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Thread: World War II air raid shelters and defenses in the Liverpool area

  1. #61
    Newbie Degsy_b's Avatar
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    Talking Dragon's Teeth Removal (ouch)!

    Hi,
    If anyone else would like to contact the MP about the Dragon's teeth than they can follow this link http://findyourmp.parliament.uk/comm...ons/l/446.html
    That will get you to Maria Eagle MP for Garston. You can leave an email message or the address of the House of Parliament is also on that page.

    Let me know if you get a reply I think you can contact me through this forum or email me on derek@worldwar2defences.co.uk


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    Thanks for your enthusiasm!

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    Newbie peter's Avatar
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    Default liverpool air raid shelters

    up till a few years ago booker avenue school in allerton had shelters in the playground. i work sometimes at heron eccles playing fields and the headmaster sometimes let us store machinery in them. been in them a few times they were above ground, long and low ,and had thick concrete roofs.
    inside they had seperate rooms which were staggered to confine any blasts.
    unfortunately they have now been demolished to upgrade the playground.i am sure the school will have some pictures of them. there is an old man who lives by us who claims to have been one of the few survivors of the blast in clint road school by durning road . unfortunately i believe the boilers received a direct hit and most victims were scalded to death. Harry said he dragged himself out of the rubble and staggered to his grans house who then told him off because he was filthy. hope this helps. pete.

  3. #63
    Senior Member knowhowe's Avatar
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    I remember Fort Crosby very well. we used to go there a lot as kids. Used to get there either via Hall Road (though i can't for the life of me remember the route from there now) or by crossing the Liverpool-Southport railway line somewhere beyond S n i g g e r y Woods in Little Crosby. The return trip was always via Hall Road as there was a tap mounted on a wooden pole there that we'd descend upon with delight after a day playing in the arid old fort.
    (To my astonishment, actually photographed by Sirob- http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/sho...?t=8390&page=6)
    It was a massive concrete construction set back from the seashore and half-buried by dunes. If you climbed to the top there was a wide circular groove in the concrete where a gun mounting used to be. There were lots of odd nooks and corners and rooms whose walls were inscribed with mysterious words in white paint.
    Another source of wonder for me was that the place was strewn with the bones and skulls of rats, all bleached white- except for the yellow teeth. Thousands of them. I used to fill my pockets with them but my mam always kicked up a stink when she found them and chucked them out. We never ever saw a live rat though- what the beggars lived on there anyway I have no idea, there was nothing but sand...
    The place was a wonderland of imagination for us, the perfect setting for all manner of war games. I've no idea when it was demolished or why. It would have been an interesting building to have preserved as a memory of the war in Merseyside. It was in pretty good nick the last time I saw it in the mid-60s. Anyone know what's there now, if anything?

    On the subject of pill boxes, there's one tucked into the rural back lane that links Little Crosby village with the Southport by-pass. A quiet spot even today, hard to imagine Nazi invaders passing that way.
    Last edited by knowhowe; 04-22-2008 at 12:30 AM.
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    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    A pic of the Allerton pillbox on Springwood Avenue:

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/lsauld/...2242121198@N01
    Christopher T. George
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  5. #65
    Senior Member christy's Avatar
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    There was an air raid shelter in Croxteth park near the bridge over the river Alt heading out from the Mansion towards Crocky and past the old tree. It was a big mound of built up earth with a concrete surround doorway that at the time you had to drop into. It is well away from the house and in the middle of some trees next to the river. Must still be there?

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    Senior Member Waterways's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Degsy_b View Post
    The main worry about an invasion of Liverpool or the Lancashire coast, was in the event of Southern Ireland falling to the Nazis. The Sinn Fein leadership in Eire were very supportive of Hitler, indeed they took a wreath to the German Embassy in Dublin on hearing the of the suicide of Adolf! It should be mentioned at this point that the Government of Eire remained neutral throughout the war. But suspicions remained and it wouldn't have been the first time the Germans had gone through a 3rd country to meet their military objective. So there was some risk if a bit remote.
    The north of the island of Ireland was in the UK with forces stationed there, which could be quickly reinforced. Any Germans attempt to occupy Eire, invited or not, would have been repelled. And there was a plan to full occupy Eire if need be. The chances of an invasion attempt on the west coast of Great Britain was so remote it was not worth contemplating.

    Strangely enough one of the first places to be fortified with anti invasion defences was Orkney, and not in the south east England as you might imagine. I suppose with the early presence of German forces in Norway and its Ideal fjords for disembarking an invasion force made it seem like a good bet. On top of which the British fleet had its base in Scapa Flow in itself making it a good candidate for attack.
    The south coast was well prepared and there were few places to mount an invasion with high cliffs all along that coast. Any invasion attempt there would have meant certain defeat - as General Jodle said, it would be like putting his troops through meat grinder.

    Orkney was islands and not easily re-taken if an invasion attempt, by paras and sea, was successful. Although the Germans supplying the place by air and sea would have been near impossible
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  7. #67
    Martin hmtmaj's Avatar
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    This is my dad, aged about 20, outside an air raid shelter during WW2, I thought it was Fitzgerald Rd in Old Swan, but could be around Greenfield Rd ...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cadfael View Post
    There were some on the 'GreenHill' bridge spanning between Chelwood Ave and Bentham Drive in Childwall, but you can also see a good amount of them in undergrowth while on the loop line in the Halewood area.
    There are dragon's teeth in the bushes on the Greenbank Park side of the Stalbridge Road railway bridge. Though now heavily overgrown now, they were clearly visible when I was youngster in the 60/70s.

    There used to be a substantial concrete air-raid shelter outside the now demolished Westfield House in Greenbank Lane. (Removed when the Greenbank Project Sports Centre was constructed some years ago).

    Dovedale Road School still has above ground air-raid shelters in the school yard.

    The large Stanley Tobacco Warehouse has lookout (firewatching?) posts on the roof - they are quite noticeable if you look carefully - as the brick work appears newer than the main structure.

    John

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    ChrisO ChrisO's Avatar
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    I'm sure there's a pillbox (or similar structure) in Maghull, where the railway line crosses the Leeds & Liverpool canal. I think it can be accessed by the road leading to Durrants cottages.

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    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisO View Post
    I'm sure there's a pillbox (or similar structure) in Maghull, where the railway line crosses the Leeds & Liverpool canal. I think it can be accessed by the road leading to Durrants cottages.
    Hi Chris

    You will find discussion and images of the pillboxes in Maghull and Lydiate here:

    The Leeds Liverpool Canal at War

    Best regards

    Chris
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  11. #71
    Keeping It Real !!!!!!!!! ItsaZappathing's Avatar
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    Speaking of the war..
    Here's a letter/postcard that was sent to my mum from a German P.O camp. by my great uncle.
    Hope some of you find it of interest
    The envelope.




    THE POSTCARD
    (Addressed to Fontenoy Gardens)


  12. #72
    Senior Member edwardo's Avatar
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    Default Ancestry

    For all who are looking up there ww1 hero's Ancestry.co.uk is free to look up all this month.Well worth a look.one poor boy with the same name as grandad thats how i got to see it .as next of kin addrres he had put his school.some of it is hard reading.hope this is the right place to put this.

  13. #73
    Senior Member marky's Avatar
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    Re: Stalbridge Avenue dragon teeth. The bushes have recently been cut down, to reveal the concrete pyramids. There are several of them.
    Last edited by marky; 11-19-2008 at 10:38 PM.

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    Senior Member irishseashipping.com's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marky View Post
    Re: Stalbridge Road dragon teeth. The bushes have recently been cut down, to reveal the concrete pyramids. There are several of them.
    I noticed yesterday passing the old "Westfield" house site in Greenbank Lane - that the concrete air raid shelter I refered to is still there. Just to the left of the entrance - opposite Merebank flats.

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    Senior Member marky's Avatar
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    Re: Greenbank Lane: I know there's a very small building in the front garden of the Gym. I have a picture of this if it is the building you mentioned.

    Stalbridge Avenue:

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    Senior Member irishseashipping.com's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=marky;156144]Re: Greenbank Lane: I know there's a very small building in the front garden of the Gym. I have a picture of this if it is the building you mentioned.QUOTE]

    Interesting to see the Stalbridge dragons teeth free from undergrowth. They used to appear like this in the 60s when I was little though one appears to have started to flake away.

    As for Greenbank Lane is the small barrel roofed concrete building partly buried in the earth between the gate and the cottages.

  17. #77
    Senior Member marky's Avatar
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    Here's the Greenbank Lane building I was thinking of:

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    Default Fort crosby

    Quote Originally Posted by davegore2005 View Post
    Here is one for the history buffs among us, my family and myself were walking on the path from the coastguard station out towards Hightown and Formby today and I mentioned to my wife that there used to be what I imagine to be old air raid shelters dug into the sand dunes somewhere along there, I remember climbing down into them when when I was many years younger.

    We walked as far as the waste water treatment pumping plant but for the life of me i could not place where the shelters were, or even how far they are from the coastguard station...any help to jog my memory would be gladly appreciated

    Dave



    We walk there regulary with our dogs and i have seen wot u r talking about...its quite out in the open...if you r still interested I will look next time i go and tell you exactly where it is...u r still able to get down into it cos my children have been down... elliekr41

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    pfft Spike's Avatar
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    Kew Street off Scotland Road had a shelter. Anyone know anything about it? any maps? anything? My family used it.
    BE NICE......................OR ELSE

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    Fine, photographs, Zaps and Marky! Very interesting stuff!

    Chris
    Christopher T. George
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    Newbie Alan Smithee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post
    I read this on the Echo forums, please excuse the fact that I've cut and pasted both parts of the conversation.
    Makes for interesting reading.

    'I remember as a kid visiting a cousin in Kirkby. There was some sort of camp, huts and asbestos pipes overhead, I recall next to some park with a bowling green, anyone know what this was?
    He used to take me to Kirkby industrial estate were there was still old war pill boxes, is that the word? made of thick concrete with slits I presume for guns? Also, an old rail track running between the old factories, I remember a wood next to it all, I heard that there where munitions factories in Kirkby during the war, anyone know about that?'

    '......Yes......one sixth of all the munitions used in the war were made in kirkby and the Bunkers can still be seen in Draw Well road where they used to separate the trains into smaller groups in case of an explosion....it was referred to as Port Kirkby to confuse the germans who were looking for it.....the Royal Ordnance factories were built from 1936 onwards(They knew it was coming didn't they)....I bought 'Mysons' office block and most of the buildings had extremely tough walls and light roofs so they would blow off in an explosion....The 'Echo' have photographs of RAF bomber pilots visiting the girls who made the bombs on the estate....I don't know if there are any books written about Kirkby's part in the war(Might be an idea eh!) but I met a man who'd worked on the estate all his working life and he told me that on the right hand side of the 'Admin' building was where they made detonators....when they had a tray full a man would walk out and down the path at the side preceded by a man with a whistle and a red flag....anyone near would get down into the slit trenches at the side until he'd passed and he would be holding these things like a tray of eggs (true).......My mother told me that the girls who filled the bombs went yellow with the chemicals....an old black man asked could he look in my factory one day and told me he'd worked there during the war and he'd come back here for a visit from Barbados...he said that torpedoes had been made in that very building. I've got lots of snippets of information but would love someone to enlighten me further on this subject....Kirkby Industrial estate was very important in the war effort and people should know about it....along with the camp in Huyton and 'Fort Crosby'....just past the coastguard station at Blundellsands (Now demolished).....local history and so so interesting.....there is a well used film clip of a Lancaster bomber dropping a 10 ton 'Grand Slam' bomb and it always flicks through my mind whenever I see it.....Made in Kirkby.'

    (From Tonycrosby and chancery3)


    I remember the pillbox in Kirkby very well, located at the back end of that piece of greenery near the Industrial estate.

    The ground near Simmonswood lane was pretty flat and there used to be lots of Sunday morning football played there - but near the back of the flattened area were a series of 'dunes'...a sort of hilly area just before you got to the estate itself (not far from the Birds Eye factory), and in the middle of this was a pillbox.

    As young kids, this was an endless source of fascination to us, and many a war-game ewas played around this structure. It was quite small, a very low ceiling inside, with a small, short tunnel to gain access to it.

    Though it has to be said...my one abiding memory of it was that it was generally used as a place to relieve oneself when caught short. It was often littered with various little 'offerings' of all sorts from small boys. You tended not to spend too much time inside there, such was the general odour...

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    Senior Member wsteve55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan Smithee View Post
    I remember the pillbox in Kirkby very well, located at the back end of that piece of greenery near the Industrial estate.

    The ground near Simmonswood lane was pretty flat and there used to be lots of Sunday morning football played there - but near the back of the flattened area were a series of 'dunes'...a sort of hilly area just before you got to the estate itself (not far from the Birds Eye factory), and in the middle of this was a pillbox.

    As young kids, this was an endless source of fascination to us, and many a war-game ewas played around this structure. It was quite small, a very low ceiling inside, with a small, short tunnel to gain access to it.

    Though it has to be said...my one abiding memory of it was that it was generally used as a place to relieve oneself when caught short. It was often littered with various little 'offerings' of all sorts from small boys. You tended not to spend too much time inside there, such was the general odour...
    Ha Ha,
    sound just like the one we "used", in Kirkdale!

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    Senior Member marky's Avatar
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    Fort Crosby, June 2009. Part of a larger site/camp, demolished in the '60s.

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/2563250...1717/?edited=1

    Location:
    http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&so...7&z=19&iwloc=A

    This site has a couple of earlier pictures:
    http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache...1-775a96200b1b

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    Senior Member GNASHER's Avatar
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    This is a fire watchers(?) post on top of Liverpool Uni

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    It could well be a fire watchers' post.

    There are similar additional structures on the top of the Stanley Dock Tobacco Warehouse.

    John

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    Default fort crosby

    i my self used to play in the bunkers on crosby beach from about 1988 to 94, i've since found out a lot more info. Crosby fort used to have hundreds if not thousands of german prisoners of war. check this link out as a starting point.

    http://www.crosbyherald.co.uk/news/c...8459-22296186/

    this guy is friend of my mums and he's done a few books like this about the crosby area..

    the german prisoners used to put plays on for the locals as i understand it. think it was torn down in the 60's although it was still partly in some use in the 50's.

    My older cousin was convinced there were more tunels connecting some bunkers. I have been as deep as you can go in the larger bunker an its impossible to say if they extend or are linked because of the ruble, sand, and rubbish in there. my cuz actually went as far as to set off a small home made exposives in the dunes next to the bunkers trying to uncover further passages, obviuosly i know now this was a bad idea but boys will be boys! and no he never did find that elusive hidden bunker! i know around crosby the took down signs to confuse the germans if they ever did land. Theres a boundary stone by my mums which marks where great crosby and little crosby are, it points in a certain direction, its been there for years an years, they even defaced this just incase it helped the ememy find the way.. some really intresting facts like the old duck pond being used for bull fights and many more detailed storys all factual... like i say a good read indeed..

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    Default Underground shelter in back garden

    Hi everyone know am late but if anyones interested I have a underground air raid shelter in the back garden. Its puzzling me on what type though because it seems to be an anderson shelter inside although it is fully underground with concrete roof walls and stairs going into it, looks like a professional job and not something knocked up during the war. It is partially filled in I am in the process of getting all the crap out of it.
    My grandad filled it in years ago when he bought the house. I cant find any information on this type of shelter being used so if anyone has or knows were I can find out would be much appreciated.

    BTW the house is by broadway in norris green.

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    That's interesting Dave.

    I know there's an air raid siren on the roof of St. Georges Hall which must have been a good vantage point.
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

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    The shelters at Dovedale School have been demolished...as I found out, when I went to photograph them recently.
    Google Streetview:
    http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&so...12,358.29,,1,5

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    Quote Originally Posted by 87_dave View Post
    Hi everyone know am late but if anyones interested I have a underground air raid shelter in the back garden. Its puzzling me on what type though because it seems to be an anderson shelter inside although it is fully underground with concrete roof walls and stairs going into it, looks like a professional job and not something knocked up during the war. It is partially filled in I am in the process of getting all the crap out of it.
    My grandad filled it in years ago when he bought the house. I cant find any information on this type of shelter being used so if anyone has or knows were I can find out would be much appreciated.

    BTW the house is by broadway in norris green.
    Could it be a Cold War "fear of nuclear bombs" shelter, and not a WWII one?

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