Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
Hi Paddy,
Attack is usually the best form of defence - but should it be deployed against children, or adults because of what happened to them as children?
Indefensible.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
Hi Paddy,
Attack is usually the best form of defence - but should it be deployed against children, or adults because of what happened to them as children?
Indefensible.
Well Kevin heres an insight.
I spent my formative years in Nazareth house Crosby. My official history claims it was a happy time and we were all treated well. My own recollection is somewhat different. Thing is they have gone to great lenghts to cover up. In this country the Catholic Church has not had to answer and Liverpool that has the biggest Catholic community has remained in denial.Discrediting claimants is common practice and falsifying records another. I got my records from Liverpool social services. As a child they had quartly visits to check on children in care. The forms in my possesion state clearly the general state and welfare of the child. As in recording measles and the mumps and also School medicals. I have a scar on the back of my head that was the result of having three stitches after being attacked in the nursery. There is no record of the incident or my trip to the hospital. For that reason Kevin quite frankly they make me sick.
Good to know someone else went to school in Speke, even though you were on the otherside of the fence. I recall some of our teachers actually encouraged us to dislike Those other Schools. All seems so petty nowadays.
Good to know know you Kevin. I left school in December 1961 and left Liverpool in October 1962.
:taxi:
I know that feeling. In 1959 I spent 15 weeks in Alder Hey hospital, having had an operation to correct flat feet - most of that time in plaster from my toes to my knees (had to learn to walk again afterwards). Two years later my younger brother was diagnosed with the same problem but my mum told the doctor she didn't want him going through what I went through. The doctor said it was OK as they didn't do that operation any more. He was given insoles for his shoes, which corrected the problem and he has been fine ever since.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
I've had problems with my feet for the past 15 years and was curious to discover what they had actually done to me. Asked my current GP to check my health records, and he rather surprisingly told me my records didn't start until 1960.
Coincidence?
Well I had the same problem collecting medical records I can remember having the stitches? put in my head even so. In my childhood view I thought the stretcher was an ironing board and the stitches were like little silver stars. It was a painful experience and the scar is still there. It was caused by an assault on me in the nursery and other welfare reports predate the incident which leads me to believe that it has been omitted. The person who assaulted me was a care worker and I think that the church was mindful of a scandal .Other things such as unnatural punishments are denied. It was common practice to be beaten with coat hangers and hairbrushes and that was by nuns .The regime was at times quite sadistic yet the institution was presented as a happy place for children in care. Things got much worse for me in other homes but I do feel that we as very young children endured particularly harsh treatment. Then when I started doing alright they sent a posse after me too make sure you don?t get too confident and remain little Patrick forever grateful to them for their kind care. Well this medium is one way of having a go back.
When I saw the film it had me in tears - repeatedly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ged
With the Irish Church being linked in with the state they made it possible to address the issue of cruelty in Catholic establishments. That has not been the case for those Liverpool children who suffered. Recently the Pope apologized on behalf of the church in Australia to children who had suffered in their institutions. Quite a lot of them would have been scousers who got shipped out to Australia not long after the war. They made a drama about it called the leaving of Liverpool. The point is that kids like myself who grew up in their institutions are portrayed as lucky well cared for children. The legal services commission won?t grant legal aid to approach them. So there is no closure and they have more legal power than their victims
I went to St Margret Mary's school starting in 1938. The young children who went to St Edwards Orphanage also attended junior school there. I can remember my mother would give me a a piece of toast or a jam butty to have with my free milk. One day I was eating my snack at playtime, when one of the kids from the orphanage asked me if he could be my wacker, he said he was hungry, so I gave him some of my lunch. I toled Me Mam about it, and the next day she put an extra butty in my lunch for Me Wacker. Most people at school had a wacker. In scouseology to wack out is to share. A wacker is a scouser. I often if the word Wacker originated at our school. It would be nice to think it did.
Good post Gerry lad. The weirdest school I attended was the school at the remand home on Menlove Avenue. They put me in there because I kept running away and going back to my Mam. Any road the system at Menlove was quite mad. If the teacher asked you a question and you could not answer you got hit over the head with a blackboard duster or a wooden wedge. Being a bright pupil I managed to escape quite a lot of knocks. If the teacher requested you stay behind that meant a hiding, and I mean a hiding.
Would that be Woolton Vale Paddy. I was reading in a blog about a solitary confinement cell in there. One or two of my mates where sent there, for commiting very minor offences.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
Yes it was Woolton Vale and the Regime was cruel beyond belief. I got stuck in there for nothing they just had nowhere to put me. I got beaten up by grown men and the memory of that place stays with me. The cell they had was for punishing runaways or persistent offenders. You could hear screams coming from there when they beat up boys. I saw a lot of children get severely beaten up in there. The night staff were perverts who loved hitting the boys on their bottoms. I never got sexually abused just beaten up quite a lot. I think that sexual abuse claims carry more weight these days. Still violence against kids is bad and you do carry the scars throughout your life. Liverpool council are so insensitive to this issue it really is quite criminal. They completely ignore any allegations. So what is to be the future for child care in the city when they won?t apologize for their murky past?
Paddy,
I'm sure the city council are very sensitive to these type of allegations, as any one proven,will cost them dear! This sort of thing will,I'm afraid,always be around.:disgust:
Chat shows in the eighties and nineties brought matters like this into the public domain. However sex abuse became more sensationalist sidelining violence against children. It also led to false allegations being made. Some people picked up large sums of money jumping on the bandwagon. David Jones the Cardiff manager was dragged up before the courts on fabricated charges. The thing about sex abuse allegation when they come from promiscuous people they can be very hard to fight off. You have to remember the homes had a lot seriously disturbed kids in them. What Liverpool council need to do is to apologize to the victims of brutal assaults as a child they took me into care on the basis that they would protect me. My Mum and Dad never beat me up I was beaten up by care workers. Yet the present council has slammed the door in the faces of the victims and so too has the Catholic Church. Going back to the school at Woolton Vale I do believe the teacher was prosecuted eventually.
I couldn't say on here, what I was going to do, to several people,who supposedly, were meant to care for me,and my sisters, when I grew up,but.......the feeling gradually faded, when I realised they would either be quite old,or dead!! You've got to move on.:nod:Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
He's right, Paddy. I wouldn't for one minute belittle the experiences you had or your right to justice, but harbouring a life time's bitterness only harms the victim, not the perpetrator.Quote:
Originally Posted by wsteve55
Even righteous anger has to dissipate at some time - never forget what was done to you, but put it behind you and move on.
Well I moved on years ago but the hatred from Liverpool council that has been shown to me makes me worry about my own mortal survival. I only enquired after listening to woman?s hour on Radio 4 It would seem I now don?t? exist anyway. The hurt from the Catholic Church was so obscene and cruel it defies human understanding. Coming from those who preach hell it is in keeping with their tradition. I hope one day others are brave enough to confront these brutes. My life is over now for attempting too yet I still believe I did the right thing. And I will always have friends. A fitting avatar would be a friendly smile to this post! :034:
Good on yer!Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
:handclap:
Well,Paddy,
your life certainly aint over yet,(I've gotta say that,or it means I'm not far behind you:smirk:)but reading your post made me think about looking up my own records, if they still exist, just out of curiosity!:nod: God knows what they had to say, about an angel like me!:slywink:
Steve.
You don't get them all only the parts that they by law have to keep and even then they omit. It bugs me that I have three stitche's and the scar yet it never happend from their point of view. The truth is what suits them. When I say my life is over I mean that It will never be the same since Liverpool council jumped me.You might be wise to go through criminal lawyers rather than civic ones as their more up to the kind of people you have to deal with.
I understand your meaning Paddy,Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
but I do realise that the council,etc would be very careful about what they let you see,regardless of the law,and also that records might have been "accidentally" lost !:rolleyes::slywink:
Steve.
Yes they are quite absent minded when it comes to sensitive documents.:ninja:
My name is Mervin Clarke I may have been in your class, I was at blessed johns for a couple of terms. I also remember Caroline Anderton, Donna Mellea, I think you were thinking of Agnes Faning she continued to live in GarstonQuote:
Originally Posted by kevin
I went to Our Lady of Mount Carmel Primary too and my cousin Gaye went to Dovedale! (and... we went to the Cavern together!)Quote:
Originally Posted by MissInformed
St Georges CoE primary
Venice Street
Stockbridge (Canny Farm)
Now we can see who's got the best legs :unibrow:
Might do their hair before prog runs out?
Bad hair day :PDT_Xtremez_42:
Hi I went to Granby Street from 1952 to 1963 and I loved that school Thats me 4th from the right on the back row in 1960 Mr Kirbys class
millwood cp greenway rd
I went to 'Our Lady Immaculate' Northumberland Terrece ..The onto 'Queen of all saint's' on Townsend Lane ..
Mab Lane Primary- Old cantril Farm :thumbsup:
Then Blessed Ambrose Barlow - Queens Drive .:thumbsdow
When was that? I lived off Northumberland Terrace ie Albion Street,you didn't live on St Domingo Road did yer?Quote:
Originally Posted by Debra
Yes i did George , Sir Thomas White Gardens for 19 years ..Quote:
Originally Posted by George
I don't know the dates , but i was born in 1961 , so it would have been from say .... 66 to 73 or there abouts .. I left Tommy Whites in 1980 .
Hah,ok it wasn't you then,my chilhood sweetheart lived the other side of St Domingo in the masionets opposite Tommy whites.Quote:
Originally Posted by Debra
She dinna want to go out with me for ages,after me tea I'd go and sit on the wall of Tommy whites waiting for her to come across and say ok...done that for days(or was it weeks?) until she said ok...and she did. :PDT_Aliboronz_11:
Did you marry her ? I knew a few people from over the road , hmm i wonder if knew her :)
Nope.Quote:
Originally Posted by Debra
I doubt it? canna even remember her name now? I'm sure it began with C ? cannot even remember whether there were maisonettes? I'm sure they was houses?Quote:
Originally Posted by Debra
Did you ever go to dances in Albion House?
aahh, there's nothing worse than unrequited love :( :) .. oops I missed the end bit - you did get a date then ??Quote:
Originally Posted by George
I had no brains back then.:smirk:Quote:
Originally Posted by lindylou
They were next to the Priests house facing Tommy Whites , the phone box was on the corner , yes i often went to the Albion disco , it was great , and very dark as i remember it !Quote:
Originally Posted by George
What was the name of the pub at the top of Adelaide Street opposite Tommy Whites? Was it 'The Adelaide'?