Quote:
Originally Posted by peter
What do you mean, Peter? It's the same house that has been there since the 1880's even if it is now apartments.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/234/5...a8f4b55470.jpg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peter
What do you mean, Peter? It's the same house that has been there since the 1880's even if it is now apartments.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/234/5...a8f4b55470.jpg
Battlecrease house has been DEMOLISHED, and new luxury apartments built on the old site?Quote:
Originally Posted by peter
Er I don't think it has been demolished.....well not up to a few months ago anyway. I'll check on that next time i'm passing. The Poste House issue seals it for me. A bit careless of the forger what! Aside from that, it was a tragic story and Florence Maybrick grew to be old and anonymous. She lived in squalid conditions when she moved back to the states and was eventually identified by a tag on an item of clothing that she sent to be cleaned with a neighbour. Luckilly the neighbour was kind enough not to reveal Florences true identity until she died. It also seems incredible that she was convicted of murder when, according to what i have read, Mr Maybrick used to sprinkle arsenic on his food as a flavour enhancer.
But what I find more incredible is that I worked as a cop in South Liverpool for 30 years. I passed Battlecrease House thousands of times and knew nothing of the Maybrick case until a few years ago. Liverpool History does not seem to be well documented or should I say, certain aspects of it doesn't. Thank goodness for Chris George.
[ Mr Maybrick used to sprinkle arsenic on his food as a flavour enhancer.
wonder if the wife would like it on her chips ?
Thanks, Chris. I will defer to Richard Whittington-Egan whose books have helped to keep the memory of the Maybrick Case alive in the city.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris48
Chris
For the record, Tommy Handley lived next door to Battlecrease House and flats (or town houses) called Handley Court were built on that site, in the 1960s I think.
New apartments cover the demolished Riversdale College site, nearer the river. A small block has also been built near Aigburth Rd end. Battlecrease House is usually obscured by bushes. I'll have to go and have a look just incase anything's happened down there recently.
I know there have been a couple of recent demolitions facing the cricket ground (Aigburth Rd).
Hi Folks
I alerted Chris Jones with the Liverpool Cricket Club to this report. Chris is working on a website on the Maybricks which should shortly go live shortly and he can give us definitive word on the current status of Battlecrease. I doubt whether the owner of Battlecrease, Paul Dodd, would sell it and allow it to be demolished since he is fully aware of the house's history and significance. Besides which, that's pretty fast work to demolish it and have luxury apartments built in the place of the mansion in the seven months since I took the above photograph. :rolleyes:
Chris
got duff information there, glad to say battlecrease is still standing. apologies.
anyone for cricket
Found this on Ebay
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/9781905615186-...QQcmdZViewItem
It says it's still unpublished...
Any news on the Maybrick website Chris?
Thanks, DaisyChains. It turns out the book is published by the National Archives (formerly the Public Record Office) and will not be out until the end of March. Here are further details, also a couple of other things that should interest you:Quote:
Originally Posted by DaisyChains
Mrs Maybrick by Victoria Blake
Publisher: National Archives (PRO), The
Pub. Date: March 28, 2008
ISBN-13: 9781905615186
128pp, available from Barnes & Noble, etc.
I have found that solicitor Alexander MacDougall's 1891 book, The Maybrick Case: A Treatise in defense of Mrs. Maybrick is available from Google Books.
Check this out too: Florence Maybrick a Thrilling Romance. As the blogger says, "Another 'true' crime dreadful from George Purkess Jr., proprietor of the Illustrated Police News along with a text sample showing the meaning of the term 'romance.'"[/url]
In regard to the Maybrick website upcoming from Chris Jones at the Liverpool Cricket Club, here is the latest word I received from Chris on January 20 last:
"Have almost finished Maybrick A to Z. It is 200 pages in length, based in the main on local newspaper reports. Website almost finished as well. Best wishes, Chris J"
It sounds to me that conceivably Chris might be putting out a book as well as the website. I have sent him an email to clarify that and will let you know.
Chris
Yes, The National Archives - they recently published a similar volume on Crippen.
Thanks, Mark. It's probably a smart thing for the Archives to do, to publish what is in their files about famous cases.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark R
Chris
Hi Chris, Paul and everyone!
I've been away from 'Maybrickland' for quite a while now and haven't checked in here for some months but it's good to be back. Interesting to see news of new books soon coming on the subject and I can't wait to visit Chris Jones's James Maybrick website (To which I have contributed a piece, so will expect plenty of flak! HA HA). The reason I've been away for so long is that last year I joined a vocal group called 'BREEZE'. After recording a few tracks with the group, I got the bug for recording again (I used to record in the mid 80's) and have since recorded a singing album 'Songs From The End Of The Pier' and now a new kind of poetry concept album called 'In Words, In Music...Of Life, Of Death' so i've been a really busy bunny! The new poetry album has a track all about JTR on it and I think all of you will like it. It's not specifically about James Maybrick so it will suit all 'ripper tastes' HA HA You can have a listen to the track by visiting the Myspace page I've created to promote the release, just paste this url into your browsers.
www.myspace.com/inwordsinmus...
If I'm not trying your patience with such a blatant sales pitch HA HA, I'd also like to state here how sorry I was to learn of the death of crime historian and T.V star Jeremy Beadle. Those of us that attended last years trial of James Maybrick at Liverpool Cricket Club will know first hand what a genuine and easy to talk to guy Jeremy was. He compared last years event superbly and made it not just an interesting and informative weekend but a fun one as well. Jeremy played a trick on me during the 'question and answer' session at the end of the trial when he consistently refused to give me the microphone despite mine always being the first hand in the air! When at last I decided to get my camera out and snap the event, Jeremy sneakily held the microphone out to me! Everyone laughed when I didn't notice and after that the joke ran and ran. I REALLY enjoyed that bit of tomfoolery and the Maybrick trial is well up there with my list of 'best holidays ever'. So THANK YOU Jeremy, you were a true gent.
If any of you do visit my JTR poem, please let me know what you thought eh?
Oh, and if you want a copy of the album there £9.99 including P&P! HA HA HA HA HA HA
Love to all,
Tony.
Hi Everyone,
Sadly, the myspace link to my albums home page doesn't work. The three dots at the end should be part of the url but this website hasn't thought so. To get to my albums page try this link instead...
www.myspace.com/tonymay4
This is my personal myspace page. Scroll down to 'My Friends' and click on the album cover there. That will get you to the albums home page where you can hear my ripper piece. The ripper one is called 'A Researchers Nightmare' by the way.
Tony.
Brilliant news Mark.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark R
Have you read the Crippen one?
(Is there a Wallace one? hehe)
Thanks for info Chris. Will really look forward to the site (and book!)
No, I haven't read that one DaisyChains.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaisyChains
I actually wrote to the publishers asking them if they were going to do a Wallace edition (I actually enquired about doing it). Haven't heard anything yet...
Just finished reading this thread from start to finish and i must admit to enjoying it. I thin k i am in the camp of tony sort of-i think he was definately a killer -maybrick i mean-but not necessarily the ripper murders. I also thought florence was totally innocent. And i am also sad to hear the bad news of jeremy beadle who came accross as a joker but everyone has said how intelligent and kind he was. I know its a bit off thread but how about walter sickart for the ripper murders??? I just think it was more than one person and they possibly worked together?????
thanks again everyone for this brilliant thread.
Hello there! Glad that you've enjoyed this thread. There's been some really good and constructive conversations about James Maybrick/Jack The Ripper on here and some interesting points and theories have been expressed. The great thing here Shirleya is that with all our differing opinions, things always remain as discussion unlike the JTR caseboards.
As far as Walter Sickert goes, he IS a viable candidate BUT there are SERIOUS holes in the Royal Ripper Theory. I personally think that, as a painter and artist, he may simply have been INSPIRED by the ripper murders. It also seems that Sickert may well have been responsible for sending some of the ripper letters to the police. If this is true, along with the references to the murders included in some of his paintings, I think the evidence all points to a man OBSESSED with the killings rather than a man who's COMITTING the killings. Sickert was known to be rather an eccentric man and I'm sure I've heard was even known to have dressed up and gone out to walk the streets in clothes resembling the general vision of what the ripper looked like.
For me though, while there are still a great many flaws in his candidacy ( as Chris will no doubt fill you in! HA HA HA) I still favour Maybrick. There are a number of books coming out shortly that will stir things up considerably this year as well so keep watching this thread! HA HA HA
Over to you Chris!
All the best,
Tony.
thanks tony
just loving this site-think im addicted-and everyone is really helpful and friendlyam loving the photos. Looking forward to new developements for the ripper murders-keep us posted-thanks.
Just noticed that jeremy beadle raised loads of money for charity in his life-good on him-i dont know why he was disliked by some people-he was a good man -not perfect-but then who is?????/
Nice to see you back here, Tony. I enjoyed listening to those selections from your album. Very good, mate. :handclap:
Hiya shirleya, nice to meet you.
You both might be interested in this strange story out of Southport about a bag and key that allegedly belonged to James Maybrick plus a sideboard that supposedly came out of Battlecrease House, that was the Maybricks as well (so the poster says). It sounds a bit farfetched because the Maybricks' possessions were sold after Florence Maybrick's conviction and the house leased out. The thread on the Southport Forums is five years old. What has happened to this stuff in the meanwhile and how come, if real, no one has heard about it??? :rolleyes:
Jack the Ripper in Southport!!!
See what you think. . .
Chris
hi there tony and chris
will just go and have a look on that southport site in a mo-thanks for that.
there are a few jack the ripper fans-so to speak-in the library where i work and they always tell me when a new book comes out-so i will pass this southport info on -cheers. mostly they still think it may be maybrick but i still go with sickert-or two people working together but i am sure new theory will come along before long.
night
:)
just read the southport stuff-very interesting. well i wonder if anyone can find out what has happened to the stuff after 5 years . i can agree with the stuff one of the forum people said-why would he go from someone so outwardly calm and normal to some mad fiend -maybe we need a profiler of some kind to work on the case and check out maybricks profile.
Pity about the shadow, but took this picture of the grave last week it remains in a sorry state.
Thanks for this, SteH. A shame indeed to see the gravestone in this state. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by SteH
Chris
Here's another photo,taken 5-6 years ago of the grave when they had tried to patch it up after the initial vandalism.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisGeorge
Hi Chris (and all),
Really glad that you liked my work! I'm recording a lot again these days and having an enormous amount of fun. Maybe you could mention my Jack The Ripper track in your magazine and include a link? I don't mention any particular candidate as the ripper in the track so I think a lot of people would enjoy it...and it might help me to sell a few of the 500 copies of the album I'm currently SLEEPING with! HA HA HA HA
Thanks so much for the link! I am really excited about this piece of news! Don't you think it just adds to the debate, the mystery and magic of the Maybrick and the diary saga? I agree with you this time though, that without further investigation (and a thorough examination of all the items) that the whole thing is highly suspicious and could easily have been posted by someone just to 'wind people up'. Thinking 'outside the envelope' for a moment however there are a number of points about the story that COULD make perfect sense. Mike Barratt was I believe at one time a scrap metal dealer was he not? It would not be outlandish to therefore accept that he might easily be well known to local builders/house clearance/electricians/
van men etc. The idea that some or a lot of Maybricks furniture could still be in the 'Liverpool area' is also perfectly feasible. I mean back in 1889 people didn't have the ability to travel/transport goods long distances as easily as they do today, so likelihood suggests that a lot of the Maybricks furniture from Battlecrease would have been sold to 'locals'. I also like the idea that the diary and pocket watch could have been found together and 'sold for cash' at the same time. this would explain rather neatly their seemingly untimely 'discovery' not far apart from each other. The story also suggests that perhaps the 'refurbishers' found the items but did not report this to the owner of the house itself, choosing instead (dishonestly) to sell them for what they could get. However, before we get carried away here, you have to also think that IF such people HAD found items like this that they would have at least READ the diary before parting with it. If they had done so, they would soon have discovered that the diary appeared to be that of JACK THE RIPPER! With such knowledge is it really likely that they would have accepted a mere £20 as their ill gotten gains? I do like the fact though that the bag has the words J.M. JACK written on it. Not only does it mirror the diary explanation of how the name was chosen, it also mirrors (for me at least) the psychology of the diarist. By this I mean that part of the thrill of being JACK was to make him feel so much CLEVERER than everybody else. 'Leaving clues' was just one of the ways that he liked to do this. The Goulston Street Graffitto, The Red Leather Cigarette Case, The inscription in his OWN pocket watch (or even his wifes pocket watch) and of course the diary itself. What thrill would Maybrick have got KNOWING that his wife was continually carrying with her EVIDENCE that could potentially hang him. How James would have laughed to know that the pocket watch might be on the bedside table when Florrie was with 'The Whoring Master'. It would all have been a very dangerous game, but a THRILLING ONE and his continuing luck in getting away with it all so far would, I believe, have driven him to taking bigger and bigger risks. All killers harbour a secret desire to be caught, isn't that what they say Chris? Some because the decent side of them wants to stop but cant and others simply because they crave RECOGNITION for what they have done. James Maybrick was a man that had lived in the shadow of his brother Michael all of his life and it is the depiction of a love/ hate relationship between the diarist and a 'Michael' that, if like me you believe the writer was James Maybrick, provides him with a MOTIVE for the JTR killings!
Interesting Stuff!!
Over to you lot!
Love
Tony.
not sure still tony-but interesting reading. Keep us posted everyone if anythng new comes up. great thread.
shirley a
I understand from your words, ChrisGeorge, that Paul H. Feldman is dead???
This would be a shock to me....if it is true!
Yours sincerely, Battlecrease71
p.s.: I love this forum and would like to know if the website made by Chris from the Cricketclub is available yet!!
Hello Battlecrease71Quote:
Originally Posted by Battlecrease71
First, my understanding from Chris Jones is that the website he has been putting together on the Maybricks is close to going public.
He has also been working on a book about the Maybricks which appears to be, I think, a kind of Maybrick A to Z with information on the family gleaned from contemporary newspapers, including profiles of leading figures in the case, on the coroner's jury, in the trial at St. George's Hall, etc.
Yes, Battlecrease, I can confirm that Paul Feldman passed away suddenly in June 2005. There's a thread about his death at Casebook: Jack the Ripper, "Paul Feldman - (Rest in Peace)"
Chris
Thanks to you all, I've been checking out a bit of local history and was trying to find out where Battlecrease House was. This forum and your comments were the only place I was able to locate the building, even though I live just one mile away. Rest assured it's still there but there doesn't seem to be any reference to it's name or history.
If anyone's interested there is a talk on the trial at St Georges Hall 1st May 2008 12-30 - 13-30.
Hi all
Good news, the Maybrick website designed by Chris Jones of the Liverpool Cricket Club is up and running. :PDT_Aliboronz_24:
I have pasted below what Chris wrote at Casebook Jack the Ripper about the site:
Dear All,
You might be interested to know that we have just launched a new website that focuses on James and Florence Maybrick and the world in which they lived. The website is called: http://www.jamesmaybrick.org
The aim of this website is to tell the two interlocking stories of Liverpool and the Maybricks in a balanced and impartial manner. It looks at Victorian Liverpool, Florence’s murder trial and the controversial debate over whether James Maybrick was really Jack the Ripper. The website includes items written by people such as Donald Rumbelow, Professor Rubinstein, Paul Feldman, Steve Powell, Shirley Harrison, Chris George, Adrian Morris and Caroline (Caz) Morris.
There will not be a message forum on the website. However, we would welcome any referenced articles on the Maybricks. Such articles will be stored in an archive vault for people to view and download. The aim is to gradually build up a large library of both primary and secondary information to enable people to reach their own reasoned conclusions about James and Florence Maybrick.
The new website also includes an advert for the so-called Maybrick Watch currently owned by Albert Johnson. The sale of this watch is a purely private matter and nobody associated with the website will gain financially in anyway by its sale.
Please have a look at our new website. Compared to the excellent casebook website, it is rather a small affair. However, we are quite proud of it (yes, we are biased).
Best wishes, Chris Jones
Thought you might be interested in this, taken one week ago!Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisGeorge
Hi Chris I always one for having a go at the ripper case so here's my tuppence worth.
A lot has been said that Maybrick wasn't the ripper but have you noticed in the map out of the london streets he murdered his victims close to the same named streets in old liverpool?
For instance Whitechapel,Commercial Road ect,ect
I'll dig my volume of the "diary of the ripper" out and look up the streets again,I have only one street that I cannot pin point as I cannot find a detailed map of the whitechapel area but all the other streets are close by his victims murders.
And remember he was from liverpool and travelled to london frequently and we also have to remember when he died of arsnic poisning all the ripper murders ceased.
Cheers.
George
Fasinating reading !
Hi Everyone,
I seem to have left the world of James Maybrick behind me for the moment but I wanted to 'pop in' to say hi to you all and make sure you all know that Chris Jones's useful paperback book 'The Maybrick A-Z' is now available through both his www.jamesmaybrick.org website AND Amazon.com. I haven't got mine yet but I'm sure it will be a cracking read and might just get me back on the trail! I have been side tracked by belatedly following my dreams.. I always wanted to be a singer and never really went for it until about 2 years ago. I've recorded a couple of trial karaoke albums (me singing along to backing tracks) and am now recording a totally new album of MY OWN songs working and writing with my friend and GENIUS producer Harvey Summers.
One day I hope there will be a reason for me to return 'full time' to the world of the ripper and the Maybricks but for now I guess I will just drop by occasionally. Interestingly, the other VERY IMPORTANT book about James Maybrick and his connection to the ripper murders that I had privvy knowledge about (but sadly am bound by an oath not to reveal the exact contents of) has never been published. The e mail address I had to contact its author has also since started bouncing and I've heard nothing from 'them' either. I had been asked to proof read so it seems that the book has just faded into nothing. All very strange and I must say disappointing as I really think that it would have fired up many a fireside conversation!
Oh well, hope all are well,
See you sometime!
Love Tony.
Quote:
Originally Posted by George
Hello George
A lot of street names repeat in different cities. Paradise Street, Liverpool, for example, may get its name from Paradise Street, Bermondsey, London. Commercial Road, London, of course is a major thoroughfare in London's East End and you are right that there is similarly a Commercial Road in Liverpool. Being a major road, however, means that any of the murders in the East End would by their nature be "near" Commercial Road, so that doesn't mean much. And of course the other example you give, Whitechapel, doesn't really count because although Whitechapel is a street in downtown Liverpool it's not a road in the East End. It's a district, one of the Tower Hamlets.
Hi Tony
Nice to see you back here. Don't stay away so long next time. :PDT_Aliboronz_24:
Thanks for the tip about Chris Jones' book on the Maybricks as well as his excellent website, which anyone interested in the Maybricks will find very helpful. Good luck to you in your musical ventures, Tony.
Meanwhile, is the other book you mention the Steve Powell book about his alleged involvement in concocting the Diary with one Steve Park (said to be from Birkenhead), down in Australia?
All the best
Chris
Hi Chris,
Thank you for your kind words of encouragement! I wish I had had more of those years ago when I was still young enough to have tried to make a career out of singing/entertainment.
To answer your question regarding the 'other book' I can tell you that it was nothing whatsoever to do with Steve Park and his Australian story. I actually believe some of what he says (that he did know Anne Graham and the guy that she was supposed to have written the diary with) but think that he is WRONG about the exact story to do with the diary. There is I feel, a lot more to be discovered about that particular thread and it is difficult to ever do so now because (it seems to me) a lot of the 'actors' in that play have things to hide/protect themselves against so I doubt the whole truth will ever come out.
As I am bound to an oath of secrecy regarding the 'other book', I cannot reveal to you directly who the writer or writers are. What I feel I can say however, seeing that you were at the trial of James Maybrick and could therefore quite possibly heard about this then for yourself, is that the book I am talking about was to do with coded messages contained within ripper letters written to the police at the time of the murders. These messages link JAMES MAYBRICK directly (and in my opinion conclusively) to the ripper case. They do NOT of course prove without doubt that he was the ripper, but they DO provide evidence that James Maybrick WAS linked to the case at the time of the murders, if not by the police, by his own actions. Now before you burst into a fit of laughter at this suggestion Chris, I would like to think that you know me well enough to know that, while I am a 'Maybrickite' (and therefore a person that WANTS to believe by definition) I am also someone prepared to listen and RECOGNIZE that there are considerable problems with Maybricks candidacy and the diary's validity. I would NOT state my belief as strongly as I have had the evidence I have seen been any less than convincing. With an open mind, I feel you to would have been persuaded that, at the very least, Maybrick WAS involved in some shape of form in the ripper enquiry AT THE TIME. If that IS true, then I feel I have been vindicated in my long held belief that he should be treated as a genuine contender. Wish I knew what was going on with the 'other book' I mention!
All the best,
Tony.
Hey Tony,
Never met you etc but all the best with your ventures.
AP.