L15 is Wavertree where I live.Originally Posted by Waterways
Greenbank is Mossley Hill. Sefton is part Aigburth and part Mossley Hill.
St Micheals Aigburth.
L15 is Wavertree where I live.
Greenbank is Mossley Hill. Sefton is part Aigburth and part Mossley Hill.
St Micheals Aigburth.
Gididi Gididi Goo.
Totally and utterly wrong. See:
http://www.toxteth.net
Paul mapped out the boundaries of Toxteth from the ancient maps - he walked it. His map shows the complete and correct boundary of Toxteth. He corrected mistakes in the boundary too. Yes, and parts of "Mossley Hill" are in Toxteth.
I remember rioting kicking off in St Paul's in Bristol well before Toxteth. I was around at the time and was actually "rioted in" to a pub in Park Road and could not get out until the early hours of the morning (I was gutted). The rioting did spread to other areas of Liverpool 8 (as we all called it then) not just Granby. The out-of-town police came with a bit of an attitude and were banging riot shields and making racist comments. It was not a happy time but to be honest we were all cheesed off anyway in 1981 - I had been unemployed for a year by that time (yes, I know - with all my talent). I think it was a symptom of a more deep-seated discontent - not just among the black community. If people have nothing to lose - no stake in their community - then they will not think-twice about destroying it. I heard it compared to "distressed birds detroying their own nests" by some poncey southern journo. Young black and mixed race lads that I knew suffered from being labeled a rioter by the police (even if they weren't). A couple of lads I knew were wrongfully arrested coming out of a pub and later got compensation from the police - there was quite a bit of panic about.
But - we did get the lovely Garden Festival out of it.!!!
That's correct Sweetpatooti.
I knew a lot of black friends, and it's true that the black lads were often unfairly targeted by police.
The riots were not just about that tho' - 'cos lots of white people were involved too. (I think it was mostly the whites who did the looting - thay were coming down from other areas to grab what they could)
I can remember being in a house on the Falkner estate (not there now) ... and we all had to sit with the lights out while a mob was milling about outside.
We could hear glass smashing and shouting ... it was pretty scary.
We were scared that the front windows were going to come in on us.
I stayed away from L8 afterwards until it was all over !! Ha!
I remember seeing the devastation and the aftermath. Half of Lodge lane was gone ! The Rialto was a smouldering heap.
I had a friend who lived off Lodge lane at that time. She had been away on holiday abroad when the riot took place and she didn't know anything about it. When she returned from her hols she got the shock of her life to find the lane looking like a war zone !!!
Yes you're right - people were coming into Liverpool 8 on busses from other areas to check out what was going on. The two lads who were arrested were actually white. It was like the ripples in a pond and spread out with copycat riots in other parts of the city. BUT it was not the first in the country and I think it has not shaken off the stigma in the same way as St Pauls in Bristol and Brixton has - Toxteth = riots to most people inside and outside of Liverpool. I do not live there now, but my chap's family do and I have still got lots of mates there.
A point to note - these things kick off in the summer when it is hot - not many riots in the snow in winter - in fact once the weather broke and it started raining the rioting fizzled out. Damage done by then though.
If I remember correctly, the rioting spread outwards - it spread part of the way down Smithdown rd. Also, sporadic rioting broke out in areas like Croxteth, Stockbridge Village (Cantril Farm, as it was known then) - and I can't recall which other districts - but there were definately other incidents.
Where I live in Anfield, nothing happened here that I know of. Anfield didn't have any of the problems then that it has today.
If the rioting took place now, I'm sure most of the Scalls around here would jump on the bandwagon.
They soon dropped the attitude when they saw what was dished out to the Liverpool police. A friend of mine from Newcastle had a brother who was in charge of the Newcastle police sent over. They were expecting a hostile reception, but were shocked when people were clapping them on the way in. They soon realised the problem was the Liverpool police and would not go on the front line in Parli with them. They did tell other police forces to behave themselves so as not to get the population against them. People knew them because of the slightly different uniforms and would offer them tea, but not to the Liverpool police.
That's interesting Waterways.
This copper from Newcastle told his brother that "the Geordies were too stupid to riot". There were no riots in the North East, which was more deprived than Liverpool. He said "look what the government is doing for them now". After the government promised to put money into Toxteth (well Liverpool 8 before the TV said it was Toxteth - people will copy anything if it is on the telly).
Newcastle was more deprived than Liverpool in 1981 ?
Liverpool had Police bussed in from all over the North, not just Geordieland. And Toxteth was not a 'Black Riot'.
Suss laws..heheh!!
Yep. If there was any differnce there wasn't much.
They came from everywhere. Some were reluctant to send police fearing their own towns and cities would blow up too.Liverpool had Police bussed in from all over the North, not just Geordieland. And Toxteth was not a 'Black Riot'.
Suss laws..heheh!!
Ok you claimed it... now provide us with the stats and facts.
No they came from the north of England... Birmingham and many other cities and towns had their own problems to keep a lid on, remember ?They came from everywhere. Some were reluctant to send police fearing their own towns and cities would blow up too.
As you are psuhing the point and appear to know it all, then you giev us them.
That is what I said.No they came from the north of England... Birmingham and many other cities and towns had their own problems to keep a lid on, remember ?
MORE than 100 would-be entrepreneurs have benefited from a scheme in Toxteth to help get new businesses off the ground.
BizFizz was set up two years ago under the supervision of urban regeneration charity, the Civic Trust. It is based in the Toxteth TV centre, which offers TV and video production training for young people.
It employed a business coach, Stephan Nichols, to attempt to stimulate economic development from the bottom up by aiding the transformation of good business ideas into viable enterprises.
This week, as Toxteth marked the 25 years since the riots left the area devastated, a special event to celebrate the success of the project was held at the Kuumba Imani Millennium in Princes Avenue.
Now several of the people who have built successful businesses after receiving help want to give something back by offering their own support and expertise to the project.
Ian Harvey, from the Civic Trust in Liverpool, said: "People living in areas like Toxteth face major barriers to starting their own business so Stephan will try to address the individual needs of each client and tailor the help accordingly.
"What he does for one client might be completely different to what he does for another."
Underpinning Mr Nichol's role is a board of established business people who attempt to help the would-be entrepreneurs take their ideas onto the next level.
There are still major challenges faced by those who live and work in the area, 25 years on since the riots. Socio-economic inequality is still a significant barrier to upward mobilty among the local population.
Following the riots Liverpool and Toxteth, in particular, became the test-bed for a series of initiatives that transformed the face of urban Britain. However when it comes to unemployment, deprivation, health and education Toxteth is still towards the bottom of the deprivation index.
Initial funding for BizFizz will soon end but those behind the project hope new money can be found quickly.
Paul Squires, BizFizz manager at the Civic Trust said: "BizFizz is an entirely local initiative designed to stimulate economic development by aiding good business ideas into viable enterprises."
tonymcdonough@dailypost.co.uk
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Waterways you made a claim with your fingers, now back it up with your mouth.
And NO you did'nt, you said "they came from everywhere" ..
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