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Thread: "Old Trash" - Phantom Black Dogs around the Formby/Southport area

  1. #16
    Senior Member lindylou's Avatar
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    .. and Spring Heel Jack.


  2. #17
    Senior Member wsteve55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lindylou View Post
    .. and Spring Heel Jack.

  3. #18
    Came fourth...now what? Oudeis's Avatar
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    I have the front to post this just because Lancashire is mentioned early on...

    http://www.forteantimes.com/reviews/...of_bungay.html

  4. #19
    member Trampshipman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by researchwriter View Post
    Trampshipman, thanks for taking the time to share your own local knowledge on the subject.

    It does seem odd that, having been born and raised in the area, you never encountered any local stories about Old Trash (or Guy Trash/Gytrash as mentioned Charlotte Brontë's Jane Eyre). My original source for the tale came from Peter Underwood's 1984 book This Haunted Isle and I came on Yo Liverpool having drawn a blank when searching for further Formby specific material concerning Black Dogs (which, as Fortinian and Oudeis point out, are a long standing staple of British folklore. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_dog_%28ghost%29).

    knowhowe's experience was shocking but not overtly supernatural, so far as I remember him saying. It wasn't until he read my post that he made any connection any local legend. I found no accounts of the legend in Formby pre-dating Underwood's reference but he is generally considered to be a reliable source in matters of folklore and ghostlore (see http://www.peterunderwood.org.uk/index.htm) so I pretty much took him at his word. Checking the entry I see that he may have got his data from a local newspaper sometime in late October... which might explain a thing or two. From the way you describe you're upbringing, it does seem highly unlikely that you would not have heard of such a legend if there was one in the area. Highly unlikely but, I am willing to believe, not entirely impossible.

    merseywail, when I'm writing on matters of folklore, I always do my very best to back everything I'm saying up with as many footnotes and references as possible. I'm always open and honest about where I get my material from and I'm infinitely more interested in the cultural and historical routes of tales rather than turning them into a twist laden yarn. As a result, I kind of resent being lumped in with anyone else who happens to write on similar subjects without you're having actually read my book or any of my articles. I write fiction for a living, I write about local history and folklore as an entirely separate thing.
    Researchwriter,
    Your acknowledgement of my post is greatly appreciated. Actually I had nothing to tell you really, did I ? So....actually I told you nothing if you see what I mean ? Anyhow, thanks for your courtesy in replying. Good luck in your searches.

    Regards,
    Ken.

  5. #20
    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    Hi folks

    Whether the Black Dog really exists or not I don't know but Steve's account is certainly interesting. Of course there is a Meols on the Wirral north shore as well as at Formby. I came across this blog on Wirral Vikings that you might find of interest.

    Chris
    Christopher T. George
    Editor, Ripperologist
    Editor, Loch Raven Review
    http://christophertgeorge.blogspot.com/
    Chris on Flickr and on MySpace

  6. #21

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    I posted a reply but was told I hadn`t logged in - I had, actually - why is everything made so difficult on this site?

  7. #22

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    Well, that`s off my chest. I read John Reppion`s book "800 Years of Haunted Liverpool" and it is excellent. One of the photos (Liver Building) is a bit misleading as only the top section of its two towers are visible behind the Post of Liverpool Building. There were a couple of misprints, but I realise I`m nitpicking! The feature on the Old Necropolis/Grant Gardens interested me - more anon.
    Last edited by ThePenkethPedant; 07-30-2010 at 02:16 AM. Reason: mistyped word

  8. #23

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    The Old Necropolis, corner of Everton Road/West Derby Road, opposite the Hippodrome as was, in the mid-50s was a forest of stone monuments. I have often wondered what happened to all the monuments,tablets,gravestones etc when they were removed and the cemetery became a park. I expect that burial records are in the Central Library archives; the author refers to 80,000 nameless bodies still interred beneath the surface.

  9. #24
    Senior Member wsteve55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThePenkethPedant View Post
    The Old Necropolis, corner of Everton Road/West Derby Road, opposite the Hippodrome as was, in the mid-50s was a forest of stone monuments. I have often wondered what happened to all the monuments,tablets,gravestones etc when they were removed and the cemetery became a park. I expect that burial records are in the Central Library archives; the author refers to 80,000 nameless bodies still interred beneath the surface.
    The Necropolis was closed about 1910,and converted to a public park,Grant gardens,which opened a couple of years later!
    Test drilling around that area,recently,re' the proposed Merseytram route,uncovered human remains,so you can only assume that all remains, weren't removed!

    Pic's courtesy of L.R.O.
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  10. #25
    Senior Member lindylou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThePenkethPedant View Post
    I posted a reply but was told I hadn`t logged in - I had, actually - why is everything made so difficult on this site?

    You probably got timed out PP. It happens quite a lot. Have a read of this thread -

    http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/sho...G-IN...LOG-IN-!!!

  11. #26

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    Thanks -the book states that it was closed in 1895. I don`t think it became a park as early as 1912 - as I said, in the mid-50s it was still a cemetery with all its monuments,albeit maybe closed to further burials. My cheif enquiry is -what happened to the monuments? Nobody seems to know, although I had heard that someone came across some in a Welsh field.....

  12. #27

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    Thank you too, ll - I realised that this was probably the case after I had had my moan -still annoying though!

  13. #28
    Senior Member wsteve55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThePenkethPedant View Post
    Thanks -the book states that it was closed in 1895. I don`t think it became a park as early as 1912 - as I said, in the mid-50s it was still a cemetery with all its monuments,albeit maybe closed to further burials. My cheif enquiry is -what happened to the monuments? Nobody seems to know, although I had heard that someone came across some in a Welsh field.....
    Sorry,but whatever book you've got,it's incorrect!

    p.s. if you look at the park pic' I've posted,it states quite clearly,1913!

  14. #29

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    Right,wsteve -I hadn`t spotted the photo dating; this is all very odd - my recollection of the monuments and gravestones in the mid50s is strong, I wonder if I had a `time-slip`, similar to those reported in Bold Street; maybe I should have a word with Tom Slemen.....

  15. #30

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    Just a follow-up to the above - it seems a bit hasty of the authorities to clear a cemetery in 1912 which was still accepting burials in 1910. I would still like to know what they do with the monuments etc - including those that were in St James` Cemetery.

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