YO! Liverpool
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 36

Thread: When a garden is not a garden

  1. #1
    Senior Member Colin Wilkinson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    484
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 28 Times in 21 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default When a garden is not a garden


    Caryl Gardens, 1975

    Myrtle Gardens, 1977


    Sir Thomas White Gardens, 1973

    I have always been somewhat bemused by the habit of naming Liverpool’s inter-War tenement blocks ‘Gardens’. A less appropriate word would be hard to find for those rather austere blocks. They do have their champions, amongst them architectural writer Owen Hatherley, whose recent book A Guide to the New Ruins of Great Britain, examines the legacy of the architecture and urban regeneration of New Labour. Travelling through Britain, he ends up in Liverpool where he compares the bungalow mentality of the Militant regime to the 1930s schemes designed by Sir Lancelot Keay, Liverpool’s City Architect and one of the leading planners in the country.
    Hatherley complains that the great vision and confidence that took Hamburg, Vienna, Berlin and Rotterdam as its influences to create monumental architecture for the working classes had been reduced to uninspired suburban architecture that had been transplanted into key city centre sites. (Not just Militant – the last tenements were demolished in 2001 in Old Swan to make way for a Tesco store). The issues are never straightforward. Liverpool’s rapidly declining population had precipitated a rethink on housing requirements and the tenements were no longer popular with tenants (indeed I remember filming deliberately burnt out flats in blocks off Park Road where tenants were hoping to be rehoused in the new houses that were being built). Grand architectural statements are one thing – the wishes of the public are another, although it is constantly disappointing why small scale public housing is usually so drab and uninspiring. To quote Hatherley: “It leads to depressing juxtapositions – as at the point where the grand sweep of the major surviving thirties tenement block, St Andrew’s Gardens meets a piddling close of nineties semis, with the Metropolitan Cathedral in the background. The scale is preposterous, with the houses seeming to desperately want to be somewhere less dramatic ..”

    More...


    ADVERTISING



  2. #2
    Came fourth...now what? Oudeis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North London
    Posts
    908
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default

    Is that an Austin A40 I see before me?

  3. #3
    Senior Member M6AJJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Norfolk
    Posts
    83
    Thanks
    2
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    No, that's a Cortina Estate!!

  4. #4
    Re-member Ged's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Here, there & everywhere.
    Posts
    7,198
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 5 Posts

    Default

    Great pics Colin, you come up trumps once again.

    There are a number of tenement blocks still in existance.

    Wavertree Gardens are now private apartments called Abbeygate.
    Nelson street tennies with a glass panelled lift are still thriving in china town.
    Acorn apartments make up part of Sussex Gardens off Upper Warwick street.
    Blackhorse lane houses an angled block and nearby there are blocks on Muirehead Avenue and Adshead Road.
    Also part of Portland Gardens now houses a sheltered accommodation.
    Great Richmond street blocks were sold to a private investor and they are now St Annes apartments.
    Part of Mytrtle Gardens still exist, Barretts having renamed them Minster Court.
    There may even be one or two more that have slipped my mind for now.
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Lizzie1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Liverpool
    Age
    65
    Posts
    291
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    If I'm not mistaken, part of the wall around Tommy White gardens is still there.

  6. #6
    Re-member Ged's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Here, there & everywhere.
    Posts
    7,198
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 5 Posts

    Default

    Yes, the lower sandstone wall on Pentose street is actually part of the former St. Domingo house which preceded Tommy Whites.
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Lizzie1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Liverpool
    Age
    65
    Posts
    291
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ged View Post
    Yes, the lower sandstone wall on Pentose street is actually part of the former St. Domingo house which preceded Tommy Whites.
    they don't make 'em like that anymore!

  8. #8
    Re-member Ged's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Here, there & everywhere.
    Posts
    7,198
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 5 Posts

    Default

    Notice in the Myrtle Gardens photo, the lift shaft brickwork is of a different colour. That's because all tenement lift shafts were only added in 1950 after a directive from central government. The 5 storey height was a Government policy in the 30s when most were built. (though I have actually seen evidence of a 6th landing where blocks were built on an incline and so the lower part's extra storey did not break the rule - seemingly)
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

  9. #9
    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    888
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    they don't make 'em like that anymore!
    Such is the nature of modern day developers and architects that they cannot see beyond their nose that what was past can be brought up to date just by merely decorative external rendering to their front elavation and with a little ingenuity 2 flats could be knocked into one on one level or all levels to house larger familys.

    Imagine TW's painted externally in a nuetral colour....beats the sh*t out of high rise flats.

  10. #10
    Re-member Ged's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Here, there & everywhere.
    Posts
    7,198
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 5 Posts

    Default

    The reason they build from scratch is to do with not having tp pay VAT like they would when modernising. You'd think it'd be the other way round wouldn't you in order for landlords et al to kick start renovation on already exisiting stock. It is economically more viable to allow places to fall down, (sometimes helped on with mysterious fires or the chipping away of the structures) and to start again which is just nuts.
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

  11. #11
    Mark JMLE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Liverpool
    Posts
    178
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    There's a road off Blackmoor Drive called Eaton Gardens which must harp back to something that used to be there.

  12. #12
    Re-member Ged's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Here, there & everywhere.
    Posts
    7,198
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 5 Posts

    Default

    And a pooosh sounding Summer Gardens off Westminster Road.
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

  13. #13
    Martin hmtmaj's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Stoneycroft / Old Swan
    Posts
    851
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JMLE View Post
    There's a road off Blackmoor Drive called Eaton Gardens which must harp back to something that used to be there.
    Suspect it will be from Eaton House Gardens
    Started the Old Swan Website:

    http://oldswan.piczo.com/?cr=5

  14. #14
    Senior Member lindylou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,678
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ged View Post
    And a pooosh sounding Summer Gardens off Westminster Road.
    ..and Richmond Park, Anfield.

  15. #15
    Came fourth...now what? Oudeis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North London
    Posts
    908
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lindylou View Post
    ..and Richmond Park, Anfield.
    I don't know what lies behind the corner in Richmond Park now, but back in 1928 (yup, it's that book again) before the St. Georges RC Industrial School Athletic Ground there is/was the West Derby Union Test House.
    Just sayin'...

  16. #16
    Mark JMLE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Liverpool
    Posts
    178
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hmtmaj View Post
    Suspect it will be from Eaton House Gardens
    What about the New Orchid Garden a bit further down from Alder Hey?

  17. #17
    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    888
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    In colour/
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Sir-Thomas.jpg 
Views:	71 
Size:	108.6 KB 
ID:	24212  

  18. #18
    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    888
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    This was more or less its original colour......as was most of the gardens....
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Sir-Tho.jpg 
Views:	712 
Size:	109.1 KB 
ID:	24213  

  19. #19
    Senior Member lindylou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,678
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oudeis View Post
    I don't know what lies behind the corner in Richmond Park now, but back in 1928 (yup, it's that book again) before the St. Georges RC Industrial School Athletic Ground there is/was the West Derby Union Test House.
    Just sayin'...

    You might be getting mixed up with Richmond Row (L3, I think)

    I've never heard of a school of that name in Anfield.

    I think Richmond Park L6 was originally known as Richmond Hill - I'll have to consult my ancient maps to refresh my memory
    Anyway, I think it was a park of sorts consisting of residential villas as a gated estate. Only two villas still existed until recent times - or 3 if you count the old vicarage which is also now well gone.
    Elm house still exists - which I think was included as part of the Richmond Park estate.

  20. #20
    Re-member Ged's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Here, there & everywhere.
    Posts
    7,198
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 5 Posts

    Default

    The West Derby Union workhouse was on that site Lindy. It was accessed from Belmont road and those high walls on Richmond Park were around the grounds at the rear.
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

  21. #21
    Senior Member ellergreen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Surrey
    Posts
    64
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ged View Post
    Notice in the Myrtle Gardens photo, the lift shaft brickwork is of a different colour. That's because all tenement lift shafts were only added in 1950 after a directive from central government. The 5 storey height was a Government policy in the 30s when most were built. (though I have actually seen evidence of a 6th landing where blocks were built on an incline and so the lower part's extra storey did not break the rule - seemingly)
    Brings back memories of when my dear old Gran used to visit us in Portland Gardens.
    Dad and I used to go down and 'chair-lift her up to the 'D' floor.
    If a man speaks in the forest and no woman hears him, is he still wrong ?

  22. #22
    Came fourth...now what? Oudeis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North London
    Posts
    908
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ellergreen View Post
    ... 'chair-lift her up to the 'D' floor.
    Is that "Haberdashery, or socks, ties, hats, underwear and shoes..."


    BTW...

    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...YouBeingServed

  23. #23
    Senior Member lindylou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,678
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ged View Post
    The West Derby Union workhouse was on that site Lindy. It was accessed from Belmont road and those high walls on Richmond Park were around the grounds at the rear.
    Living in Wolverton st, I know it well

    When we were kids we used to sneak a peep around the gate into Belmont rd hozzy ( we wouldn't dare venture into the grounds) -- there was a side gate in Richmond Park (now bricked up). Also, my Richmond Park neighbours worked in the hospital.
    I have been in Belmont hospital as a visitor in later years. I also remember the convent next door on Belmont rd side.

    I knew that the hospital was originally a workhouse, my nan still used to call it that sometimes even when it was a hospital.
    I have vague memory that it's official name was The West Derby Union workhouse - but my nan always just referred to it as the workhouse.
    Even after it became a hospital, there was still a section in the grounds, Lower Breck rd end, that was known locally as 'the cubicals' - I've mentioned here on other threads a few times. It was for homeless - and was literally cubicals, ie, cell shaped partitions with a bed. The cubicals were still there in the 1960s. The reception was just past the ambulance depot which still exists on Lower breck rd. It would have been approx around about where the old age care home Rowan Garth is now.
    There was no school called St Georges. If there was it must have been before 1900's ..
    It's not on my old maps and I've never heard Anfield elders mention it.

    As I say, Richmond Park was an area of gated villas. early 1800s probably.

    ps, the hospital was only demolished 1980s - I have pics of the grounds after demolition.

  24. #24
    Senior Member ellergreen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Surrey
    Posts
    64
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oudeis View Post
    Is that "Haberdashery, or socks, ties, hats, underwear and shoes..."


    BTW...

    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...YouBeingServed
    We even heard Mr Grace telling us "You've done a fine job"
    If a man speaks in the forest and no woman hears him, is he still wrong ?

  25. #25
    Came fourth...now what? Oudeis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North London
    Posts
    908
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lindylou View Post
    You might be getting mixed up with Richmond Row (L3, I think)

    I've never heard of a school of that name in Anfield.

    I think Richmond Park L6 was originally known as Richmond Hill - I'll have to consult my ancient maps to refresh my memory
    Anyway, I think it was a park of sorts consisting of residential villas as a gated estate. Only two villas still existed until recent times - or 3 if you count the old vicarage which is also now well gone.
    Elm house still exists - which I think was included as part of the Richmond Park estate.
    It cannot be easy for me to get mixed-up...what with the little I know anyway.

    R.Pk. Is Tue Brook way. R.Row, I see as a long main-drag that terminates on Scotland Road. The R.Pk in this book is a dog-leg that begins/ends on 'Coer' (?) Breck Road & Townsend Lane.

    Not that I am any further forward.

  26. #26
    Senior Member Norm NZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Age
    85
    Posts
    608
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Hey!! Don'tt forget my early abode, Speke Road Gardens!!! (The nicest of all! imho)

  27. #27
    Member Blue70's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Liverpool
    Posts
    42
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    St. Joseph's Home also known as St. Joseph's House was next to the hospital in Belmont Road. It was a catholic old people's home run by nuns.

    Blue

  28. #28
    Senior Member lindylou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,678
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oudeis View Post
    It cannot be easy for me to get mixed-up...what with the little I know anyway.

    R.Pk. Is Tue Brook way. R.Row, I see as a long main-drag that terminates on Scotland Road. The R.Pk in this book is a dog-leg that begins/ends on 'Coer' (?) Breck Road & Townsend Lane.

    Not that I am any further forward.
    Yes, Richmond Park is a dog-leg from Breck rd (with Holy Trin church on the corner) to Lower Breck rd.

    ---------- Post added at 10:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:38 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue70 View Post
    St. Joseph's Home also known as St. Joseph's House was next to the hospital in Belmont Road. It was a catholic old people's home run by nuns.

    Blue
    Yes that's it - St Joseph's, run by 'Sisters of the poor'

  29. #29
    Senior Member collegepudding's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    out & about -when not at home
    Posts
    221
    Thanks
    5
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oudeis View Post
    I don't know what lies behind the corner in Richmond Park now, but back in 1928 (yup, it's that book again) before the St. Georges RC Industrial School Athletic Ground there is/was the West Derby Union Test House.
    Just sayin'...
    You were pretty much correct in your post Oudeis.....The Test house covered roughly the present day area between Belmont Grove and the parallel stretch of Richmond Park.
    The St Georges RC Industrial School Athletic Ground adjoined it on the site of the Present St Margaret's C of E School and was all part and parcel of the Workhouse complex . Before moving to the Workhouse Site the Mixed Industrial School had been at West Derby Rd and prior to that it was at the Netherfield Rd area.
    The Girls School eventually split and moved to various locations.

    collegepudding

  30. #30
    Came fourth...now what? Oudeis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North London
    Posts
    908
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default

    I doubt that I was either right or wrong. I was only telling it as it is displayed in the cherished 1928 map book.
    I did wonder quite what was being tested.
    I have learned enough here though for me not to rely on this book to get me around present day Liverpool.

    It's all good clean fun.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

For daily updates, to support us further or to join in the conversation: Follow us on Twitter @YOLiverpool / Like our Facebook Page: @yoliverpoolpics / Join the Facebook Group: YO! Liverpool Pictures

× Thanks for coming to the web site. Support our future by turning off your Ad-Blocker or consider a donation via PayPal or Credit Card!