The Stork Hotel & Douglas Bader etc

Having just come on board as a newbie I would like to start my contributions with something that may open a hornets nest or may help me solve a huge mystery before I have to fold my tent and leave for that New Brighton in the sky!

On my website, royalnavymedic1945.com there is to be found a Trilogy of my life and times commencing in 1923 in West Derby where I was born in a 3 bedroom council house ... But if you have the time and inclination, go to my website where you can start, if you like, with part one called Winston Churchill's Shoe that covers my early life and times, then read royalnavymedic1945 that covers my time in the Royal Navy and service from 1942 until 1946 and my adventures in many parts of the world then, the final chapter called The Real Kenneth Williams Story that tells of my marriage to an Australian girl whilst I was attached to the British Pacific Fleet and my later incredible induction, after I was discharged, into the Australian Security Intelligence Organization as an undercover operative for over 8 years.

My life has been extraordinary and many of you will not believe what I have done in my nearly 84 years, but believe me, everything I write (and will be happy to discuss with you) is the truth wihout reservation.

As an idea of what I have to relate, and I will be brief and elaborate later, is that during my service at the STORK HOTEL in Queen Square from February to November 1942 after being headhunted from my job at the once magnificent ADELPHI HOTEL, I was asked to assist Douglas Bader with his dressing and fitting his legs each morning for just a few days at some cannot be remembered time during my service at the hotel... Please don't jump to the wrong conclusions this REALLY happened and is still unexplained and I want to know why.

I have been searching for the last three years or so for answers to this apparent impossible situation and have been ridiculed by many and supported by many in attempts solve this riddle and I am still trying and need help...

There was something strange about the now demolished STORK HOTEL and its manager Mr. Giles and the large contingent of British military Intelligence? types that were resident therein during World War 2, and, just around the corner from Winston Churchlls Bunker!

If you are keen to become involved and put on a Sherlock Holmes cap I ask that you PLEASE familiarize yourself with my narrative before putting questions to me when I will be happy to expand when possible.

I do hope you can help this old Scouse find his answers and by the way, in my narrative you will find details of how I duped security guards and taped some brief conversations I had with the BEATLES Paul McCartney and John Lennon when they came to Australia some years ago- scouts honour! I sent a copy some time ago to BBC Radio Merseyside, ask them if you must!!!

Kenneth Williams but call me Ken :034:

Hi Ken

Very interesting! I look forward to hearing more and reading what you have on your site. I hope somebody on the forum can help you with your questions. As for the Stork Hotel in Queen's Square being frequented by military intelligence operatives, I should think that was quite likely at the time of the Second World War given that the Western Approaches Command headquarters, which ran the war for the Allies in the North Atlantic, was nearby in Derby House.

All the best

Chris

Hi Chris,

I am, after such a short time, feeling already very comfortable on the Forum almost as though I have come home again and amongst friendly folk!

Thanks for your kind words re "The Poem" it was very nice of you to offer encouragement to a first first ever attempt.

I am really very optimistic about finding someone who will have complete faith in my strange story involving the STORK and Douglas Bader et al and being on the spot be able to maybe solve this enigma as I call it.

Looking forward to a long association with the members.

Cheers

Ken :022:

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Originally Posted by Royal Navy Medic

Hi Chris,

I am, after such a short time, feeling already very comfortable on the Forum almost as though I have come home again and amongst friendly folk!

Thanks for your kind words re "The Poem" it was very nice of you to offer encouragement to a first first ever attempt.

I am really very optimistic about finding someone who will have complete faith in my strange story involving the STORK and Douglas Bader et al and being on the spot be able to maybe solve this enigma as I call it.

Looking forward to a long association with the members.

Cheers

Ken :022:

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Hi Ken
Welcome!

I have read your post...very interesting!
Just to clarify...do you want to know what Douglas Bader was doing in the Stork Hotel?

PS Do you have any pics?

Hi Daisy Chains,

If you can find a bit of spare time to read the much condensed version of my previous HUGE essay called THE DOUGLAS BADER ENIGMA this will put you well in the picture as to what is what and why!

Many people have offered a multitude of reasons why Bader could NOT have been in Liverpool in 1942 and just as many have offered dozens of theories as to why he WAS in Liverpool back in 1942 plus their own pet theories from acting as a go between like Rudilf Hess or as a secret agent spying on the Germans whilst a prisoner and enough to make a couple of good novels!

My own theory that is just that, a theory, is that he came back to be measured and fitted for new legs. If you read the story now I think most would agree that it is a very good possibilty that he came back for a few days and then returned as he was on "parole" and bound by a gentlemens agreement.

I was a small and unwitting pawn in something very unusual that is still being kept hidden away and, I would just love to know what it was all about!

Hope you find it interesting. There are many photos on my website and of the Stork Hotel but none, I wish, of Bader taken by me!

Take Care

Ken

I read somewhere about D.B coming back to have new legs fitted, The story went that the owner of The Stork hotel had a large mansion out Ormskirk way and D.B was to stay there after he was dropped off at the hotel. I guess that with his home being well outside the city boundaries it would be quite safe from air raids.

Be careful not to dispute this story, the author gets very annoyed and viscious.

Good luck

Please tell more :)

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Originally Posted by Ged

Please tell more :)

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Bader, never left Germany or Poland during the 4 years of his incarceration, fact !!! Over the past few years Mr Williams has been peddling this story on many websites and forums on the Internet, his main argument has been “I was there, you weren’t”. Bending the facts and using supposition to fit his own ideas with no conclusive proof, has been the order of the day.

Many people and in particular several noted historians who have access to Bader’s family and friends have blown his story out of the water. Each time he has taken it upon himself to slander them on his (now defunct) website, with no possibility for these individuals to counter his wild accusations.

On 9 August 1941 Bader was shot down over France, there are two theories to this.
1. That he collided with a Luftwaffe fighter a Messerschmitt Bf 109F of II/JG26 flown by Feldwebel Meyer, which removed the tailunit of his aircraft; or
2. He was accidentally shot down by F/L Buck Carsson.

There is a lot of evidence for the latter, which has been well researched and presented in a Ch 4 documentary “Who downed Douglas Bader”. Mr Williams would not accept this account and maintains that the only plausible explanation is the former, his reason being that it was what Bader had recounted to Paul Brickhill, the author of Reach for the Sky, therefore it had to be true.

Bader’s intention to keep on taking the war to the enemy, even as a POW are legendary, he under took several escape attempts on one occasion reaching the Polish boarder as part of a work party before being recaptured. Williams uses this attempt and the fact that Bader was off the radar for several days as the most likely point of Bader’s return to the UK. Flying from Germany to Ireland and then by boat from Ireland to Liverpool, to have new legs fitted and then back by the same route. All in 8 days. Williams concludes that this has to be fact, as this was the route taken, at the time, for the repatriation of allied servicemen, despite being shown that repatriations from Germany did not happen for several months after he claims to have seen Bader in Liverpool.

Other accounts that don’t add up, are that in early 1942, the bars and clubs were full of American soldiers. America didn’t enter the war until 7 December 1941, the first troops to arrive anywhere in the UK, landed in Northern Ireland in March 1942, and then it was only a small advance party of several hundred. The main influx didn’t happen until much later, after Roosevelt and Churchill had agreed a plan of Germany first Japan second. When this was presented to Williams his counter was, “you weren’t there’’.

In another recount Williams claimed that the Liverpool Blitz was at it’s height during his time at the Stork and in particular when he was tending to DB. It was pointed out that the Liverpool blitz was at its height in 1941 and the last raid on Liverpool was February 1942. Admittedly after being presented with these facts, he slightly amended his website, but not before slating the person who gave him these facts.

One thing I do find strange is that Mr Williams pulled the plug on his website in September because in his words, the reactions that he was getting was effecting his health. Odd that slightly before this event he has posted his story here.

I could go on but to be honest the story has, for a long time, lost all credibility because of Mr Williams venomous reactions and his inability to accept the facts when presented to him. The mind is a great thing, but can play awful tricks at times.

Thanks for filling us in. :)

I used to work in the ALAC (artificial limb and appliance centre) in 1980 and I remember seeing a letter from Douglas Bader on the wall in the gym room. Can,t remember what date was on it but it was a letter of encouragement to (future) patients.

Wished I,d have looked at the date now.

Interesting, Bader was quite well known for encouraging others who had for one reason or another lost limbs.

Forum members may find this rather interesting!

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread292208/pg4

Thank you NotDB (or is it SPM45) ;)

Very interesting, I read the lot. :thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by Ged

Thank you NotDB (or is it SPM45) ;)

Very interesting, I read the lot. :thumbsup:

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I couldn't possibly comment ;-)

The story has developed further with the emergence of a witness from the Stork Hotel !

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread292208/pg6

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Originally Posted by NotDB

The story has developed further with the emergence of a witness from the Stork Hotel !

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread292208/pg6

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Hopefully this is the end of this rubbish.

Regards to Europe's city of culture 2008