and gardens.

I prefer the suburbs over the city. I don't have children but I'd still like a garden. You can't just expect people to move into the city because of all these modern developments. If people like myself want to stay in a leafy area then so be it.
One of the points I've been trying to make is that it is us suburbanites who have rubbish public transport links into town, whereas people in the inner city can get different buses taking them to different parts of the city, where there's a bus stop on every street. It is us suburbanites who have to travel the furthest and if we do not study or work near Central or Moorfields then we may have a fair walk. In this respect, I can understand why many choose to travel by car. Hence, my aims to improve the suburban public transport system.

Suburbanites tend to shun public transport in favour of cars. They want it ti commute but not for anything else.

In highly populated city centre and inner city areas they may use public transport for everyday needs.

Harder to justify lines to the outer parts, when they only use them to go to work.

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Originally Posted by jc_everton

Good stuff. Of course it is important to not lose focus, but what I write on this board does not necessarily mean it is in my dissertation! For instance, the 'hanging railway' was a bit of light-hearted fun. There's no way that'd happen in Liverpool in a million years!
The only focus I am losing is spending too much time online! But my main aim was to look at areas of poor access to rail, NOT just Liverpool city centre - which is why I frequently include suburban areas in my posts - important to not forget about these as public transport is less frequent and less reliable the further you go from a city centre. We can't forget how thousands of commuters travel into the city centre every day and these are invaluable to the economy of the city (some might say they are more important because they are likely to be wealthier and more economically active). This is my focus, so whilst I take your advice into account, my aim is not to improve Liverpool - it is to consider all of Merseyside. Being a suburban commuter myself, I of course want to see better services into Liverpool!
And as I work at Sefton Council, I would also love to see the NMB reopen because at present, I must drive. Therefore, get ALL the suburban lines reopened ASAP because not EVERYONE travels into Liverpool. Important to not lose focus of that too.

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I have to say I agree completely, and it is what I was driving at with my suggestions of running the WCML through Wapping to the waterfront and electrification of the City Line. All this must be of benefit to the entire city, not just specific districts

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Originally Posted by ChrisO

I have to say I agree completely, and it is what I was driving at with my suggestions of running the WCML through Wapping to the waterfront and electrification of the City Line. All this must be of benefit to the entire city, not just specific districts

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I'm not sure what you mean - do you mean just trains to and from London should run there, or those from places such as Norwich, Birmingham and Yorkshire too ie abandoning Lime Street?

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Originally Posted by Waterways

Suburbanites tend to shun public transport in favour of cars. They want it ti commute but not for anything else.

In highly populated city centre and inner city areas they may use public transport for everyday needs.

Harder to justify lines to the outer parts, when they only use them to go to work.

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How do you know this? I would be what you so affectionately call a suburbanite and if the infrastructure was there, I would use the train rather than cars and not just for work. You seem to have a rather unappealing habit of judging people and their circumstances when you know little about them

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Originally Posted by robt

I'm not sure what you mean - do you mean just trains to and from London should run there, or those from places such as Norwich, Birmingham and Yorkshire too ie abandoning Lime Street?

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Yes, make the place accessible to national, regional and local services. As I said before surely, it must be of benefit to the City.
No, I don't propose the closure of Lime Street, but use Wapping as another outlet to allow people to access services closer to the waterfront such as the Arena, Albert Dock etc. I don't know how feasible it really is, I just think it's a good idea, really