every little helps......Quote:
Originally Posted by FKoE
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every little helps......Quote:
Originally Posted by FKoE
Look at it this way,for every new Supermarket,how many local shops close ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev
In my experience, the supermarkets that opened in these communities never had a large amount of these little shops to swallow up anyway.
The Morissons in Speke will provide hundreds of jobs for Speke residents. The current parade of vandalised shops is aweful at the mo......
By investing in areas, re-furbishing some of the magnificent Victorian houses of Bootle to the amazing Georgian properties in Toxteth, this will give those living in deprived areas belief and hope.
These are places with genuine scousers who live in these areas and have done for generations, by improving areas such as the examples I've noted will inspire communities to gain qaulifications, create they're own businesses, and it will make the whole city better.
You can't say "there isn't enough people in Liverpool" when it has the 5th biggest population in the UK.
It just needs re-generation. Manchester has done well, in particular Sheffield, historically a working class city of metal factories, now has a high average wage (The Hallam area has more people on £60,000 pa than any area of size than any other northern town).
Liverpool has one of the highest employment rates in the country, it is making strides, but I feel it would be better to invest in people for the City's future as opposed to investing in rubbish new buildings in the city center.
Speke I would say is a special case... rather than the norm.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev
I see it this way, once we had parades of shops with a grocers a butchers a off licence a news agents etc etc... now we 24hr garages and mini marts, and cctv
I get quite depressed by this. The manufacturing sector has been destroyed, the service sector is too low paid, and the information sector jobs are too small in number. You just get the feeling that without some form of intervention in the economy then the future doesn't look great. :sad:
Thats it in a nutshell...Quote:
Originally Posted by Howie
Even as a retail sector, we can't compete with Manchester, compared to it, we are out of the way, off the beaten track.
But the powers that be, see Liverpool as a Tourist destination, and a museum of white washed history..
All we need now is to rebuild New Brighton Tower and a Pleasure beach to be an upmarket Blackpool :( :037:
God help Liverpool post 2008
OMG - there's something in the air tonite, group hug :hug:. Lets do something positive, can we? or are we doomed?Quote:
Originally Posted by FKoE
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev
Nah!! we'll be right once the footy season starts :D
lol - thats all it is, no footy!Quote:
Originally Posted by FKoE
We agree about that one - some kind of intervention is necessary. Unfortunately, Government won't bribe and armtwist employers to move into town anymore, or even give Liverpool any decent public sector relocations (Manchester is getting the golden egg of the BBC relocation, Liverpool might get a few low paying clerical jobs out of the Inland Revenue or Home Office if it's lucky). Whoever it is who wants Plessey back - they are never ever coming back, all that is finished. Even successful areas of Germany are struggling to keep far more successful industries going because of lower wage costs in Eastern Europe. But everyone knows that already.Quote:
Originally Posted by Howie
The only interevention I can think of that might possibly work is to get some more home grown businesses going, and create more of a business buzz that attracts new small businesses. New people are required for that, because you need chancers and also a growing population means growing markets. If the city can grow its population by say 50,000, that will create a lot more demand for services, and yet more jobs. It's a virtuous circle, just as the population decimation since the 1960s has half-killed the economy. I'm not suggesting existing local people shouldn't be doing this, and that some are, but setting up a real business that actually makes money and employs people is really hard I think. I've never done it and doubt if I ever will, although I'd like to. I don't think most people can. So bring in those who can. It's what London does, most of the enterprising Londoners setting up new businesses there were not born in London - that is as true now as it was in Elizabethan London.
Thousands of occupations can be done anywhere these days, the people who do them live where they want to live, often where they can network with others. It's vital to give a first class metropolitan quality of life. And in that Liverpool has a huge advantage, being such a beautiful city and also in many ways a happy one where people smile. So I'm actually quite optimistic about Liverpool and its economy, but only because I believe that ideas about housing investment coming first are probably not actually going to happen, and that the city at last has its eye on the prize of becoming a place for people to do business in again.
I'm not a Tory or pro-private enterprise particularly. Personally I'd have kept lots of industries in public hands, and a proper industrial policy. If Britain had supported shipbuilding the way the French and Germans had, we'd still have a big shipyard providing thousands of skilled jobs at Lairds. But we are where we are, the world has moved on and we have to be practical.
Your kiddin' yeah ?.Quote:
Originally Posted by Liverpolitan
Manufacturing jobs have'nt disappeared Polly, they were relocated to developing countries where governments and corporations are more than willing to exploit the worker.
And here, they now exploit the consumer .
MORE than 1,000 apartments in Liverpool city centre are lying empty, the Daily Post can reveal.
Around 10% are still waiting for buyers or tenants, as young professionals shun penthouse suites and studios in the city centre to buy houses in areas like Lark Lane, in Aigburth.
Out of 9,279 flats, 1,117 are empty, according to statistics provided by Liverpool city council and many have been vacant for some time. With some apartments boasting price tags in excess of £900,000, the uptake on such properties has been slow, but even more are planned as Liverpool’s expansion grows. While it was thought thousands of young professionals with money to spend would flock into the city as improvements such as the ACC arena got under way, estate agents have spoken of their fears that supply has far outstripped demand. The startling findings have led
some to fear Liverpool could become a wasteland of empty properties owned by London developers who are unable to rent them out or sell them on. continues.....
They're too expensive and don't cater for families,there lies your problem.:disgust:
What I could never understand was where do all these young professionals work?
Manchester?
Rents for these places in the City Centre are sky high, i beleve a lot are in excess of a £1000 a month, now if your on the minimum wage stacking shelves or packing in a factory, your never going to be able to afford these. What do the planners expect building expensive appartments (and not very good ones) in a area were the average wage dosen't succeed £200 a week? To me there targeting rich outsiders, so its not done for Scousers is it.
As its already been pointed out, we need more council homes. There is a huge waiting list, going years, yet the planners and the council are too busy knocking down old buildings and replacing them with small paper thin walled shoeboxes and charging extortionate rents. Can they be really surprised any are empty?
HahahaQuote:
Originally Posted by PhilipG
I know of plenty of 'Professional' scousers living in apartments in town. It was bound to happen though....with the investors buying them up leaving alot unlived in. I'm sure its not just confined to Liverpool though.
The decline of Liverpool saw a brain drain of its people. The ambitious left. The city largely became a working class city with far too many with a handout taking mentality - and it showed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shapers
For a city to get ahead it needs a vibrant active middle class. As Liverpool's middle class left, it needs to be brought back - as well as someone else's middle class enticed in as well.
It is obvious that these new apartments are not meant for sink estate dwellers.
We don't need new council homes at all - or very few. The city needs new private homes - owner/occupation. Let people be self sufficient and not rely on the state.Quote:
As its already been pointed out, we need more council homes. There is a huge waiting list, going years, yet the planners and the council are too busy knocking down old buildings and replacing them with small paper thin walled shoeboxes and charging extortionate rents. Can they be really surprised any are empty?
As the city becomes wealthier as the new middle class expands the economy, council homes will need to be built, here and there, however hopefully few.
There are plenty of council houses in Merseyside. I agree we must build more houses for private sale, 3 bed semi's etc... attracting those with families, young and old. Things have moved forward, though you cannot buy a 3 bed semi, new build for less than 160,000. 4 bed are over 180,000.Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterways
5 years ago you could pic up a new build home on a brown field site for 60,000.
How can anyone afford to buy a house on minimum wage? Having a council house dosen't mean your living off the state, if you working your renting it, at an affordable amount. And thats what we need more off. How can anyone better themselves if there living hand to mouth?
Partially, yes, as the house is subsidised. And I suppose you could say private is as well by tax releif. But with private no cash up front is taken from the tax koffers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shapers
see the Lan Article on the menu at:Quote:
if you working your renting it, at an affordable amount. And thats what we need more off. How can anyone better themselves if there living hand to mouth?
http://www.saveliverpooldocks.co.uk
Too many of the flats that are getting built in the city centre are luxury ones or for students!
I'd prefer to live in South Liverpool anyway.
Well said Howie lad :handclap: ..F**** the Arty farty type out of towner's who would normally turn their noses up at yer..get some decent properties built for the people of Kenny/Granby Etc..Quote:
Originally Posted by Howie
Totally agree. The price of property is astronomical and the average wage is low.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerard
Your only spot on girl..This Council could'nt give a toss about the People of Liverpool with its Scandalous Council Tax/Rates etc,Its more interested in that load of Bollocks Capital of Culture ****e..Whats that gonna bring ordinary people living in on Kenny..Dont say much needed funding please cause yer'll just be adding insult to injury..theyre still waiting for the last lot..No doubt there will be plenty of bashes at the Town Hall though Eh..will me and you get in..Not unless your on 1st name terms with Peter Toyne yer wont..Quote:
Originally Posted by Shapers
yeah that's right.
... and Anfield is in a dire state as well as Kenny. :disgust:
Liverpolitan. I don't think you can compare the previous influx of immigrants who were genuinely escaping poverty such as the Irish famine or Western Europe en route to the New World and who ended up staying here with the current influx from Eastern Europe at all.
Jobs they are seeking are low paid compared to a local but at least double what they'd normally expect back home. They also cram gangloads into private landlord housing.
Trades which are crying out for trainees and apprenticeships, the likes of which there were plenty in the 70s and 80s such as brickies, plasterers, plumbers, engineers, electricians, mechanics need local youngsters being pushed into these not encouraging immigrants to fill these jobs.
The lower pay results in lower taxes and NIC into the coffers which eventually will see the end of a pension pot for todays 40 year old. A lot of the money is sent back 'home' too so doesn't stay in the local economy.
Yes to entrepeneurs and skilled immigrants and the like but i'd hazard a guess they won't be coming from countries whose own economy and class system is below par with the developed world.
The sheer numbers over here are scary.
I can leave the house here in N.London and whatever direction or street I go down absolutely guarantee I'll be hearing Polish/Russian/E.European being spoken in less than 5/6 minutes.
I imagine that's probably true for 80% of the capital.
Wierd situation and there's no-one at the wheel.
What's to be scared of? Why not welcome them? My local shop has beenQuote:
Originally Posted by The Teardrop Explodes
taken over by a Pole, and a) you now get a proper hello when you go in, unlike the gum-chewing, sulky, innumerate locals who worked in there before b) he
knows the words "thank you" (in English as well!) which the previous English owners did not, c) he sells fresh Polish cakes which come from a Polish bakery -
not some over-packed industrially produced rubbish, d) he puts the change down on the little bowl for Polish customers, and counts it into your hand for
English customers - so it's not as though he's trying to force us to do things some weird and alien way.
Liverpool needs more Poles - tens of
thousands more. Interestingly, I read that Blackpool is trying to entice the East Europeans who come to work there to stay and settle, because they have
found the have talents and skills the economy there needs.
Whilst I have nothing against imported skills, we need to ask why our own are not trained to these levels - where are all the old type apprenticeships, you're not telling me Blackpool or Liverpool don't have people that could and should be doing this. When we're in a full employment situation, only then should we be looking to import skills. I also think that if it's discriminatory to advertise against age, sex or colour, then it certainly should be to bypass locals ahead of immigrants.
Do building firms discriminate against locals?
UP TO 35% of Liverpool’s new city centre apartments are lying empty, as an already flooded property market struggles to attract buyers, housing market experts claimed last night. more
Quote:
Liverpool’s strength used to be its population that lived in the city centre, and we need more houses. I do believe we have reached saturation in terms of catering for young professionals and creatives , and now need to look at creating a stable population with its own identity and sense of community.
I,d take two off their hands for a peppercorn rent:PDT_Aliboronz_24:
I think occupancy rates at around 70% is pretty average for city centre developments throughout the country. If people are buying to let or to build up a property portfolio and their investment is going down, I'm assuming they knew the risks. I won't be shedding any tears for them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev
I agree that more family sized accomodation needs to be built in principle but I'm not sure that families would want to live in the city centre when for the same money or a little bit more they could buy somewhere decent in South Liverpool surrounded by parks and greenery.
I read somewhere that even those people who are currently living in flats in the city centre plan to move out when they start to have a family. Maybe more needs to be done to attract retired people to live in the city centre?
Maybe if there was more there to attract families it would work?
I almost am scared to post in this thread after reading some of the posts lol.
I was brought up on the Falkner Estate off Parliament Street - very dire, and I now live and work in the city centre.
My job isn't well paid and it isn't minimum wage either, but if you look around there is new build property for less than £500 / month which if you share with your partner, isn't that expensive. Especially when you think of what you could gain by living and working the city.
- No commuting - saving money!
- No parking fees - saving money!
- Everything on your doorstep, Church Street, a myriad of restaurants and bars etc
- The River - great for evening walks etc
- The general city centre buzz
People have the impression that people in the city centre are some sort of different breed out of towners, but nothing could be further from the truth. I know plenty of people who work in clothes shops, students, bar workers who all live in the city centre and there is nothing 'out of town' about them at all.
As regards the empty property - its just a matter of time before these are filled. If you take into account how many apartments have appeared in the last few years, Kings Dock, Manolis Yard on Colquitt Street, London Road, Beetham Tower and all the rest, it can hardly be expected to fill all these straight away, especially when you consider that it wasn't so long ago that Liverpool City Centre was almost a ghost town.
I would love to live out in Aigburth, (I'd get a dog straight away :) ) but I know for a fact I wouldn't be able to afford a car and the travel costs would be expensive too. I wouldn't be able to afford to park my car even if I did have one and there are too many cars on the road anyway so that doesn't bother me.
What Jericho says is true. I don't think the city centre is the best place for bringing up kids, there simply not enough green space etc.
Also, I agree with Liverpolitan on the Polish issue. They should be welcomed to the city. We should by all means try and encourage our own to take apprenticeships and learn the skills that the city needs but what happens when they just don't want to do them or there is a shortage?
I think anyone who complains about 'these foreigners' coming not just Liverpool but the UK, should do a quick google and find out how many people from Liverpool or the UK go abroad each year to find work.
How many times have we heard about the 'falling population of Liverpool' and the 'great exodus out of the city'? Where have all these Scousers gone? Hopefully they have all found new jobs and got new lives, we wouldn't wish any less for them.
Well if Brits and Scousers can be welcomed into other countries / cities then its only fair that we do the same isn't it?
I'm sure as Liverpool's redevelopment becomes more progressed, more people will move in to vacant properties. I can see the point about families, etc, but they won't really want to live in the city centre anyway. These huge blocks of apartments are produced by companies and investors that want the highest return - they're not going to do as well if they build houses in Kirkdale.
Regarding cost of living in the city centre... I've found that it's not vastly different to the suburbs. As far as renting goes, a mate of mine got a spacious part-furnished one-bedroom flat near Met Quarter (seperate bathroom, kitchen, living room, etc) for under £400 a month.
Personally I prefer to live outside of the town centre, as parking is easier, there's less traffic and it's quieter.
Most of the family homes around here are being sold to landlords to rent to students when the *******s are getting student flats made In the city centre for them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerard
Ah well, at least I know I'm superior to anyone who needs a shopping trolley to carry a mutlipack carling even theres 3 of them to carry It.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:
I don't know what your problem with students is. They bring a lot of money into this city, which is just as well really.
Property owners and land developers will do what's best for them. If I could afford to, I'd buy some terraced houses in Kensington and rent them to students - at least you'd know they'll pay the rent and not turn the house into a crack den.
I see plenty of houses for sale all round the city, most of which are for families. However, the prices are high (as is the council tax), but this is a nationwide problem. Also, look at all the derelict and abandoned properties, such as on Prescot Road and off Prince's Avenue - these could be redeveloped, but who's going to invest? There's just far more money to be made with inner city developments. If anything, the news article in the Daily Post is good news - if the city market is saturated, investors will have to move to the suburbs to develop.
I want to move south eventually (sorry guys!) and there's just no chance of doing that right now as the situation is even worse there.
Student carrying packs of ale? Lead me to them, some students hold great parties. Called having a life.