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Thread: Boy at gate but where?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Colin Wilkinson's Avatar
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    Default Boy at gate but where?

    Stan Zabecki sent me today’s photograph. A lovely photograph, it was taken by Frank Dugan, the American GI whose work has appeared here before. It is not an image I can remember from the portfolio Frank showed me back in the early 1990s. My first reaction was that it was taken at Princes Park Gates [...]
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    Senior Member Davec's Avatar
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    Great photo again Colin.

    I'd be very surprised if that was Princes Park gates - the roads look too narrow and the right angle of the pavement looks out of place.

    If I had to guess, I would say it was around the Park Way/Selboorne st. area because of the yellow bricked houses. There also used to be a public toilet up that way which may account for the wrought-iron work.


    I decided to read the text below the photo and now see you have already discounted Princes Park, sorry Colin.

  3. #3
    Came fourth...now what? Oudeis's Avatar
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    In my fumbling around I found this, which may be of interest...

    http://www.francisfrith.com/wallasey...n=google.co.uk

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    Martin hmtmaj's Avatar
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    Hi Colin, another gem.

    Initialy I though it was by the Arkles / around Anfield but then noticed those are 3 storey Terraced Houses !
    Someone must know, come on, where are or where were 3 story terraced houses ?

    Thanks Colin, Mart
    Started the Old Swan Website:

    http://oldswan.piczo.com/?cr=5

  5. #5
    Senior Member GNASHER's Avatar
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    Not Newsham Park.

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    Senior Member johnny blue's Avatar
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    Looks like Belvedere Road / Devonshire Road, Im sure there is another gate to Princes park along there.

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    Senior Member lindylou's Avatar
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    Could it be Worcestor rd, Bootle ? Derby park perhaps ?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Senior Member az_gila's Avatar
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    Since Park gates don't usually close in day time, could it be an entrance to a yard or factory - rather than park gates?

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    Martin hmtmaj's Avatar
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    I agree with Davec, they could be wrought iron around the underground Toilets that used to be around the city
    Started the Old Swan Website:

    http://oldswan.piczo.com/?cr=5

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    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
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    This is Newsham Park,though what part I ain't got a clue? Judges Drive area maybe? most of the gates are lost on newsham Park but the house are similair to those in the pic.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Davec's Avatar
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    The wide street running from the top in this LRO aerial shot is Selbourne St, and the street that runs across it just before if 'dog-legs' is Parkway.
    Of the 3 rows of houses in Parkway only the right hand 2 rows remain.
    I think the lad is standing in the dog-leg of Selbourne St. with the no longer existing block of houses behind.
    A no-entry sign is still used in the street.

    http://archive.liverpool.gov.uk/dser...ge=9078_75.jpg

    A shot from Google street view which would be to the right of young lad.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  12. #12
    Martin hmtmaj's Avatar
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    I studied that google view earlier Dave and agree with you
    AND very well done for finding it


    Mart
    Started the Old Swan Website:

    http://oldswan.piczo.com/?cr=5

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    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hmtmaj View Post
    I agree with Davec, they could be wrought iron around the underground Toilets that used to be around the city
    The gates look a bit too fancy for public bogs. They look ecclesiastical or religious, with those gothic motifs. Could they be the back gates to the Princes Road Synagogue or to that chapter house (octagonal?) looking building (church???) to the east of the synagogue?
    Christopher T. George
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    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
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    I think the lad is standing in the dog-leg of Selbourne St. with the no longer existing block of houses behind.
    I'll go along with that Dave,and as Mart said a good find.

    I'm thinking those cast iron gates? where the entrence to the church opposite the houses?,but Im not too sure whether what is front now has been there since the photo was taken?

    Below is the front view of those house I think? and the second view is whats facing those houses across the road.

    Attachment 22459Attachment 22460
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  15. #15
    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
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    the gates would have belonged to the building with the white arrow,what that building is I don't know because theres a church there on the site now.

    The other white arrow is the houses in the pic,well done again Dave...Princess avenue.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Senior Member az_gila's Avatar
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    Could it have been Corporation offices? They where almost church like at one time.

    Here is a later and smaller one still on Garston Old Rd.


  17. #17
    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
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    Here is the chuch that got demolished in Colins pic and a new church erected in its place which is still standing.
    Sadly it doesn't show the side of the gates.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Martin hmtmaj's Avatar
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    Think I agree with you ( for once George )

    Colin, give Dave and George a coconut

    Mart
    Started the Old Swan Website:

    http://oldswan.piczo.com/?cr=5

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    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
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    I fink the new church or the building alongside was a school for the deaf?

    But the case is solved in my view but what was the name of the old church on Park Way/Princess Ave?

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    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgePorgie View Post
    Here is the chuch that got demolished in Colins pic and a new church erected in its place which is still standing.
    Sadly it doesn't show the side of the gates.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Princes Road 1928.jpg 
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    Great detective work, Davec. But isn't the church in the LRO view of 1928 the same church that is visible in the distance in the Google view in post 11?

    Chris
    Christopher T. George
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    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
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    No Christopher, it wasn't the same church as the 1928 pic,the new church was erected to the same specs with various differences and the brickwork in 1928 matched the surrounding houses ie white brick whereas the new church is all redbrick.

    google it and you see slight differences to that in 1928,particulary the architecture over the doors.

    Sherlock strikes again.

    ---------- Post added at 03:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:30 PM ----------

    I've found out where the gates where? there is an Electrical substation been built where the gates would have been.

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    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    Hi George

    Thanks for that explanation about the rebuilding of the church and also for identifying where the gates would have stood. This has been a most interesting puzzle and fascinating to read all the input into identifying the location.

    Chris
    Christopher T. George
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    Senior Member grekko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgePorgie View Post
    No Christopher, it wasn't the same church as the 1928 pic,the new church was erected to the same specs with various differences and the brickwork in 1928 matched the surrounding houses ie white brick whereas the new church is all redbrick.

    google it and you see slight differences to that in 1928,particulary the architecture over the doors.

    Sherlock strikes again.

    ---------- Post added at 03:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:30 PM ----------

    I've found out where the gates where? there is an Electrical substation been built where the gates would have been.
    GP, is this roughly the area you mean? Click image for larger version. 

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    Senior Member az_gila's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgePorgie View Post
    No Christopher, it wasn't the same church as the 1928 pic,the new church was erected to the same specs with various differences and the brickwork in 1928 matched the surrounding houses ie white brick whereas the new church is all redbrick.

    ...
    Since it was such a close rebuild, could it have had bomb damage in the blitz and needed a quick major rebuild, so they kept the old outline?

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    Member Lyns's Avatar
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    I have no idea about location but its such a wonderful pic I want to show more people. I presume its ok to do that?
    Flickr . Please take a peek if you are interested

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    Senior Member Colin Wilkinson's Avatar
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    Thanks for all the effort. I visited Selbourne Street today and - for a moment - thought the gates were still there outside the octagonal Deaf and Dumb Institute but they were not the same ones (although they look as if they have been there for some time - see photo). Also, the buildings opposite were not the same.
    I'll have another visit tomorrow.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  27. #27
    Senior Member GeorgePorgie's Avatar
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    Colin the gates would have been here on the otherside of the building......

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Senior Member grekko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgePorgie View Post
    I'll go along with that Dave,and as Mart said a good find.

    I'm thinking those cast iron gates? where the entrence to the church opposite the houses?,but Im not too sure whether what is front now has been there since the photo was taken?

    Below is the front view of those house I think? and the second view is whats facing those houses across the road.

    Attachment 22459Attachment 22460
    GP, I think the first photo is looking at corner of Northbrook and Parkway.and the church in the second photo, that's the old Welsh Presbyterian church at the top of Upper Hill Street,and the tramway ran across the view from there.

    ---------- Post added at 11:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:11 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgePorgie View Post
    Here is the chuch that got demolished in Colins pic and a new church erected in its place which is still standing.
    Sadly it doesn't show the side of the gates.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Princes Road 1928.jpg 
Views:	105 
Size:	26.5 KB 
ID:	22467
    GP,Can't find a record of demolition and rebuilding , when did it happen?

  29. #29
    Senior Member Davec's Avatar
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    Colin, the little lad is smack bang in the middle of the road, so for the 'gates' to swing out that far they would have to be something rather special - at least in terms of width.

    I really don't think that they belong to a building on either side of the road.

    This is where I was thinking the action had taken place - the angle is as near as I can get it and the landscape on the left is totally changed, apart from the wall.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  30. #30
    Senior Member grekko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Davec View Post
    Colin, the little lad is smack bang in the middle of the road, so for the 'gates' to swing out that far they would have to be something rather special - at least in terms of width.

    I really don't think that they belong to a building on either side of the road.

    This is where I was thinking the action had taken place - the angle is as near as I can get it and the landscape on the left is totally changed, apart from the wall.

    Do you think he'd be positioned somewhere like this?Click image for larger version. 

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