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Thread: Pre WW1 German Community

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    Per Ardua Ad Astra bazzacat's Avatar
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    Default Pre WW1 German Community

    Waterways has mentioned a few things about this community, pork butchers, sculpting the Liver birds etc.


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    Is anyone able to elaborate?

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    FKoE
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    Quote Originally Posted by bazzacat
    Waterways has mentioned a few things about this community, pork butchers, sculpting the Liver birds etc.

    Is anyone able to elaborate?

    Firstly, where was this German community based?, were they Catholic or Protestant?, and has Waterways got any 'facts' other than just, there were Pre-WWI Germans living in Liverpool.

    I mean they brought us Scouse along with the Norwegians and Irish, Hitlers half-sister lived in the town during the Luftwaffes blitz's... I'd say, ask Watership he has a wealth of 'facts'

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    Per Ardua Ad Astra bazzacat's Avatar
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    I found this on a history of the sugar trade site, no doubt only refers to a small proportion:

    The German connection.
    Work in the sugar house was heavy, hot and subject to a degree of hazard. Illness was common, and life expectancy short. It was not attractive to the English worker and was even shunned by the Irish labourers (although they eventually made up the largest proportion of unskilled workers). It was because of this refiners recruited German workers in the 17th, 18th and 19th centuries. In fact, some of the refiners themselves were of German origin. This firstly applied to the large sugar industry in London and then progressed to Liverpool in the middle of the 19th century with the opening of Jager's refinery.
    It was usual for batches of about 2 dozen men to be brought over mainly from the Hamburg area. The pay was high, particularly if you were a skilled sugar boiler. The hours were long but there were perks - gallons of beer to replace the body moisture lost in the terrific heat!
    In Liverpool there was a large German immigrant population in the second half of the 19th century, some being connected with the sugar industry. In 1851 census there were 44 German born sugar workers. By 1881 this had risen to around 200.

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    Senior Member Howie's Avatar
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    See 'The Settlement of Germans in Britain during the Nineteenth Century' by Panikos Panayi.
    From the 1840s most German emigrants sailed out of Hamburg and Bremen. While many ships, especially those from Bremen, made their way direct to the U.S.A., indirect routes, sailing from Hamburg to east-coast British ports and then by rail to Liverpool remained important throughout the nineteenth century. Clearly, crossing the Atlantic via England meant a short stop in the country. Did any of the transmigrants decide to settle? This seems difficult to deny. In Liverpool, for instance, some emigrants who found work in the city decided to remain rather than to sail on to North America or Australia.
    Outside the capital tiny German communities developed in a few northern cities. Manchester, for instance, had the second largest community in 1911, counting 1,318. Constituent parts of the Manchester German community included Jews, middle-class businessmen, and people lower down on the social scale. A similar mixture existed in the smaller community in Bradford. The German community of Hull (855 in 1911) developed both due to the fact that the town lay on the route for transmigrants to the U.S.A. and to the fact that it was visited by German sailors. The same reasons explain the development of the largest provincial German community in Britain, which lay in Liverpool (1,326). However, this also counted an important group of merchants, as well as attracting sugar bakers in the early part of the nineteenth century. Smaller German communities also existed in other provincial centres.
    Outside the capital all of the major German settlements developed places of worship. Manchester, for instance, had three Protestant churches by the end of the nineteenth century, whose congregations divided upon geographical and class lines. German Protestant services in Liverpool had begun in the 1840s to serve visiting sailors, and by the late Victorian period the congregation averaged 300. The church developed a wide range of parish activities in the form of missionary and educational work. Other important congregations developed in Hull, Sunderland, Bradford, Edinburgh and Birmingham. Any attempt to measure the precise number of German Lutheran and Evangelical churches proves difficult, but a snapshot from 1913 lists fifteen locations in London and thirteen outside the capital. In 1914, 26 German pastors held positions in Great Britain
    Outside the capital, Manchester developed a middle-class German cultural life resembling Londonís. Its most famous club consisted of the Schiller-Anstalt, established in 1860 and counting Frederick Engels and Charles Halle among its members although by 1911 it had ceased to exist. The Manchester Turnverein began in 1860 and continued until the outbreak of the First World War, devoting much attention to the organisation of celebrations and excursions. Bradford middle-class organisations included the Schillerverein from 1861 and the Liedertafel from 1846, while the major societies in Liverpool were the Liederkranz and Deutscher Club.

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    Per Ardua Ad Astra bazzacat's Avatar
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    Thats brilliant, Howie, Thanks!!!

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    Gerry Jones Gerry Jones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FKoE View Post
    Firstly, where was this German community based?, were they Catholic or Protestant?, and has Waterways got any 'facts' other than just, there were Pre-WWI Germans living in Liverpool.

    I mean they brought us Scouse along with the Norwegians and Irish, Hitlers half-sister lived in the town during the Luftwaffes blitz's... I'd say, ask Watership he has a wealth of 'facts'
    Part answer for you; it was a German woodcarver who designed the Liver Buildings Birds. His name was Carl Bernard Bartels. Try www.gerryjones.me.uk then link to my pages about trying to have a Third Liver Bird built for 2008, and then link to a Bartels page about himself, and the shameful way he was treated. Or search Daily Post archives in icliverpool for a great article about him by David Charters.

    Gerry.

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