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Thread: The Lost Village beneath Liverpool City Centre by Tom Slemen.

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    MissInformed
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    Default The Lost Village beneath Liverpool City Centre by Tom Slemen.

    The Lost Village beneath Liverpool City Centre by Tom Slemen.
    Taken from Haunted Liverpool 4. (page 24)

    “In 1934, the two and a half mile long Queensway Tunnel- the one which passes under the Pier Head- was finally completed. During the excavations to create the mouth of the tunnel near Manchester Street and Dale Street, the excavators made a strange discovery. They found the ruins of an ancient village, situated approximately 130 feet underground. The houses which made up this village seemed to date back to Tudor times but what was particularly weird, was the diminutive size of the buildings. The villagers who had once lived there must have been minute, because most of the doorways in the houses were only four feet in height. Unbelievable as it sounds, the village was not investigated further, because the authorities in Liverpool and Birkenhead had to finish the tunnel in time for the King and Queen to open it.
    So, beneath the streets of Liverpool City Centre, there is a mysterious village still unexplored. There were later claims that this village extended beneath the Lime St cuttings, and that part of the little town was exposed by a deep bomb crater near Copperas Hill during the second world war……”


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    Anyone have any ideas/comments etc?

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    Having researched old maps of the city centre and the fact Liverpool is not that old in relative terms to other towns and cities, it is highly unlikely that this story holds much water. The timing for the opening in the King and Queens calendar wouldn't have been an issue during early excavations either, as they opened the East Lancs Road, a library and Birkenhead park too on the same day so that all still had to be fitted in. I'm sure such a finding would have warranted further exploration and if further parts of this 'village' were exposed later on as Tom says then there was no King or Queen visit to prevent further exploration then was there? Still, this is a myth and folklore thread

  3. #3
    PhilipG
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    Does Tom Slemen ever give any reliable sources for these incredible stories?

    It's not just an underground village, but one inhabited by tiny people??!!.

    I know he's your cousin, Carrie, and I don't want to upset you, but really!
    Last edited by PhilipG; 01-03-2007 at 01:34 PM.

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    MissInformed
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilipG View Post
    Does Tom Slemen ever give any reliable sources for these incredible stories?

    It's not just an underground village, but one inhabited by tiny people??!!.

    I know he's your cousin, Carrie, and I don't want to upset you, but really!

    hi philip
    don't be silly... i was just putting it out there, as I was re-reading the book at lunchtime.
    I find it hard to fathom myself...
    But, he was appealing at the end of the story for more info...

    But I really wish he would put a bibliography in his books, or a few sources at least, so we could follow it up...

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    Senior Member SteveFaragher's Avatar
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    Default slemen's sources

    the main reason there's no sources is most of the stuff in his books are either made up, retold rubbish, or made up.......it would be nice if there was a miniature town under liverpool, but let's face it if you can't check something you can make up any old crap and make a handsome living on it by the look of things.

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    theninesisters
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    I have to say that when reading HL2 again (or it could be no 1), Slemen talked about a bomb falling on Edge Hill and that lots of rats could be seen on Mason Street.

    Although I really enjoy his stories, not only was he 20 years too late when giving a birthdate of Williamson but it would be virtually impossible for any amount of rats to run down Mason Street from the tunnels as no entrances were at ground level. Smithdown Lane I could understand but I think I can put this one as a 'fictional' story!

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    Senior Member SteveFaragher's Avatar
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    Default Just like the rest of the stories

    cockney rhyming porky pies, we used have name for a tall tale teller.Tom Pepper/Slemen.

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    Senior Member lindylou's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=SteveFaragher;41369]the main reason there's no sources is most of the stuff in his books are either made up, retold rubbish, or made up.......it would be nice if there was a miniature town under liverpool,


    It could be the Jam buttie mines inhabited by the diddy men.

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    They could form a football team and take over the 'small club' mantle from the blues .

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    Default Hobbits

    maybe it could be a middle earth based tourist attraction. hobbitpool

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    Default Slemen = Garth Marenghi

    I've only just got round to reading my first Tom Slemen book ('Haunted Liverpool 1'), but got bored about halfway through. Tales with verifiable facts, quickly start giving way to formulaic nonsense, where the protagonists can't be named, locations aren't specific, and the reported 'dialogues' could only have been accurate if CCTV and recording equipment had been in situ.

    Written in 1997, Tom seems to have been fortunate that his readership of the time didn't have access to the myriad electronic records now easily accessible via the internet. A simple trawl through the census returns - cross-referenced with the complete births, marriages and deaths records, from 1837 onwards, reveal that individuals alluded to (in those stories were any sort of personal information is supplied at all) seem never to have existed. Why am I not surprised?

    File under: 'harmless fictional entertainment'.

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    Gerard
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    Something in one of his books I believe about a Giant snake in the Bin Chutes of Gerard Gardens...
    I was in and out of Gerard Gardens all my Life as my Mams family moved in when they opened and I Lived there myself from 1977 till 1986 when they closed..
    I have never heard that tale in my life and the blaggard Slemen should be locked up under some descriptions act..
    Very naughty Tom Lad...

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    I've been looking in to the 'Rats down Mason Street' story for some time now and firstly it is totally untrue for one reason - before I stumbed upon the 'real' story! No rats or animals have ever been found in the Tunnels, simply because there is no food there. Rats do not go where there is no food.

    However, doing some research on the school on the corner of Chatham Place and Overbury street, this was struck by a bomb in WW2 and local residents (one who worked for the Liverpool Echo - and told the story) said that rats that were under the school (food/warmth) ran over Chatham Place and down the hill in their droves.

    Tom Slemen simply takes stories like these and spins em around I'm afraid.

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    Senior Member naked lilac's Avatar
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    Curiousity caught the cat!!!!
    I read the first post, which caught my sense of wonder... Well, ya might say, maybe these inhabitants were Trolls?
    Now a days, ya must take things and do your own investigating.. cause there is just tooo much shannagans going on in peoples words... but, when something keeps you guessing.. Like the Loc Ness Monster; Big Foot; Lost Cities, etc.. it is a great writers imagination that is behind it..and curiousity that thrives on it...

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    Quote Originally Posted by MissInformed View Post
    The Lost Village beneath Liverpool City Centre by Tom Slemen.
    Taken from Haunted Liverpool 4. (page 24)

    “In 1934, the two and a half mile long Queensway Tunnel- the one which passes under the Pier Head- was finally completed. During the excavations to create the mouth of the tunnel near Manchester Street and Dale Street, the excavators made a strange discovery. They found the ruins of an ancient village, situated approximately 130 feet underground. The houses which made up this village seemed to date back to Tudor times but what was particularly weird, was the diminutive size of the buildings. The villagers who had once lived there must have been minute, because most of the doorways in the houses were only four feet in height. Unbelievable as it sounds, the village was not investigated further, because the authorities in Liverpool and Birkenhead had to finish the tunnel in time for the King and Queen to open it.
    So, beneath the streets of Liverpool City Centre, there is a mysterious village still unexplored. There were later claims that this village extended beneath the Lime St cuttings, and that part of the little town was exposed by a deep bomb crater near Copperas Hill during the second world war……”

    Anyone have any ideas/comments etc?

    I can actually confirm that there is indeed an underground street beneath Lime Street. I recently went on a paranormal investigation with a company called Night Vision Investigations. They have got access to this amazing place which they say used to be the old liverpool slums. There are lots of buildings leading off the street with bars on all the windows. I would definatlly go along to one of their nights even if you're not into the Paranormal as it's not open to the public. I'm gonig back on 4th December as that's their next event.

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    So who do we see in order to get to see this underground street cupcake?
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

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    And are ther any pics getting taken and posted ?
    Started the Old Swan Website:

    http://oldswan.piczo.com/?cr=5

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    Quote Originally Posted by cupcake View Post
    I can actually confirm that there is indeed an underground street beneath Lime Street. I recently went on a paranormal investigation with a company called Night Vision Investigations. They have got access to this amazing place which they say used to be the old liverpool slums. There are lots of buildings leading off the street with bars on all the windows. I would definatlly go along to one of their nights even if you're not into the Paranormal as it's not open to the public. I'm gonig back on 4th December as that's their next event.
    Hi Cupcake, and welcome to Yo. Yes, very interesting indeed. One thing though, you'll need to back up your 'eyewitness testimony' with some rock hard solid facts. Slum streets were normally tarmaced over - a few feet at the very most beneath our 2010 feet. Upload your photos here, and let's see the facts of your case.

    Daz
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."... ... ... Mark Twain.

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    Senior Member John Doh's Avatar
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    18 posts on here already - and all of them based on one of Tom Slemen's stories. I had no idea that people took this kind of stuff seriously - even to the point of thinking they were worth rubbishing! I dare say it'll sell a few more copies of these works of fiction though, and fair enough so long as they are recognised as such.

    As for the 'paranormal company', I'm wondering how much it costs to go on one of their 'investigations'... A nice little earner, I'm thinking.
    In fact, this post could well be a promotional stunt for one or both of these enterprises... I hope subsequent entries, however, will prove me wrong...

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    Hi Ged, the company is Night Vision Investigations.
    Their website is www.nightvisioninvestigations.co.uk

    Right Dazza, I got loads of pics while I was down there so I'll upload them, bear with me though because I'm new to this so not sure what to do. I'm only going on what the group told me, they said they had a historian down there prior. I don't know what else it could be if not a slum?

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Doh View Post
    18 posts on here already - and all of them based on one of Tom Slemen's stories. I had no idea that people took this kind of stuff seriously - even to the point of thinking they were worth rubbishing! I dare say it'll sell a few more copies of these works of fiction though, and fair enough so long as they are recognised as such.

    As for the 'paranormal company', I'm wondering how much it costs to go on one of their 'investigations'... A nice little earner, I'm thinking.
    In fact, this post could well be a promotional stunt for one or both of these enterprises... I hope subsequent entries, however, will prove me wrong...
    hiya im june one half of night vision investigations, we do indeed have access to and underground area that made up of different shops/rooms on a street with back alleys ect... we are still investigating the possible paranormal occurances that have been reported there and as we are a scientific based company so we do not fake or create 'stunts' as you call it we are looking for hard evidence. Also if i may add we do our investigations for charity so we are a non profit organisation the previous investigation there was for help for heroes. If anyone would like more info please check out our web www.nightvisioninvestigations.co.uk thanks june

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    Quote Originally Posted by juney View Post
    hiya im june one half of night vision investigations, we do indeed have access to and underground area that made up of different shops/rooms on a street with back alleys ect... we are still investigating the possible paranormal occurances that have been reported there and as we are a scientific based company so we do not fake or create 'stunts' as you call it we are looking for hard evidence. Also if i may add we do our investigations for charity so we are a non profit organisation the previous investigation there was for help for heroes. If anyone would like more info please check out our web www.nightvisioninvestigations.co.uk thanks june
    So you're doing it all 'for entertainment'... but in a 'science-based' kind of way...... Well, no conflict there, then! Sounds like, erm... serious fun...

    I notice you're a trifle coy as to your locations, or what the Gallery photos purport to show... though many of the images are hardly of locations that are secret or even underground. Understandable perhaps - and perhaps it wouldn't do to share the info too widely?

    When you say you are a non-profit organisation, does that mean that all your fees go to support charities? Very commendable if so; but this is not made clear on your website.

    You refer to your 'consultants' as being 'professionals'. I'm wondering what qualifications they might have...

    You say you can't foresee any problems... I thought you had clairvoyants among your 'consultants'...

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    we do indeed have access to and underground area that made up of different shops/rooms on a street with back alleys
    Right then,use your loaf to boost the sales or interest by sticking up two or three photographs on the site...what we're seeing on your site is whats been seen by members on YO,if these are genuine shops Allyways? I'm sure you'll find quite a few sales bookings ordered overnight.

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    Hello June. Given that these underground streets, shops and alleyways are no longer inhabited nor accessible, who on earth is reporting the paranormal activities to you - ghosts?
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

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    Hmmm! wasn't the Kilns on the station site? and the first rail station was built in 1836 although it was a wooden structure

    # The first station at Lime Street, by John Foster Jnr with a wooden trainshed by John Cunningham and Arthur Holme, was opened 15 August 1836.

    # This station was replaced in 1849 by a new station on Lord Nelson Street by Sir William Tite. It included the first totally innovative iron segmental-arched vault trainshed by Richard Turner, built the year after he completed the Palm House at Kew, which marked the turning point in trainshed design. The rear wall of the 1849 station still exists along the back edge of platform 1.

    # This original trainshed was replaced, by LNWR, with a new trainshed in 1867 by William Baker. This is the existing north vault of the station.

    # The North Western Hotel was opened in 1871.

    # The second trainshed vault, by Francis Stevenson and E. W. Ives, was added in 1874. This is the current south vault of the station.

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    my dad used to work as a chef on Pullman trains in late 60's early 70's & he always used to go on about a street under Lime street....I'm sure he used to mention about a bakery.....I was only a kid when he used to talk about it ,I wish I'd of listened to him now
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    From the OP:

    Quote Originally Posted by MissInformed View Post
    The Lost Village beneath Liverpool City Centre by Tom Slemen.
    Taken from Haunted Liverpool 4. (page 24)

    “In 1934...During the excavations [for the Mersey tunnel]...the excavators made a strange discovery. They found the ruins of an ancient village, situated approximately 130 feet underground. The houses which made up this village seemed to date back to Tudor times but what was particularly weird, was the diminutive size of the buildings. The villagers who had once lived there must have been minute, because most of the doorways in the houses were only four feet in height...There were later claims that this village extended beneath the Lime St cuttings, and that part of the little town was exposed by a deep bomb crater near Copperas Hill……”
    Tom Slemen is completely wrong about this. The real truth of the matter is that...

    [Chapter one]

    'They are the Diddymen Jam-butty mines. Once regarded as folklaw. Knowledge of this was deliberately covered up by the authorites, due to the 'diminutive size' of the population which guarded the mine. It would have invited siege and attack if people from outside of these lands learnt of this new found source of carbohydrate, and the small force of people that protected it. Yes, the people of the Jam-butty mines were a fiecely proud lot, and despite their lack of stature had copious amounts of energy - on account of all the jam-butty's they ate. In the end they where forced to live underground. The medieval town they created/mined 'extended [far] beneath the Lime St cuttings', and was the real reason why Lime Street station was created on that particular site opposite St George's Hall; it was close to the first sidings that the Diddymen cart track that brought the butty's to town.'



    Thanks for reading. Well, someone had to set the facts straight here.
    [with apologies to Mr K.A.Dodd OBE]
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."... ... ... Mark Twain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by empeebee View Post
    So you're doing it all 'for entertainment'... but in a 'science-based' kind of way...... Well, no conflict there, then! Sounds like, erm... serious fun...

    I notice you're a trifle coy as to your locations, or what the Gallery photos purport to show... though many of the images are hardly of locations that are secret or even underground. Understandable perhaps - and perhaps it wouldn't do to share the info too widely?

    When you say you are a non-profit organisation, does that mean that all your fees go to support charities? Very commendable if so; but this is not made clear on your website.

    You refer to your 'consultants' as being 'professionals'. I'm wondering what qualifications they might have...

    You say you can't foresee any problems... I thought you had clairvoyants among your 'consultants'...
    ahahahahah bloody hell, so sorry to confuse you all, i dont really feel the need to explain myself or my organisation and what we do but we are just interested in paranormal investigation and old liverpool. I just thought you all where interested in the history of liverpool too? and possibly what we have found, i didnt come on here for my group or myself to be called into question ! sorry to have interjected people, good luck with your theories.......

    ---------- Post added at 01:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:44 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Ged View Post
    Hello June. Given that these underground streets, shops and alleyways are no longer inhabited nor accessible, who on earth is reporting the paranormal activities to you - ghosts?
    i wish it was that easy to talk to 'ghosts' ged! they are accessible to us and the people that gave us the access they asked us to investigate the reports of stuff going on and thats how we came across this amazing place, its still early days yet so we need a few more people to look at the site for their opinions im not a historian, i just love to do what i do, i work full time and so this is a cherished hobby, and if we can make some money for charities then so be it.....

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    Senior Member dazza's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by juney View Post
    I just thought you all where interested in the history of liverpool too? and possibly what we have found, i didnt come on here for my group or myself to be called into question ! sorry to have interjected people, good luck with your theories.......
    Carl Sagan once said, "extraordinary claims, require extraordinary evidence".

    We are "interested in the history of Liverpool", so much so, that we are willing to test any spurious claim that gets posted here.
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."... ... ... Mark Twain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by juney View Post
    i wish it was that easy to talk to 'ghosts' ged! they are accessible to us and the people that gave us the access they asked us to investigate the reports of stuff going on and thats how we came across this amazing place, its still early days yet so we need a few more people to look at the site for their opinions im not a historian, i just love to do what i do, i work full time and so this is a cherished hobby, and if we can make some money for charities then so be it.....
    Well June, nothing would please me better if you found some evidence during your investigations, but please - no moths in flight or dust particles caught in the flash that pass as orbs - or the forming of spirits (if you're Derek Acorah or Yvette Fielding) It was about 1976 since I was last down in that basement, I also went into the bowels of St. Georges Hall (and I don't mean the cells but the parts closed to the general public - full of dust/cobwebs/pigeon muck/old sweet wrappers and coins - dropped through the grids of Lime st over the decades) and i've yet to witness anything supernatural or paranormal but that could just be because i'm the type that never will so I'll never say it doesn't exist. More annoyed we didn't take photos than anything else.
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

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