Dont forget. George Skelly is giving his talk at the Court in St Georges Hall at 11am IN THE MORNING, SATURDAY 20 MARCH
I shall be giving a half hour talk at St George's Hall on Sat, 20th March on "Liverpool Juries: Did They Make The Right Decisions?" It will include examinations of the Wallace,Cameo and Cranborne Road trials.
George.
Did anyone attend the Talk by George Skelly at St Georges Hall Couirt. last Saturday, if so what did you think about it. Have you any comments on the subject???
It was too early for me, I was over the road in the records office until mid day. I would be interested to know what he had to say regarding the Wallace trial though I think most everything has already been said that can be.
I attended. And so I believe did Burkhilly. it was a great Talk. People were still queuing up outside after the talk had started. It was so packed people were sitting in the jury box and the press box. They even had to bring in extra chairs for people to sit in the Dock of the court!
Re the Wallace case Mr Skelly pointed out an important point in the context of juries verdicts. i.e. The Court of Appeal over-ruled the jury's Guilty verdict as "perverse" and not in keeping with the evidence. In other words their verdict was based on prejudice against Wallace. Yet, he pointed out in the subsequent 1950s Cameo, Devlin and Burns cases (and the earlier 1947 Walter Rowland case) the Appeal court - even when there was new evidence - would not hear fresh evidence or order retrials, Lord Goddard Stating, "We cannmot usurp the verdict of a jury". Like I say, a very important point which led to Rowland, Kelly, Devlin and Burns being wrongly hanged. Quite rightly Mr Skelly received great applause at the end. It was a fascinating and revealing Talk,
Great stuff.
It was a great talk. I particularly liked the similarities in the Cameo and Cranbourne Road murders (Insp Balmer, dodgy witnesses). I also wanted to ask George when his book on the Cranbourne Road Murder would be published, which will be in about nine months. I would have liked to ask one question, which is did he know why Balmer targeted Devlin and Burns, who came from Manchester, and fabricate the evidence that resulted in them being convicted? Hopefully this question will be answered when the book is published.
I know quite a lot about the Cameo Murders, through George's book and have read it on numerous occasions. I don't know a lot about the Wallace case, well not the way Ged does anyway! As for the Cranbourne Road Murder, I only know what I've read on Yo and a couple of other sites. i am really looking forward to reading this book, as the research GK has clearly done, will hopefully lead to Devlin and Burns being pardoned.
One of the main points I think was the fact that the police were so respected during past times, that juries didn't even contemplate a police officer lying or fabricating evidence. In the Cranbourne Road murder, the jury were asked to believe that two burglars had been in the house when the victim returned home. The burglars then killed her and left the house without taking anything. Devlin and Burns had never been involved in violence and had an alibi that they had been breaking into a warehouse in Bolton at the time Mrs Rimmer was murdered.
I just wish the talk had lasted longer - this for me was the highlight of the day.
Actually, Burkhilly, Mr Skelly did state that one of the reasons D&B were selected was that they were both on the run from the Manchester police and had been consorting with two young prostitutes in Liverpool at the time of the murder. (shades of jackie Dickson in the Cameo case). Also he did say their alibi was that they were breaking into a clothing warehouse in Manchester (not Bolton) and had produced numerous alibi witnesses, including their friend who had been convicted of it, yet the Liverpool jury still found them guilty. Shameful!
I too am looking forward to the full story in Mr Skelly's book.
By the way, by listening to the Radio Merseyside website, "listen again", I was able to hear an interview Mr Skelly did with Billy Butleron satrurday beforegiving his Talk.
Thanks for correcting me on my errors - which is why I'm looking forward to GS's book. As you say it is shameful that two young men were convicted and then hanged. The most poignant thing I heard during the talk was that the two young men are buried under a car park and their grave is marked by a tiny metal tag thingy. I felt really sad and close tears, believe it or not. I really hope that they are pardoned and the conviction quashed, which is clearly what GS would like to happen.
Thanks for the reports on George Skelly's talk, guys.
C
Christopher T. George
Editor, Ripperologist
Editor, Loch Raven Review
http://christophertgeorge.blogspot.com/
Chris on Flickr and on MySpace
I've heard elsewhere Burkhilly, that you may get what you hope for. mr Skelly has, i believe , as well as writing the book, referred the case to the Criminal Cases Review Commission with a view to exonerating the two men in the Court of Appeal
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I know that he was re buried in Allerton Cem, anyone know which RC section and plot number
Or was he cremated in Springwood
Thanks
Yes he is buried in Allerton Cemetery. My photos of his grave are on post 174 on this thread . His grave is (or was last year) unmarked and a shambles. The location is through the cemetery gates off Allerton road and then turn left. His grave is facing the entrance to Clarkes Gardens/Allerton Hall seperated from the road by the railings. In other words if you stood with your back to Allerton Hall and looked through the railings across the road, its there. Got a bamboo cheap surround on the grave and covered in crap. Disgraceful!
many thanks I will have a look on my travelsOriginally Posted by underworld
Steve
Think I've just spent the best part of an hour reading the posts on this thread and found it absolutely fascinating. I'd never been aware of any of the cases discussed until reading the thread. Just ordered a copy of George Skellys book with the library and look forward to reading it.
It's obvious that the whole affair was a tragic miscarriage of justice caused, in my opinion, by what appears to be a dubious "arm of the law". My heart goes out to the families of the victims who are no nearer now to seeing any sort of closure as they were 60 odd years ago.
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