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Thread: George Kelly Cameo Cinema Murder

  1. #31
    Senior Member SteH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisGeorge View Post
    Hi Steve


    ADVERTISING




    No I have not read the Shortall book. Connolly and Kelly of course contended they did not even know each other. If Shortall is right that Connolly was involved in the Cameo murders, why didn't he turn in the gunman instead of contending, as I believe his counsel argued at his second trial, that Kelly did the murders -- a story that he later recanted?

    Chris
    Shortall states that if the testimonies of the witnesses were true then Connolly could have planned the robbery. He also has letters from an MP who was trying to get the case re-opened on behalf of the Kelly family in his appendices. The letters say that as Connolly wont make a statement on what he knows, there'd be no chance of getting things re-opened.

    There's no real explanation in the book as to why, given that Connolly changed his plea to guilty, he didnt go on to name the gunman.

    I'm fully with Skelly on this one anyway, I cant see why Connolly would maintain his innocence till his death 45 years after the event if he was guilty -surely at some point he would have confessed all to put the Kelly family's minds at rest.
    Last edited by SteH; 02-15-2007 at 11:33 PM.

  2. #32
    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteH View Post
    Shortall states that if the testimonies of the witnesses were true then Connolly could have planned the robbery. He also has letters from an MP who was trying to get the case re-opened on behalf of the Kelly family in his appendices. The letters say that as Connolly wont make a statement on what he knows, there'd be no chance of getting things re-opened.

    There's no real explanation in the book as to why, given that Connolly changed his plea to guilty, he didnt go on to name the gunman.

    I'm fully with Skelly on this one anyway, I cant see why Connolly would maintain his innocence till his death 45 years after the event if he was guilty -surely at some point he would have confessed all to put the Kelly family's minds at rest.
    Hello Steve

    I received the following information from George Skelly which might clarify some things from his perspective.

    In George's opinion, Richard Whittington-Egan has not written any worthwhile account of the Cameo case. In his book Liverpool Roundabout he simply recounts Balmer's now totally discredited scenario, and states that he briefly met Kelly in the Big House pub on Lime Street.

    George feels that Shortall's scenario doesn't make sense.

    George notes that there is confusion in Shortall's book about whether the crime was planned in the Beehive pub or in the Boundary Pub. At first, the plotters are in the Beehive pub planning the crime, then without any change of scene or time lapse, when they are leaving the pub it has suddenly and magically become the Boundary pub -- which was nearer to the Cameo and over 2 miles away from the Beehive.

    Shortall also maintains that Donald Johnson was the Cameo killer. Johnson was a thin fair-haired, slightly built man -- yet every witness at the cinema and outside stated on oath that the killer was dark haired, with dark eyebrows and stockily built.

    George further talks about Shortall's assertion that Connolly was involved as the killer's accomplice and would not speak to MP Sydney Silverman.

    George says that the reason for this, according to what Connolly told George, was that although he was willing to co-operate with both Mr Silverman and a Daily Express reporter, he discovered at the last minute that George Kelly's relative - who was the initiator and go-between - was motivated by money and that as a consequence Connolly decided to withdraw his co-operation. Connolly was going to state formally to the Silverman and the reporter that despite his guilty plea to robbery at the Cameo, he was in fact innocent, did not know Kelly, and believed that Kelly too was innocent.

    Chris
    Christopher T. George
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  3. #33
    Walden
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    My mum and dad were in the cameo the night of the murder - alas mum had no further evidence about the case to offer and couldn't even remember what film they watched. Anyone know what it was just out of interest?

  4. #34
    Senior Member SteH's Avatar
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    According to George Skelly's book the main picture was Bond Street

  5. #35
    Walden
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteH View Post
    According to George Skelly's book the main picture was Bond Street
    Cheers! I'll mention that to my mum see if she remembers it.

  6. #36
    DaisyChains
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    I have just finished reading Mr Skelly's book, and never have I felt so emotional and moved after reading any account of crime (I am a fan of true crime books-morbid I know!)

    I just wondered though....Mr Skelly goes into great detail in the book about things people were saying and doing, for instance when Northam, Dickson and Balmer are together concocting statements....how does Mr Skelly know what they said and how those statements were thought up?
    I am not critisising at all, would just be fascinated to know really!!

  7. #37
    Newbie Chrisk's Avatar
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    George Skelly is an amazing writer and a man with a genuine sense of injustice. I suppose living and breathing the Cameo Murders for nearly 60 years makes him the no 1 authority on what happened and you can be assured that his book is 100 per cent accurate. I congratulate George Skelly and his friend Lou Santangeli for their tenacity and dedication. Indeed I believe it was Mr Santangeli was the person who discovered the statement from Graham that was never declared at the trial and would undoubtedly have resulted in a different verdict.

  8. #38
    Senior Member steveb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntiPathos View Post
    Someone on here raises an interesting point and I'd like to expand on it with a question -

    Can anyone provide an example of Mr. Slemen discovering any unique, verifiable and substantial information about any of the criminal cases which he has "investigated" which cannot be otherwise ascertained via any pre-existing published material ?

    AP
    Ermmmmm, no. Having read some of what Mr Slemen has written, a lot of
    it seems to be hearsay, stuff allready published and pure myth.
    Surely fact info on the Cameo murders can be found in the LRO or court
    records.

  9. #39
    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisk View Post
    George Skelly is an amazing writer and a man with a genuine sense of injustice. I suppose living and breathing the Cameo Murders for nearly 60 years makes him the no 1 authority on what happened and you can be assured that his book is 100 per cent accurate. I congratulate George Skelly and his friend Lou Santangeli for their tenacity and dedication. Indeed I believe it was Mr Santangeli was the person who discovered the statement from Graham that was never declared at the trial and would undoubtedly have resulted in a different verdict.
    Hello Chrisk

    You are correct that Mr Lou Santangeli discovered the statement by Graham that showed that the prosecution had held back pertinent evidence in the case. His role in finding this information is explained in an interesting PDF file on the Cameo case from the Royal Courts of Justice in October 2003. This explains why the court found the convictions of George Kelly and Charles Connolly to be "unsafe" because of the mishandled prosecution and probable wrongdoing of Detective Chief Inspector Balmer in, as George Skelly describes it, framing Kelly and Connolly for the murders.

    Chris
    Christopher T. George
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  10. #40
    Senior Member AntiPathos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steveb View Post
    Ermmmmm, no. Having read some of what Mr Slemen has written, a lot of
    it seems to be hearsay, stuff allready published and pure myth.
    Surely fact info on the Cameo murders can be found in the LRO or court
    records.
    Thanks. That wasn't a rhetorical question which I posed, BTW. I'd genuinely like to know.

    AP.

  11. #41
    Newbie Chrisk's Avatar
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    Hi Chris, I am aware of the 2003 Judgement particularly page 3 Para 4 " All that evidence was false and probably deliberate so" or page 8 para 27 " Nevertheless when the evidence of Graham at both trials and of CI Balmer at the first trial to the effect that the two had not met in the context of the case prior to 19th September is taken into account, and in the absence of any explanation for such testomony, the conclusuion is that such evidence amounted to deliberate concealment becomes at the least highly likely" or page 25 para 97 "Indeed the lies of Graham and CI Balmer in relation to when they first saw one another in relation to the Cameo murders are are a strong indication of the need for concealment"

    I believe there is still unfinished business here. I know both verdicts have been quashed and Kelly got a christian burial but what about Balmer, he seems to have got off scot free. No doubt George Skelly's book will be very revealing about the seemingly injustice of Burns and Devlin at the hands of a bent detective. Will Balmer escape again? Here is a Police Officer who went right to the top and was highly decorated to the point of receiving the QPM and OBE . Should those awards be withdrawn? I think that they should and will be if I have anything to do with it!

  12. #42
    DaisyChains
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    that's a really interesting point.
    If Kelly is now cleared of the crime, surely Balmer's honours should be taken away.
    If Kelly didn't commit the crime, then he was obviously a scapegoat

    How very sad this case is

  13. #43
    Newbie Chrisk's Avatar
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    The important point is that Balmer has been proven to have lied and a man lost his life as a result. Something should be done about it.

  14. #44
    elec-trucker Store 3's Avatar
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    Exclamation re-meccano

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisk View Post
    George Skelly is an amazing writer and a man with a genuine sense of injustice. I suppose living and breathing the Cameo Murders for nearly 60 years makes him the no 1 authority on what happened and you can be assured that his book is 100 per cent accurate. I congratulate George Skelly and his friend Lou Santangeli for their tenacity and dedication. Indeed I believe it was Mr Santangeli was the person who discovered the statement from Graham that was never declared at the trial and would undoubtedly have resulted in a different verdict.
    the name ( lou santangeli ) is known to me did he work in meccano....

  15. #45
    Senior Member Mark R's Avatar
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    The Cameo Cinema in 1958. Thanks to Harold Ackroyd
    Last edited by Mark R; 12-27-2008 at 10:28 AM.
    It is Accomplished

  16. #46
    DaisyChains
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    was there ever a Muder Casebook magazine about the Cameo murders?

  17. #47
    Senior Member Mark R's Avatar
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    I'm not sure...There doesn't seem to be one on the list here:

    http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Magazine-Ba...QQftidZ2QQtZkm
    Last edited by Mark R; 12-31-2007 at 07:45 PM.
    It is Accomplished

  18. #48
    Chris48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisk View Post
    Hi Chris, I am aware of the 2003 Judgement particularly page 3 Para 4 " All that evidence was false and probably deliberate so" or page 8 para 27 " Nevertheless when the evidence of Graham at both trials and of CI Balmer at the first trial to the effect that the two had not met in the context of the case prior to 19th September is taken into account, and in the absence of any explanation for such testomony, the conclusuion is that such evidence amounted to deliberate concealment becomes at the least highly likely" or page 25 para 97 "Indeed the lies of Graham and CI Balmer in relation to when they first saw one another in relation to the Cameo murders are are a strong indication of the need for concealment"
    The above quote was mine under an old username. What I have posted was an extract from the court of appeal judgement on the Cameo case and the traversty of justice that occured in this case and resulted in the execution of George Kelly in 1950 and the wrongful conviction of Charles Connolly. The appeal judges said that Chief Inspector Herbert Balmer had lied. Balmer was awarded the Kings police and fire service medal for his meritorious work on this case.....and he lied! He sent an innocent man to his death and another to prison for 10 years. So what I want to know is this.

    Why has Liverpool Council included Herbert Balmer in a publication celebrating "800 names of people who helped shape our city"?. Are they proud of what Balmer did? Click on this link, scroll to the very bottom and then count up 17 lines.

    http://www.liverpool.gov.uk/Images/tcm21-100996.pdf
    Last edited by Chris48; 01-23-2008 at 02:18 PM.

  19. #49
    Chris48
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    I can feel a letter to the Echo coming on here!

  20. #50
    DaisyChains
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris48 View Post
    Why has Liverpool Council included Herbert Balmer in a publication celebrating "800 names of people who helped shape our city"?. Are they proud of what Balmer did? Click on this link, scroll to the very bottom and then count up 17 lines.

    http://www.liverpool.gov.uk/Images/tcm21-100996.pdf

    This is utterly disgusting!

    Any news on the film plans?

  21. #51
    Chris48
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    George is still busy with the screenplay Daisy and the Cranbourne Road book.

  22. #52
    DaisyChains
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris48 View Post
    George is still busy with the screenplay Daisy and the Cranbourne Road book.
    Brilliant!
    Can't wait for both!

  23. #53
    Chris48
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaisyChains View Post
    I have just finished reading Mr Skelly's book, and never have I felt so emotional and moved after reading any account of crime (I am a fan of true crime books-morbid I know!)

    I just wondered though....Mr Skelly goes into great detail in the book about things people were saying and doing, for instance when Northam, Dickson and Balmer are together concocting statements....how does Mr Skelly know what they said and how those statements were thought up?
    I am not critisising at all, would just be fascinated to know really!!
    It really is a great book isn't it Daisy. It is full of atmosphere and really captured my imagination. George is a good friend of mine and he is very busy with the Cranbourne book. He needs more information about Thomas Rimmer who was the son of the victim. I am researching Balmer and any information would be gratefully received about him.

  24. #54
    Senior Member ChrisGeorge's Avatar
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    Hi all

    I am presently reading the book The Innocent Man: Murder and Injustice in a Small Town by American novelist and former lawyer John Grisham. I would recommend it as a very disturbing but informative account of how police in Oklahoma "fitted up" what they conceived to be "likely suspects" in a couple of murder cases. What occurred was very similar to what the Liverpool police did under Balmer with Kelly and Connolly in the Cameo case and Devlin and Burns in the Cranbourne Road case.

    Chris
    Christopher T. George
    Editor, Ripperologist
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  25. #55
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    Default Cameo Murder

    Quote Originally Posted by emmagill View Post
    Hi

    My name's Emma Gill and George Kelly's my late Great Uncle. He was my Grandma's brother. I am doing a lot of research at the moment into the case. I have just discovered this website and have read some of the members' comments regarding my Uncle Georgie. I am sure I can rely on the knowledge and warmth of all you scoucers with this most importantly if any of you know of any details of the case being made into a film etc.

    There is an awful lot that I do know, privately within my family and I wish sometimes it were known publicly of the mental torment and heartbreak endured to my great grandparents and grandparents and great uncles during the trial and after Uncle Georgie's execution. To this day we still carry the scars and heartache in many different ways.

    I know there is still a lot of interest in the Cameo Cinema Murder in Liverpool. I don't live in the City but am up there regularly and follow the Mighty Reds all the time. Fingers crossed with Barca next month!!

    I look forward to hearing from anyone who has any thoughts.

    All the best.

    Emma Gill
    Hello Emma,

    I was a kid at the time and apparently George Kelly used to drink in the Leigh Arms at the top of Alfred and Cambridge Street, next to the rail depot. My uncles used to drink in the same pub.There was also a local rumour that the weapon was thrown into the pond at Botanic Park. Just thought I would pass that on.

  26. #56
    Chris48
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    It was more than a rumour that the gun was thrown into Botanic park lake. That suggestion was made to the Police in an anonymous letter to them which was eventually claimed to have been sent by the witnesses Northam and Dickson. The Police drained the lake and searched but never found the gun. It was also claimed that the gun was hidden in the vicinity of the cemetery on Smithdown Road where the birds can only reach it - or words to that effect. The lawyers Livermore and Heilbron took it upon themselves to search the cemetery themselves too.

  27. #57
    DaisyChains
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris48 View Post
    It was more than a rumour that the gun was thrown into Botanic park lake. That suggestion was made to the Police in an anonymous letter to them which was eventually claimed to have been sent by the witnesses Northam and Dickson. The Police drained the lake and searched but never found the gun. It was also claimed that the gun was hidden in the vicinity of the cemetery on Smithdown Road where the birds can only reach it - or words to that effect. The lawyers Livermore and Heilbron took it upon themselves to search the cemetery themselves too.
    would be amazing if the gun turned up in the cemetery now!

  28. #58
    Chris48
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    Be a good project for somebody with a metal detector!

  29. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris48 View Post
    It was more than a rumour that the gun was thrown into Botanic park lake. That suggestion was made to the Police in an anonymous letter to them which was eventually claimed to have been sent by the witnesses Northam and Dickson. The Police drained the lake and searched but never found the gun. It was also claimed that the gun was hidden in the vicinity of the cemetery on Smithdown Road where the birds can only reach it - or words to that effect. The lawyers Livermore and Heilbron took it upon themselves to search the cemetery themselves too.
    Hi Chris my name is Peter Connolly (charlies newphew) I would like to have a chat with you

  30. #60
    Newbie Peter Connolly's Avatar
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    Hi Chris, my name is Peter Connolly the nephew of charlie connolly I would like to have a chat with you regarding the cameo

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