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Thread: Ships and the Sea

  1. #91
    Newbie backsplice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brian daley View Post
    The Lampy on the Jason was called Vic,I cannot remember his second name ,but he had a brother who had something extraordinary happen to him ,he was swept overboard from the fore well deck and washed back on to the after deck; ring a bell with anyone? Vic was a big balding guy with strawbeery blonde hair .A nice guy . And big Albert Williams,Bluto was modelled on him, ring a bell? The screaming skull ? lovely man,I think not. But characters all, Blueys were loaded with them!
    Brian,
    That Lampy was Vic Blower, his brother's name was Jimmy.
    Vic was OK, his brother not quite so popular, Vic became shore bosun in Birkenhead after the enforced retirement of the previous incumbent, Sid Bainbridge.
    Amongst Vic Blower's achievements was the introduction to Blue Funnel of paint rollers, which had been resisted for years by less progressive elements in the company.
    The only screaming skull I came across was bosun of the Cunard cargo ship, Ivernia.
    Backsplice

    Last edited by backsplice; 02-12-2009 at 08:56 PM.

  2. #92
    Newbie backsplice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevin View Post
    I think all Yo non-sailors reading this thread will think the Merchant Navy was full of thugs and bullies. Maybe that was the case in the 50s and 60s, but I saw no evidence of it in the 70s and 80s.
    Did things change, or is it that with the passing of time it is only the more extreme characters that stay in the forefront of our memories?
    Kevin,
    There are thugs and bullies in all walks of life, and I have encountered many since I came ashore. but, on a ship, living and working with each other in close proximity for weeks and months does tend to exacerbate these traits.
    There was also a tradition of hard case bosuns going back many years, and Liverpool ships had their share of these, notably the famous Martin Quinn of the Empress Boats.
    However, the vast majority of my shipmates were decent hard working blokes who enjoyed life to the full. I remember these with affection.
    Regards,
    Backsplice
    Last edited by backsplice; 02-11-2009 at 03:29 PM.

  3. #93
    Captain Kong captain kong's Avatar
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    Not all ships had nut cases or bullies, but a lot of ships did.
    I was on a Star Boat. two Glaswegian lunatics terrorising the crowd, One night in OZ one came to our cabin looking to fill us in. we had formed a `syndicate` all for one and one for all. The big guy walk through the cabin door and four fists hit him at the same time, when he tried to get up a 2 gallon fire extinguisher was bounced on his head. rest of the voyage was peaceful.
    I went to Manchester to join the `Manchester Merchant`, I always sailed from Liverpool, I didnt know the place or the ships or the characters.
    first day just joined at 7am, I was having a coffee with my brother in my cabin, he had just run me there in his car. I heard banging and screaming and shouting coming down the allyway, then my cabin door was kicked open, a Bosun appeared, `Get on deck yer bast*rd,` I slammed the door in his face, the door is kicked open again "last time, get on deck or I`ll batter yer ".
    I slammed the door in his face again.and told him to go away , in French.
    There was a knock on the cabin door, "All right lad, when you have finished yer coffee, no hurry" , he closed the door quietly.
    I went on deck ten minutes later , said good bye to my brother, and then helped to drop the derricks, In the mess room later the crowd told me he was the hard case Bosun of Manchester. Everyone was scared of him.
    He was called Robertson, He was a very nice Bosun to me, I got loads of overtime, and not much work, always polite. Shows that if you stand up to them they are all softies underneath.
    Last edited by captain kong; 02-11-2009 at 05:04 PM.

  4. #94
    Senior Member brian daley's Avatar
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    Thanks for that Backsplice,Blower a surname that has eluded me for a long while. The Bosun on the Jason was a tubby old guy called Wilf,he was quietly spoken but knew his stuff, he looked after us peggies,worked us like horses but stopped the lads giving us too much of a hard time. You know what a peggy had to do in Blueys,non stop work from sun up to sun down. I can remember being sunk in sleep, my head resting in my arms on the mess room, I had scrapped up after the midday meal and should have been turned out to work on deck.I was just too bushed and had flaked. I had never known Wilf to be "soft" ,but in my sleepy state I heard him come into the messroom and say my name,I was struggling to wakefulness when I heard him say to Vic "Poor little sod, we've worked him too hard " and he left me there until the cook woke me to get afternoon smoko ready. I never forgot that. Some of the A.B's on that trip were Frankie Kerns, Peter Jermiah, Stan Hall, Alan Royds, The SOS's were Joe Hands, "Ruby" and "Bronco" .Joey King was one of the JOS's. And then there was Bootsie,Billo and me(I was nicknamed Andy for the rest of my time in Blu Flu) the deckboys. Happy Days,really!!
    BrianD

  5. #95
    Senior Member wsteve55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trader View Post
    I know what you mean about Jack Cleary, he was a bit of a bully but for some reason I got on OK with him. When he was pi--ed he was an animal.
    I only did one Aussie trip with Jimmy Mason and found him to be OK, I must have caught him when he was on the wagon
    Hi Trader,and Backsplice,
    just looking through your tales, when the name Jack Cleary appeared! I'm curious about him,as fairly recently,I was helping some guy with the same surname,to trace his family members,as he was adopted while a young kid! I managed to find his half-sister,but no sign at all,of his full brother,John,who apparently, was known as Jack,so I wondered if there was any connection? I can see that he didn't seem a very nice feller,but any info' on him,would be appreciated. An obvious question to ask you is,was he from Liverpool? Hope you can help.
    Thanks Steve.

  6. #96
    Newbie backsplice's Avatar
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    Brian,
    You are quite right, the peggies, particularly the sailors peggy had the hardest job on the ship. Can you remember staggering round to the messroom at 06.00, to find the gash bucket overturned and sh**e all over the deck?
    You had to work like a dog to get the accommodation ready for inspection at 10.00, and after that get prepared for the crowd coming off deck for smoko, then get ready for the seven bell dinners, then dinner for everyone else, then washing up, then turn to on deck, usually cleaning the ship's bell or some such useless job, and on and on it went until you collapsed in your bunk long after everyone else.
    Joe Hands I remember, he was sos on the Achilles, my first ship, a tall fair haired lad with a hare lip. He was a good sort was Joe, I think he was from Leeds.
    I also sailed with a bosun on the Memnon called Harry Hands, but I dont think they were related. Harry was a bullsh*t merchant, and we soon found we could prolong smoko indefinitely by inviting him to tell us about his wartime experiences when he came down the alleyway to turn us to. Sometimes you could make smoko last a good hour if you were prepared to listen to the tall tales of Harry's heroism in the face of the Kreigsmarine.
    Regards,
    Backsplice

  7. #97
    Newbie backsplice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wsteve55 View Post
    Hi Trader,and Backsplice,
    just looking through your tales, when the name Jack Cleary appeared! I'm curious about him,as fairly recently,I was helping some guy with the same surname,to trace his family members,as he was adopted while a young kid! I managed to find his half-sister,but no sign at all,of his full brother,John,who apparently, was known as Jack,so I wondered if there was any connection? I can see that he didn't seem a very nice feller,but any info' on him,would be appreciated. An obvious question to ask you is,was he from Liverpool? Hope you can help.
    Thanks Steve.
    Steve,
    Jack Cleary was from Ireland, Co Wicklow I believe. He settled in Wallasey, in the Seacombe area. He was about fifty five when I sailed with him and that was fifty years ago.
    Jack had two sons to my knowledge, and one of them was my age, his name was Ned. Ned still lives in Wallasey,
    His cousin, Paddy Procter was also a Blue Funnel bosun.
    Jack was a huge powerful man who I never once saw smile or laugh. To me as a sixteen year old deck boy, he was a frightening and intimidating presence.
    However, others say he was a good seaman and shipmate, he may well have been, but I must have caught him in a bad mood!
    Hope this helps,
    Regards,
    Backsplice
    Last edited by backsplice; 02-20-2009 at 07:11 PM.

  8. #98
    Senior Member wsteve55's Avatar
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    Thanks for that Backsplice,
    it doesn't seem like the Jack I'm looking for(thank God he says) as the one I'm after, came from Liverpool!
    Thanks again Steve.

  9. #99
    Captain Kong captain kong's Avatar
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    Here is a video of the Queen Mary 2 arriving in Sydney this morning. watch it on full screen and with the sound for the Big whistle sound.
    I have sailed on it on the maiden voyage and a world cruise. The most magnificent liner in the world.

    http://www.freenews.com.au/index.php...omed-to-sydney

  10. #100

    Smile

    what a great looking ship,the sound of the whistle brought the memories back of the mersey when it was full of ships in the 50s and 60s.

  11. #101
    Senior Member Waterways's Avatar
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    Empress of Canada capsized in Gladstone Dock.



    http://www.flickr.com/photos/spark08...7602822958074/
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  12. #102
    Captain Kong captain kong's Avatar
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    Good one Waterway, I saw the Canada burn in January 1953., That is the Empress of France lying astern. The Bosun of the Canada at that time was Martin Quinn.
    Good photos all the . I did my Firefighting course with the Liverpool Fire Service. Quite a tough one I came out of it all singed and burned. The actual Fire Fighting was done at Speke Airport in a steel Mock up of a ships accommodation.
    It was unbelievable, Set fire to a huge oil pan and go in with hoses spraying water on the oil fire. At first they threw some water on the burning oil which created a huge explosian, then they showed us how to use hoses on it with out the explosian.They set fire to the ships accommodation and then sent us in to find a body. Enjoyed every minute.

  13. #103

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    I read somewhere that the Empress of Canada fire was put down to a carelessly dropped cigarette end Cap'n. That sounds like the kind of conclusion they arrive at when they can't think of anything else. Was there ever an official cause discovered? And what happened to the ship after it was raised?

  14. #104
    Captain Kong captain kong's Avatar
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    Liverpool Nautical Research Society. history of ships, shipping ...On 10th January 1953 the Empress of Canada entered Gladstone Dock for her ... whilst lying in Gladstone No.1 Branch Dock, the Empress caught fire and, ...
    www.lnrs.co.uk/Empress%20of%20Canada.htm


    The full story is on the Liverpool Nautical Research Society web site.
    Type Emp of Canada in google and go on that. It is copywrite so I couldnt copy it.

    25 Jan 1953 set on fire, poor fire patrols, the fire pump out of action. then it was an hour or so from smoke being seen before the Fire Service was called. she capsized.
    6 March 1954 she was pulled upright
    1st September 1954 toweed to La Spezia Italy, The tow took 40 days. arriving on 10 October. 1954.
    Cigarette ends were suspected.
    Around that time in the early fifties there were a lot of suspected sabotage of ships by fire. The Queens were hit a few times and some of the Castle boats. The Communists were always suspected.

    In the photo the fire boat is the `VIGILANT`, the foremast and derricks have been saved and are stood outside of the Liver Buildings.
    There is a Blue Funnel ship opposite the `Canada` and the `France` is lying astern.
    Last edited by captain kong; 02-28-2009 at 11:03 AM.

  15. #105
    angus angus's Avatar
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    Smile RMS FRANCONIA

    Quote Originally Posted by captain kong View Post
    2



    Hi Kev,
    Last time I was in Cltheroe was in 1965, I am not sure if it is still open.

    Here is the RMS FRANCONIA.
    She sailed on her maiden Voyage on 23 June 1923 from Liverpool to New York and she continued on this route during the summer months until the outbreak of war , Her maiden voyage was between Liverpool and New York on 23 June 1923 and she continued on this route during the summer months until the outbreak of war Her winters were spent on 133 day world cruises.
    On 10 April 1926 she was involved in a collision leaving Shainghai harbour. While leaving her wharf she ran aground, her stern swinging around and hitting a Japanese cargo vessel and an Italian gunboat, the Libya. A buoy then became tangled in the Franconia?s propellers, sinking a lighter in the process and killing four members of its crew. I saw a phot of that event with the drowning men in the water alongside the Franconia.
    In September 1939 she was requisitioned as a troopship and refitted at Liverpool. Her first convoy was to transport troops to Malta, but while travelling in convoy with the Alcantara and Empress of Australia the Franconia was involved in a collision with the Alcantara, As a result of this accident the Franconia had to undergo major repairs at Malta. Later, during the evacuation of the British Expeditionary Force from France, she was damaged by air raids while carrying 8,000 troops. For the rest of the war she continued as a trooper, travelling to India and the Middle East via Cape Town and taking part in the invasions of Madagascar, North Africa and Italy. A friend , who is no longer with us, was on the Franconia approaching Scycily for the invasion with troops, she was attacked by German bombers, A stick of six bombs exploded underneath her and he said the ship was lifted completely out of the water by the blasts. This damaged the engines and shafts, but she was able to carry on. In 1944 she carried American troops from New York to the Mediterranean. During her period of Government service she covered 319,784 miles and carried 189,239 troops.
    The Franconia?s moment of war time glory came in January 1945. The ?Big Three? - Churchill, Roosevelt and Stalin - were to meet at Yalta on the Black Sea to discuss the shape of post-war Europe. The Franconia acted as the base for the British delegation, returning to Liverpool in March 1945.

    After the end of the war, the Franconia, like many of the requisitioned vessels, continued in government service repatriating troops and prisoners of war. She returned to Cunard?s control in June 1948 and was sent to the Clyde for a nine-month reconditioning. On 2 June 1949 she resumed a passenger service, this time sailing from Liverpool to Quebec, and later Montreal, In 1956 she did the Liverpool New York run.
    The Franconia?s withdrawal from service was announced in October 1956. He last sailing was on 3 November between Liverpool and New York and back again. The return voyage she broke down with mechanical faults and she was four days late when she reached Liverpool. She had been meant to carry troops to Suez, but the unreliability of her engines meant that she was withdrawn from this duty. She was sold to the British Steel & Iron Corporation and left Liverpool on 14 December 1956 to be scrapped at Inverkeithing.

    A Voyage on the RMS FRANCONIA
    I was on the Franconia in the summer of 1956, The Master was Captain Donald Murdo Maclean, DSO, RNR. later to become Master of Queen Mary and Queen Elizabeth as Commodore of Cunard. The Bosun was Nelson and Bosuns Mate was Charlie Chin.
    The Franconia was a good job , plenty of money, with the overtime, and a good run to New York. A week across, a week in New York , a week across and a week in Liverpool.
    I remember when a first class waiter dropped dead whilst serving passengers, Our watch on deck had to go into the saloon and carry him out, the first class passengers rather disturbed at having their evening dinner disrupted.
    We took him to the Medical Centre and the Doctor certified him dead then told us to take him to the cool room down below. We took the lift to the working alleyway then we had to use the stores lift which was four feet high and about four feet wide, so we folded him up in it and sent it down. There were no fridges on the Franconia, the Chill room was full of blocks of ice and the meat was stowed on top of this also the vedge. He was naked and we laid him on top of the ice.
    The following day the Doctor wanted him up in the Medical Centre to do a post mortem, so we had to go down to get him. He was frozen solid when we got there. We didnt like to touch him, he was icy cold like a marble statue. The Bosuns Mate said dont be so soft and then slid him off the ice and stood him up. So we had to get a hold of him, a bit gruesome. we got him to the stores lift and he was stiff so we had to struggle to get hin in, he was put diagonaly from the bottom corner to the opposite top corner we had to get Tommy Miller to get inside with him to get him position. Then the Bosuns Mate slammed the lift door on Tommy, and pressed the button for it to go up, then he pressed it again when it was between decks and stopped it. Tommy was screaming , he couldnt get out. The Bosuns Mate shouted Smoko and so we all went forard for a ciggy and a brew. Meanwhile in the lift which was against the engine room bulkhead was getting warm, it was dark in there and then the stiff started to move as it melted, Tommy was screaming in fear as this corpse started to move against him in the dark, he was demented.
    When we returned the screams were terrible, The button was pressed and the lift arrived in the working alleyway and Tommy was there with the corpse lying on top of him. I have never seen so much fear in a mans eyes as then. we lifted the corpse of him and put him on a trolley and Tommy was told to go and have a smoko. Tommy went straight into the Pig and got himself drunk and 52 years later Tommy is still drunk.
    The dead Steward was carried ashore at the Landing Stage in Liverpool and into an Undertakers van.
    On the next trip homeward bound again a very large American female passenger died, she must have weighed about twenty stones. The night before we arrived in Liverpool, Paddy Dirkin and I had to take the coffin forard to the crew gangway shell doors ready for taking ashore when we docked. Paddy and I had had a few drinks before we did this and she was so heavy we couldnt carry her so we were dragging the coffin, which was only a rough box lined with cotton wool, with a rope. we stopped half way along and sat down on the coffin for a ciggy. Paddy told me that I had fallen asleep on top of the coffin. he had to wake me so we could carry on forard. Next day alongside the Stage, Paddy, Johnny Golbourne and I dragged the heavy coffin down the crew gangway and with the Undertaker lifted it into his van.
    New York was always a good run ashore, The beer, Wrexham Lager, in the Pig on the Franconia was an old 8 pence a pint, that was 30 pints for one pound. the Pig on the Franconia closed at 8 pm in New York, so we supped up and went down the gangway across the shed and up the gangway of the Queen Mary or Queen Elizabeth and carried on there in the Crew Pig, they didnt close until 10pm., then we would go ashore to the Market Diner across the road.on the corner of 52nd Street and 12th Avenue. The beer there was 10 cents a glass so we got ten glasses for a dollar. about twenty five to the pound. At those prices ale was cheap. Some times we go up to Broadway and do the bars and clubs, In Jack Dempsey`s Bar, for one dollar you could have your photo taken , shaking hands with the hand that shook the world, across the road Tommy Dorsey`s Orchestra was always on there, always full, and a good night was to be had. There was good shopping there, Nylon stocking for the girls back home were cheap, Dupont Nylon, 15 denier, Always had a pocket full and at home in the Locarno dance hall, throw a couple of packets around and the girls would be screaming after me. We bought our suits from the Salvation Army store on 8th Avenue and I had a beautiful pure silk midnight blue drape suit with the bullet holes in the back sewn up by my Mother. $10, the suits and shirts were got from the City morgue so they were very cheap, I looked a million dollars in that suit, with a mid Atlantic accent, we were Cunard Yanks and the girls back home couldnt get enough of us. Records were good swag in those days, In the States they came out 12 months before you could get them in England due to a musicians strike. So they were always in demand for the most popular artistes and always made a few bob out of them. They were good days, Another good thing was the washing machines and fridges from the Salvation Army store, they were about 5 to 10 dollars each, the ship was full of them all in the working alleyway lashed to the bulkhead hand rails and on B Deck Square where our accommodation was. At the Stage in Liverpool, Daley`s big van would deliver them for five shillings. A few of the Stewards on big money would buy second hand cars. Big Yankee ones with tail fins, Buicks, Dodges, Chryselers and so on. they sold them cheap in a Dock yard around 33rd Street. Cars that had been pounded by the cops for parking violations and so on were sold cheep every weekend, they still do it today, I was in New York in April this year and the yard was still there full of cars waiting to be sold.
    Cunard allowed them to carry the cars home, without insurance, if we loaded and unloaded them ourselves. So the Stewards would drive to the Pier 92 and pay us a handful of dollars to rig the derricks and load them and stow them on the hatch on B Deck square lash them down and pay us again to do it at the Stage in Liverpool where they would drive them home. A lot of those Stewards were like millionaires, there were all kinds of rackets going big money could be made mostly from the dropsies from the Bloods. We could make a load of dollars from washing up and polishing glasses in the passenger bars, paid for by the cocktail bar tenders.
    In the Pig there were all kinds of gaming machines, Roulette, Cock and Hen Boards, Crown and Anchor Boards, Crap games, and so on, with big time Poker schools that lasted for days, with men being paid to do the players work and also to fetch coffee and sandwiches. pots going for thousands of dollars. A lot of wealthy passengers including movie stars would come down to the Pig for the gambling. There were no casinos allowed on ships in those days it was illegal under United States Laws.
    All good things have to come to an end, I was in the Pig having a pint with Joe Finnegan when I should have been on look out up the crows nest, the Masters at Arms dragged me up on the Bridge and Captain Maclean had me logged and sacked. Jo Finnegan then gave me the name of Alehouse.
    Three months later the Franconia was taken out of service and taken to the breakers in December 1956.
    I was facinated to read this thread as my old man (now sadly departed) sailed on the "old Franconia," many times during the war. He signed up as a scullion in 1942 aged 14 and served on her and various troopships throughout the war ending his career on the Canada run. I know he was involved in taking troops to Scilly also for the invasion, although whether aboad the Franconia I'm not sure. Actually I've all his seamans tickets somewhere so must check these.

    Thanks Captain for the informative post...must read some more now.

    Cheers

    Angus

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