Council opposes Everton stadium

[drone_pilot]

Liverpool City Council is formally objecting to the proposed Everton and
Tesco development over "concerns" about the retail plans.

The £400m scheme includes a new 50,000 seat stadium and Tesco
superstore on a 85,500 sq m site in Kirkby.

Liverpool council has said this does not comply with planning policy, as it is
too big for the town and could take business out of the city centre.

Knowsley council said it was "saddened and disappointed" by the move.

BBC Read More (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/7436255.stm)

[Waterways]

They would say that wouldn't they!

[Ged]

Yes they would as they clearly wanted it to pass. But was Speke knocked back for taking business away from Garston, Tesco Old Swan must have an impact on the shops in Prescot Road - or has it - is it a myth? How about Tesco Rose Lane impacting on Allerton Road - has it?

If Bradley wants to veto plans for EFC to move, as i'd rather them stay in the city, then offer them a site here in the city for the same low costs.

[Howie]

Councils at war over Everton Kirkby stadium plan
Jun 5 2008
by David Bartlett, Liverpool Daily Post

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/liverpoolpost/nov2007/0/8/3DF59327-02D3-C4AA-79024EF50371362C.jpg

A BITTER battle broke out between two Merseyside councils last night over Everton FC’s plan to relocate to Kirkby.

More (http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-news/regional-news/2008/06/05/councils-at-war-over-everton-kirkby-stadium-plan-64375-21025963/)...

Doesn't bode well for the Merseyside 'super cabinet' does it? :rolleyes:

[Ged]

Everton should be prevented from moving from the city of Liverpool solely on the grounds that it is historically the first football club of the city and it is an Internationally renowned institution that brings money into the economy and joy to (at least half) of its citizens (even joy to the other half when we lose).

Not because of some jumped up half baked excuse that Kirkby should not be allowed to move forward on its retail front. I would say that's a clear breach of allowing regeneration and jobs to go to the area and for it to be kept in the dark ages as far as supermarkets go. To deny it this is only out of self interest of surrounding boroughs who don't want to see punters enticed elsewhere. Someone mentioned elsewhere that Bootle Strand would suffer as people from Litherland or Netherton would go there when in fact a massive 24 hour Asda was built in Old Roan that could have/would have had a detrimental effect on the Strand as it's nearer than Kirkby. Surely, the onus is on borough X to make sure it's own people are serviced well and if that means competition will force them to make their own areas 21st century, then all the better.

[Howie]

A synical person might suggest that Liverpool City Council is cow-towing to some wh*re mongering old Duke who now owns half the city. Could EFC be the first victim of Liverpool One?

[Ged]

As for retail policies regarding planning applications for mega developments. Did Knowsley object to Grosvenor's L1 which they could say would entice Kirkby people away from their town centre?

[disco]

Perhaps Everton and Tesco should take a leaf out of LFCs book, and buy up all the houses around Walton Hall Park, board them up and leave them to rot for a few years. Then put in a planning application to build a stadium on Walton Hall Park, can't see Liverpool City council having any objections to that.

[Waterways]

Liverpool owners talk about a shared stadium:

http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/everton-fc/everton-fc-news/2008/06/06/anfield-us-owners-tom-hicks-and-george-gillett-in-shared-stadium-talks-64375-21032552/

[Ged]

A few talking points here:

''Last night, Everton FC chief executive Keith Wyness said he had discussed the issue with Liverpool FC chief executive Rick Parry at a Football Association meeting in Leicestershire and a shared stadium “was not on the agenda of either club”.

This seems a contradiction in terms. We talked about it but we didn't - honest.....


Broomhead advocates a shared stadium in his NWDA role but admits he wouldn't want one for his team - Notts Forest?


On phone-ins and on forums, Lfc fans always say Efc are skint and are not getting in on the back of our scheme, when it seems that in reality, they are just as skint as nothing's happened their end either.

One Kopite in our office is so 'bitter' that he says the only reason he hopes Efc get the Kirkby kb is in case we get our stadium before them :rolleyes:


Although the Yanks have previously mooted a sharing, I don't see why they'd want to if their agenda is to get Lfc a new stadium, a bigger value and then to sell it, raking it in. Perhaps, like the Glaziers before them, they're not being given the credit they deserve.

Anyway, if Efc are so dependant on Tesco money/Kirkby connection/Barr builders etc, how would that fit in with a shared Stadium in Anfield?

[Waterways]

Why would LFC owners talk if they were not interested? If they sell, it will not be to a local rich boy "fan". It will be to a large international outfit. They look at the business side. Would a shared retractable roof and pitch 365 stadium with all the non-matchday activities be a seller. I think so. International businesses don't care about history and nostalgia.

Football team success is cyclic and having income on non-football activities is a nice buffer in down times and a great little earner in good times.

[Ged]

I think you're missing the point that if it was a shared venture, it wouldn't be just theirs to sell. Are you getting the identities of the clubs and the stadia mixed up?

Surely a club with it's own stadium like Lfc are trying/hoping to press ahead with will be a far better selling point to that International outfit who might not want a club who has shared financial constraints with their neighbour/local rivals.

[Waterways]

I think you're missing the point that if it was a shared venture, it wouldn't be just theirs to sell. Are you getting the identities of the clubs and the stadia mixed up?

Surely a club with it's own stadium like Lfc are trying/hoping to press ahead with will be a far better selling point to that International outfit who might not want a club who has shared financial constraints with their neighbour/local rivals.

Ged, a company would be setup to run the world-class stadium, jointly owned by both clubs - they would do the non-footy events, conferencing, maintenance etc, while club's concentrate on football, who really will be based at their training grounds. A retractable roof and pitch means a mid-week winter concert could be staged - more revenue.

There would be agreements of course, probably each club keeps all its takings on the football stuff. Each club pays a rent to this company who pay off the loans. Once loans are nearly paid for, maybe no rent paid and the summer events pay for the stadium. The company would push improvements, in time, which could be external infrastructure, etc, and charge the club's for it.

All doable and written in. The point is where to build one. Walton/Anfield are not that attractive for a multitude of points for all the events it would stage.

That would be attractive to a top investor.

One suggestion is Siamese stadia. Two stadia with one common stand joining them. The common stand is used for games at each pitch. Sounds daft, yet sensible, the advantage is that is it cheap to build rather than two separate structures, the same transport infrastructure. A retractable roof rolls over the other when open. The facilities of the other can be used for overspill corporate, etc.

[Ged]

Ged, a company would be setup to run the world-class stadium, jointly owned by both clubs - they would do the non-footy events, conferencing, maintenance etc, while club's concentrate on football, who really will be based at their training grounds. A retractable roof and pitch means a mid-week winter concert could be staged - more revenue.

There would be agreements of course, probably each club keeps all its takings on the football stuff. Each club pays a rent to this company who pay off the loans. Once loans are nearly paid for, maybe no rent paid and the summer events pay for the stadium. The company would push improvements, in time, which could be external infrastructure, etc, and charge the club's for it.

All doable and written in. The point is where to build one. Walton/Anfield are not that attractive for a multitude of points for all the events it would stage.

That would be attractive to a top investor.

One suggestion is Siamese stadia. Two stadia with one common stand joining them. The common stand is used for games at each pitch. Sounds daft, yet sensible, the advantage is that is it cheap to build rather than two separate structures, the same transport infrastructure. A retractable roof rolls over the other when open. The facilities of the other can be used for overspill corporate, etc.

Yes, i've seen your posts on SSC but it seems this pie in the sky idea of retractable roofs, a pitch on wheels, back to back stands etc is yours and yours alone with no mention of any club or financer wanting to do it.

I think an idea of an all singing and dancing multi purpose stadium might have been a good idea (identity issues apart) before the new arena/conference centre at Kings Dock but if it didn't happen when we didn't have these things then I can't see it happening now.

[Waterways]

Yes, i've seen your posts on SSC but it seems this pie in the sky idea of retractable roofs, a pitch on wheels,


This is not pie in the sky. Shalke have this. A shared stadium would/should have this.



back to back stands etc is yours and yours alone with no mention of any club or financer wanting to do it.


This has been mentioned in general terms for joint stadia in architects journals. A music concert could have both stadia running at the same time.



I think an idea of an all singing and dancing multi purpose stadium might have been a good idea (identity issues apart) before the new arena/conference centre at Kings Dock but if it didn't happen when we didn't have these things then I can't see it happening now.

If a shared stadium is back on the agenda, expect all singing and dancing affair - a new blank sheet. It is foolish not to do it. Both club's can handle the cost.

[Ged]

Like I said why would somebody who is only interested in re-selling his product after their own stadium is up (and so increasing value in his asset) want to share.

What with this and Everton's Tesco blindedness, also given it's their only cashcow - this share idea just will not happen.

http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/tm_headline=tom-hicks-slams-talk-of-stadium-share%26method=full%26objectid=21034164%26siteid=5 0061-name_page.html



.

[Waterways]

Like I said why would somebody who is only interested in re-selling his product after their own stadium is up (and so increasing value in his asset) want to share.


Because the asset is greater with a share.

[Ged]

No, the asset is only half owned so couldn't be sold without agreement from all. Hicks isn't for diluting his asset.

[Waterways]

No, the asset is only half owned so couldn't be sold without agreement from all. Hicks isn't for diluting his asset.

Business is not just about assets, it is mainly about profit. More profit with a state-of-the-art shared stadium.

[Howie]

New Everton stadium plans passed

Plans for a new stadium for Everton Football Club outside Liverpool have been approved by Knowsley council.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44562000/jpg/_44562173_everground226.jpg
The new stadium would seat 50,000 supporters

The proposals will now be referred to the government office to see whether it will be called in for a public enquiry.

The £400m scheme includes a 50,000 seat stadium and Tesco superstore on an 85,500 sq m site in Kirkby, Merseyside.

Neighbouring councils have opposed the development, saying it will take away trade, but others say it is vital for the town's regeneration.

Although Knowsley Metropolitan Borough Council (http://www.knowsley.gov.uk/)'s planning committee has approved the scheme, it cannot grant permission because of its size.

It will now be referred to the Government Office for the North West (http://www.gonw.gov.uk/).

The office, acting on behalf of the local government minister Hazel Blears, will then decide whether to approve the plans or call-in the application.

Opposition to the regeneration plan has been led by the Kirkby Residents Action Group, which claims the scheme is simply too big for the size of the town.

Campaigners say the combination of the stadium and superstore would cause traffic chaos, especially on match days.

Tesco says its plans have been revised in response to public consultations and that people in Kirkby are largely in favour of the large-scale redevelopment of the town.

Kirkby is about nine miles from the centre of Liverpool in the neighbouring borough of Knowsley.

Source: BBC NEWS | Merseyside (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/7443339.stm)

[Howie]

Everton fury at city council veto on Bellefield development
Jun 11 2008
by Ben Turner, Liverpool Echo

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/liverpoolecho/feb2008/9/4/5ABE9CDA-CCCD-34AC-5EADA373CC7CAD0F.jpg

EVERTON FC today claimed Liverpool council’s rejection of plans for their former training ground was “politically motivated”.

The Blues were hoping to cover 10% of the cost of their proposed new stadium in Kirkby by building 74 luxury homes on the old Bellefield base, in West Derby.

But Liverpool council rejected the scheme yesterday, despite being told by experts there was “no evidence” to back up residents’ fears about increased traffic.

It came a day after Knowsley council backed plans for the club to move to Kirkby, which politicians in Liverpool are keen to stop.

More (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/06/11/everton-fury-at-city-council-veto-on-bellefield-development-100252-21054646/)...

[shoney]

this decision smells,

[Ged]

Seems fishy when just about every developer on the planet are getting housing estates passed here, there and everywhere in liverpool. Still, if it stalls plans to a Kirkby move then maybe it's good - as long as Efc realise there is a plan B with Goodison Park or plan C with the loop and go for it.

[Howie]

Everton Kirkby switch - new threat
Jul 4 2008
by Nick Coligan, Liverpool Echo

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/liverpoolecho/nov2007/3/9/3DF56794-942A-6C40-3C732727B123119E.jpg

LIVERPOOL councillors are joining forces in a new bid to block Everton FC’s move to Kirkby.

They are set to agree a cross-party call to lobby cabinet minister Hazel Blears MP to “call in” the £400m Destination Kirkby scheme for detailed investigation.

Government officials are currently examining the Blues and Tesco’s proposals for Kirkby town centre after they were backed by Knowsley council last month.

Now it seems inevitable Liverpool council will formally request Ms Blears orders a public inquiry as senior councillors believe the plan breaks strict planning laws.

The call, which will be made next week, is likely to stoke up tensions between the neighbouring councils over Everton’s hope to relocate.

Councillors Warren Bradley and Joe Anderson, both season-ticket holders at Goodison Park, are desperate to keep the club in the city.

Their joint motion, with minority party leaders John Coyne and Steve Radford, includes a request to Everton to hold fresh discussions about a “plan B” to stay in north Liverpool.

More (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/07/04/everton-kirkby-switch-new-threat-100252-21228099/2/)...

[H_Asbo]

Everton should be prevented from moving from the city of Liverpool solely on the grounds that it is historically the first football club of the city and it is an Internationally renowned institution that brings money into the economy and joy to (at least half) of its citizens (even joy to the other half when we lose).



Not wishing to be Pedantic but.....

When Everton was founded and Goodison was built, the Everton district was NOT in the boundaries of the city of Liverpool, and of course neither was Anfield when Liverpool were founded.

So historically the first club to be founded inside the city of Liverpool boundaries is to the best of my knowledge is Bootle Football Club .

They are not the same club as the original Bootle F.C. who were in The Football League for one season in 1892-3, (and therefore also outside the city boundaries at that time) but rather a new club founded in 1953.

[gustave]

erm, don't mean to rain on any 'I'm waiting in hope' illusions, but the contract for the Foundation work has just been signed so 'who's off to KFC' (now wheres that Sunday League fixture list for 2008/09)