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Thread: Protecting Liverpool?s Heritage

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    Creator & Administrator Kev's Avatar
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    Default Protecting Liverpool?s Heritage

    Many of Liverpool's historical buildings are at risk of decay according to Save Britain's Heritage.

    An exhibition at Liverpool?s milkandsugar gallery aims to highlight the threat facing many of the city?s historical buildings.

    ?Triumph, Disaster and Decay?, has been organised by Save Britain?s Heritage (SAVE) and runs from 16 February to 6 March, 2009

    Robert Hradsky of SAVE put together the exhibition, which includes a section called ?Liverpool at Risk? featuring 40 buildings SAVE say are under threat, ?We published a report way back in 1984 called ?The Agony of Georgian Liverpool? which highlighted the plight of dozens of fine Georgian houses around Liverpool,? Robert explains.

    ?There?s still a significant number that are derelict today and decaying.?

    Famous losses

    The exhibition includes photographs from English Heritage?s archive collection showing some of the architectural losses Liverpool has suffered over the years including the Custom?s House and less well known buildings from the suburbs like Prescot Town Hall which was demolished in the 1960s.

    The display also features decorative ironwork which was salvaged from one of the city?s most famous losses, the Sailor?s Home on Canning Street which disappeared in the 1970s.

    Robert Hradsky says the economic problems that Liverpool faced in the late 20th Century contributed to the loss of many buildings, ?Liverpool has a difficult history of very severe economic decline from the ?60s right through to the ?80s, it was a very dark time for the cities heritage too.

    ?Liverpool?s such a fantastic city, the heritage that has survived is some of the most spectacular in England.

    ?The Georgian heritage is unequalled in the north of England.?

    Despite Liverpool?s recent redevelopment there are still many buildings in the city centre that SAVE believe are at risk ?There?s a number of Georgian houses on Duke Street and Seel Street,? says Robert Hradsky.

    ?There?s also the Wellington Rooms which is a fantastic Georgian building, beautiful Greek revival building with a very fine fa?ade and its lain empty since the ?90s, water has got in and damaged the plasterwork.

    ?There?s a ballroom inside with a frieze of dancing maidens and it?s a really important part of Liverpool?s heritage.

    ?The Seaman?s Orphanage in Newsham Park and the former Welsh Presbyterian Church in Toxteth which is completely roofless, it?s a terrible ruin, though it?s still a fantastic local landmark.?

    While the current economic downturn may hit the construction industry Robert believes it is often cheaper to reuse an existing building than to clear the site and start afresh, ?There?s so many proposals to knock buildings down and rebuild them that its actually more economically and financially viable to repair a building.?

    One of the most significant demolitions took place just after the Second World War, ?I think the greatest loss would have to be the Customs House which was demolished in 1947 after being damaged in the war,? explains Robert Hradsky.

    ?The shell of the building was intact but instead of being restored it was demolished.

    ?It was reported this was done to relieve unemployment, it?s a shame they couldn?t have repaired it to the same end.?

    Triumph, Disaster and Decay ? The SAVE survey of Liverpool?s heritage is at the milkandsugar gallery 82 Wood Street until 6 March, 2009.

    BBC Liverpool


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    Senior Member taffy's Avatar
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    Default Garston Hospital under threat of demolition

    Quote Originally Posted by Kev View Post
    Many of Liverpool's historical buildings are at risk of decay according to Save Britain's Heritage.

    An exhibition at Liverpool?s milkandsugar gallery aims to highlight the threat facing many of the city?s historical buildings.

    ?Triumph, Disaster and Decay?, has been organised by Save Britain?s Heritage (SAVE) and runs from 16 February to 6 March, 2009


    Triumph, Disaster and Decay ? The SAVE survey of Liverpool?s heritage is at the milkandsugar gallery 82 Wood Street until 6 March, 2009.

    BBC Liverpool
    It's not just the decaying buildings that are at risk. Liverpool Primary Health Care Trust plan to demolish the mint condition Garston Hospital and replace with a ticky tacky stainless steel building. See other posting on Yo Liverpool

    http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/sho...hlight=Garston

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    Senior Member Waterways's Avatar
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    Introduce Land Value Tax and those left to crumble will miraculously be occupied or renovated.
    The new Amsterdam at Liverpool?
    Save Liverpool Docks and Waterways - Click

    Deprived of its unique dockland waters Liverpool
    becomes a Venice without canals, just another city, no
    longer of special interest to anyone, least of all the
    tourist. Would we visit a modernised Venice of filled in
    canals to view its modern museum describing
    how it once was?


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    Newbie Roscoe's Avatar
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    Default SAVE Liverpool`s Heritage and VAT

    The biggest problem with redevelopment of our historic buildings is the VAT situation. If you redevelop a old building you do not receive any VAT refund. However if you knock it down and build new you can claim all the VAT back on your development costs.

    This anti heritage tax break needs changing and fast.

    Imagine if the situation was reversed then old properties would be valued 17.5% more than new buildings and a lot more of our Georgian and Victorian heritage would still be standing. Edge Lane would be more valuable than knocking it down and building the proposed new tin sheds along the road.

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    Re-member Ged's Avatar
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    Yes Roscoe, it's madness and that situation doubtlessly sways the developers.
    www.inacityliving.piczo.com/

    Updated weekly with old and new pics.

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    Senior Member mickeydoolan's Avatar
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    What ever happened to the sculpture that was situated on the south facing pediment of St Georges Hall?
    It was carved in Caen stone and has been removed.

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    Senior Member steveb's Avatar
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    The biggest problem is people just don't care.
    They umm an arrr but very rarely do anything.
    Shame but that is modern life

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    Quote Originally Posted by mickeydoolan View Post
    What ever happened to the sculpture that was situated on the south facing pediment of St Georges Hall?
    It was carved in Caen stone and has been removed.
    I think it was removed in the 40's/50's due to pollution damage! As far as I've read,it's in storage....somewhere? There was an article about the "artificial cast that was made of it,in the Echo,a few years ago,and it mentioned the cost of restoration,as being the main reason for not replacing it!I thought the cast looked pretty good,and thought they could use that...I mean,who'd know!!

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    Senior Member burkhilly's Avatar
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    People don't care. I was on a visit to Anfield Cemetary today and there are Catacombs there. I never knew we had catacombes in this city. Of course there's no roof on the building and it's falling down very quickly. There also used to be three chapels. There's only one left and again this is being left to rot. There's slate tiles missing and green slime up the walls. At least the windows are boarded up so the glass will not be broken by vandals.

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    Senior Member az_gila's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by burkhilly View Post
    People don't care. I was on a visit to Anfield Cemetary today and there are Catacombs there. I never knew we had catacombes in this city. Of course there's no roof on the building and it's falling down very quickly. There also used to be three chapels. There's only one left and again this is being left to rot. There's slate tiles missing and green slime up the walls. At least the windows are boarded up so the glass will not be broken by vandals.
    Allerton Cemetery is the same, the chapels there are turning into ruins...

    With all of the trouble and rules preserving buildings, you think they could at least dismantle them and use the stone to maintain/repair existing churches and halls.

    Last year I heard about all of the troubles St. mary's church in Grassendale had to go through just to add a bathroom due to their Listing status. Water also damaged the interior plaster, but they are not allowed to remove the plaster and expose the beautiful sandstone underneath - even though exposed stone was the standard at that time... Repair costs went way up because of this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wsteve55 View Post
    I think it was removed in the 40's/50's due to pollution damage! As far as I've read,it's in storage....somewhere? There was an article about the "artificial cast that was made of it,in the Echo,a few years ago,and it mentioned the cost of restoration,as being the main reason for not replacing it!I thought the cast looked pretty good,and thought they could use that...I mean,who'd know!!
    I don't understand how just one of the three pediment sculptures was affected by pollution. Why not all of them?
    How would you feel if it had been crushed?
    What it depicted was not to everyone's taste but it shows our heritage. It is our history & no one can change that.

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    Senior Member dazza's Avatar
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    St George's Hall, south pediment, with Britainia in the middle holding a olive branch in her left hand, and a spear in her right. At her left side is a lion, and at her feet, Neptune indicating her dominion over the sea.

    Sorry, cropped image.

    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."... ... ... Mark Twain.

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    Came fourth...now what? Oudeis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dazza View Post
    St George's Hall, south pediment, with Britainia in the middle holding a olive branch in her left hand, and a spear in her right. At her left side is a lion, and at her feet, Neptune indicating her dominion over the sea.

    Sorry, cropped image.

    BTW.
    I once searched for the value of old coins and came across others asking 'possible value' questions. One, describing an old penny (d) made mention of the depiction of the obverse as, "the lady in the wheelchair".

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    Oh that part of it. Hadn't it started falling on ppl ?

    I'm sure the bit in the echo I read (or it might have been someone on here) mentioned about a replacement with a different scene.

    Found something about it from the post

    http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/...4375-22670919/

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    Senior Member dazza's Avatar
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    [St. George's Hall - the empty south pediment.]



    Britainia, have you no home?
    No, dear sir, I eternally roam,

    Airy attic, views of Lime Street,
    An empire's seat, for weary feet.
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."... ... ... Mark Twain.

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    There is no place for Britannia, Sailors Home or Custom House,
    midst the steel and glass monstrosities of the modern home of Scouse.

    Reduced to road paving rubble, eh? Lovely , just feckin lovely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dazza View Post
    St George's Hall, south pediment, with Britainia in the middle holding a olive branch in her left hand, and a spear in her right. At her left side is a lion, and at her feet, Neptune indicating her dominion over the sea.

    Sorry, cropped image.

    From memory the pediment shown is the one facing Lime Street. The pediment missing its sculpture is the one facing St Georges Place.

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    Senior Member dazza's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickeydoolan View Post
    From memory the pediment shown is the one facing Lime Street. The pediment missing its sculpture is the one facing St Georges Place.
    Mickey, St. George's Hall only has one pediment. It faces south on to St. George's Place, as shown earlier.
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."... ... ... Mark Twain.

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    That had me thinking......but you're right Dazza,only one pediment,(arrowed)and yes Mickey,it was facing St.George's place!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by scouse smurf View Post
    Oh that part of it. Hadn't it started falling on ppl ?

    I'm sure the bit in the echo I read (or it might have been someone on here) mentioned about a replacement with a different scene.

    Found something about it from the post

    http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/...4375-22670919/
    That's interesting,"it was broken up for road fill" so I wonder where they got the cast from,that I saw in the "Echo" article,which wasn't so long ago??? Smells a bit like selective amnesia!

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    Senior Member dazza's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wsteve55 View Post
    That had me thinking......but you're right Dazza,only one pediment,(arrowed)and yes Mickey,it was facing St.George's place!
    Yes, with it being called the south pediment you'd expect another one? I had to check myself also.
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."... ... ... Mark Twain.

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    Senior Member Waterways's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steveb View Post
    The biggest problem is people just don't care.
    They umm an arrr but very rarely do anything.
    Shame but that is modern life
    They only care about football. Look at the cafuffle over Everton moving to Kirkby. Peel filled in historic water spaces and few cared. An IKEA look-a-like shed was built on an in-filled Kings Dock (dates from the 1700s) and they thought it was wonderful. It is easy to label Liverpudlians philistines.

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    Senior Member dazza's Avatar
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    I've always felt that Liverpool's heritage was sold lock, stock...to the nearest developer, with not that much resistance. The council were too afraid to reject proposals in the difficult decades, eyeing-up much needed revenues, at the cost of losing what we now call heritage.
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."... ... ... Mark Twain.

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    Senior Member Waterways's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dazza View Post
    I've always felt that Liverpool's heritage was sold lock, stock...to the nearest developer, with not that much resistance. The council were too afraid to reject proposals in the difficult decades, eyeing-up much needed revenues, at the cost of losing what we now call heritage.
    What is done is done and cannot be reversed. It is what we do from now on.
    • The dock waters must need protecting to stop sharp developers desecrating them - Liverpool and Birkenhead.
    • The transport policy must be towards extending the underground/metro using the tunnels available
    • Roads must be cut back with money spent on rapid-transit rail
    • Many roads in the centre/docks must be paved over - The Strand comes to mind
    • Quality iconic buildings must be built like a new Philharmonic Hall in the docks - the head of the Phil proposed.
    The new Amsterdam at Liverpool?
    Save Liverpool Docks and Waterways - Click

    Deprived of its unique dockland waters Liverpool
    becomes a Venice without canals, just another city, no
    longer of special interest to anyone, least of all the
    tourist. Would we visit a modernised Venice of filled in
    canals to view its modern museum describing
    how it once was?


    Giving Liverpool a full Metro - CLICK
    Rapid-transit rail: Everton, Liverpool & Arena - CLICK

    Save Royal Iris - Sign Petition

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    Default Rescue plan for the Wellington Rooms in jeopardy?

    The Heritage Works building trust which had been planning a project to conserve the Wellington Rooms on Mount Pleasant, has announced that owing to lack of funding it will close its offices and lay off staff.

    http://www.heritageworks.co.uk/news.htm

    It isn't clear what effect this will have on the proposed rescue plan for the Wellington Rooms which involved adapting them for use as a National Dance Centre for North West England. The building, which was most recently used as the Liverpool Irish Centre until the late 1990's, is apparently in a very poor state inside, and it remains on the English Heritage At Risk Register:-

    http://risk.english-heritage.org.uk/...type=all&crit=

    The Wellington Rooms is one of the glories of the Greek Revival style of architecture in Liverpool, and I personally have many happy memories of events at the Irish Centre. I dearly hope that this latest setback isn't as bad as it appears.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Nicodemus

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