The Liverpool Welsh ( A happy thread )

[Gnomie]

Just starting this for anyone who would like to chat about the Welsh history in Liverpool. Its meant as a happy thread. Talk about Liverpool Welsh and Welsh in general.

please join in if you would like to celebrate the Welsh culture. but please its a happy thread, not a thread for having a go at the Welsh.

:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Gnomie]

I have ancestors in my family from Anglesey. My sister is married to a bloke from North Wales and they live in North Wales.

I had many a good holiday and days out as a kid in Wales.

My dad was evacuated to Llandudno during WW2

I like the way the streets in Liverpool start with letters that spell out Welsh names, good idea by the builders that.:handclap:

funny thing is i have OWENS in my family and they come from Galway:eek:

[pasha]

lol i live in north wales gnomie

[pasha]

my husband told me about the welsh in liverpool, i did,nt have a clue

[Steven]

my husband told me about the welsh in liverpool, i did,nt have a clue


I can speak some Welsh but don't tempt me - my spelling is very bad.

[Ged]

The Welsh weren't happy about the flooding for lake Vrynwy though to supply our watter (as Seth would say)

[buggedboy]

Rydw I yn Cymraeg. Gefais I Fyng eni yn Bangor in 1979 ac on I'n byw yn Bethel cyn mynd I prifysgol in Lerpwl.

A bit rusty with my Welsh too, but that basically says I'm Welsh and I was born in Bangor in 1979. I lived in a village called Bethel before moving to Liverpool to go to university.

I've lived here ever since. I love the fact that almost every bloody cabbie I use used to holiday in Wales and had relatives evacuated to villages around mine during the war. My dad was born in Bethesda, where loads of scousers were evacuated to.

[buggedboy]

The Welsh weren't happy about the flooding for lake Vrynwy though to supply our watter (as Seth would say)

That is still a sore point for many actually and the single reason why the Eisteddfod in Liverpool idea never went anywhere.

[chrismarsden]

Wasn't Liverpool the Capital of North Wales at 1 time?

[julieoapw]

My father was born in North Wales and so was my grandfather. The latter used to preach in Wales all over Liverpool, Manchester and North Wales every Sunday. Of course, many of the welsh speaking churches have gone now. Like the Irish, the Welsh played a major part in C19 and early C20 Liverpool but sadly, there's no Welsh heritage trail yet, just the Irish one. I'm currently reading a lot about the Welsh in Liverpool as I'm going to do a guided walk on the Scouse Welsh (the Squelch?) on St David's Day.
Julie

[pasha]

llanfairpwllgwyngeggwyndroprllantisiliogogogoch

with a scouse accent lol

[pasha]

buggedboy is that right?

[Mark R]

There was a large Welsh contingent in Anfield - my family were from there and they had Welsh roots. I believe a lot of the houses were built by Welsh workers.

[taffy]

That is still a sore point for many actually and the single reason why the Eisteddfod in Liverpool idea never went anywhere.

I believe several Welsh Eisteddfods have already been held in Liverpool.

[taffy]

My father was born in North Wales and so was my grandfather. The latter used to preach in Wales all over Liverpool, Manchester and North Wales every Sunday. Of course, many of the welsh speaking churches have gone now. Like the Irish, the Welsh played a major part in C19 and early C20 Liverpool but sadly, there's no Welsh heritage trail yet, just the Irish one. I'm currently reading a lot about the Welsh in Liverpool as I'm going to do a guided walk on the Scouse Welsh (the Squelch?) on St David's Day.
Julie

Julie have you read the books by Prof D Ben Rees on the Welsh of Merseyside. Worth a read if you haven't

[taffy]

There was a large Welsh contingent in Anfield - my family were from there and they had Welsh roots. I believe a lot of the houses were built by Welsh workers.

Mark, have a look at the book " Building the Industrial City" edited by Martin Doughty, pub 1986. It has a very interesting chapter on " The Welsh Influence on the Building Industry in Victorian Liverpool". It seems most of the 100,000 houses built in Liverpool in the 19th C were built mainly because of Welsh initiative and enterprise using building materials from North Wales

[Waterways]

My father was born in North Wales and so was my grandfather. The latter used to preach in Wales all over Liverpool, Manchester and North Wales every Sunday. Of course, many of the welsh speaking churches have gone now. Like the Irish, the Welsh played a major part in C19 and early C20 Liverpool but sadly, there's no Welsh heritage trail yet, just the Irish one. I'm currently reading a lot about the Welsh in Liverpool as I'm going to do a guided walk on the Scouse Welsh (the Squelch?) on St David's Day.
Julie

1/3 of the churches in Toxteth were Welsh of some kind. Look at this big beauty. "Toxteth Cathedral". Rotting away:

http://www.toxteth.net/places/liverpool/churches/images/princes%20road%20welsh%20pres%203.jpg


http://www.toxteth.net/places/liverpool/churches/images/princes%20road%20welsh%20pres%202.jpg
http://www.toxteth.net/places/liverpool/churches/princes%20road%20welsh%20presbyterian%202.htm

[Howie]

http://www.liverpool-welsh.com/images/dragon.jpg (http://www.liverpool-welsh.com/)
www.liverpool-welsh.com

[Howie]

The Liverpool Welsh

Last updated: 07 January 2008

Professor D. Ben Rees writes about the people from Wales who moved to Liverpool and continue to contribute to life in the city today.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/northeast/sites/history/images/liverpool_200.jpg

http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/northeast/images/66quote.gifThe Liverpool Welsh have been an integral part of the Liverpool scene since the heyday of the slave trade in the last decade of the 18th century. They came in their thousands between 1780 and 1820 and in that period a large number of Welsh Chapels and Churches were built.

Though young and usually poor they were men and women who were determined to make a better world for themselves and their children. Most of them were involved in the growth of Liverpool from a small port to a large cosmopolitan city. The Welsh played their part in the extension of the city to the north and the south. Townships such as Everton, Anfield, Kensington and Wavertree became Welsh in speech and in culture. The streets were often given Welsh names. Young men who arrived in Liverpool with very little money were within 30 years affluent and successful as builders and merchants. Their heritage is still around us in Liverpool, from large stores such as T.J. Hughes to Welsh streets in Anfield, Kensington and Toxteth.

Medicine also attracted Welsh men and women. The Anglesey bonesetters family of Evan Thomas were responsible, through him and his eldest son Hugh Owen Thomas and Sir Robert Jones, for the growth of orthopaedic medicine. Liverpool gained a great reputation in this branch of medicine. The University of Liverpool attracted both sexes as students and many of the notable names in Welsh history taught at the different departments, the poet J. Glyn Davies, a native of the city, in the Celtic Department followed by Idris Foster who later left for Oxford, Melville Richards and Dr D. Simon Evans. In History Professor W. Garmon Jones is still remembered as well as Professor D. Seaborne Davies in the Law Department.

The University today has a large number of Welsh academics. Among the prominent Welsh students of yesteryear we would have to mention the playwright J. Saunders Lewis, the biochemist R.A. Morton, product of the Welsh Presbyterian chapel of Garston, the physicist Gwilym Owen who pioneered the writing of books on science in the Welsh language, and Dr G. Penrhyn Jones who later became a celebrity in the University of Sheffield.

Music has also been at the core of the Welsh culture within the city and we are glad to announce that the Liverpool Welsh Choral Union has been in existence since the National Eisteddfod came to Liverpool in 1900. It first came in 1884 and the last time it was staged at Sefton Park in 1929 when a local Welsh Independent Minister, Reverend J.O. Williams, better known by his bardic name of Pedrog, was the Archdruid. Poets of the calibre of William Thomas (Gwilym Deudraeth), polymaths like William Rees (Gwilym Hiraethog) and hymnwriters such as Peter Jones (Pedr Fardd) have kept the name of Liverpool before the cultured Welsh people of our generation. Some of the Liverpool Welsh have concentrated on writing in English such as the playwright and friend of the Beatles, Alun Owen.

A great deal has been written on the Liverpool Welsh mostly in Welsh though Professor D. Ben Rees and Professor R. Merfyn Jones have illustrated the vast contribution of the Liverpool Welsh to the city and the nation of Wales. The monthly magazine in Welsh called Angor is worth ordering for £7 a year, for it underlines the events that have happened and will happen.http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/northeast/images/99quote.gif

Source: BBC - North East Wales History (http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/northeast/sites/history/pages/liverpool.shtml)

[taffy]

The Liverpool Welsh

Last updated: 07 January 2008

Professor D. Ben Rees writes about the people from Wales who moved to Liverpool and continue to contribute to life in the city today.

A great deal has been written on the Liverpool Welsh mostly in Welsh though Professor D. Ben Rees and Professor R. Merfyn Jones have illustrated the vast contribution of the Liverpool Welsh to the city and the nation of Wales. The monthly magazine in Welsh called Angor is worth ordering for £7 a year, for it underlines the events that have happened and will happen.http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/northeast/images/99quote.gif

Source: BBC - North East Wales History (http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/northeast/sites/history/pages/liverpool.shtml)

Here's a photo of Rev Prof D Ben Rees's Church in Smithdown Place, Wavertree.

[Mark R]

Mark, have a look at the book " Building the Industrial City" edited by Martin Doughty, pub 1986. It has a very interesting chapter on " The Welsh Influence on the Building Industry in Victorian Liverpool". It seems most of the 100,000 houses built in Liverpool in the 19th C were built mainly because of Welsh initiative and enterprise using building materials from North Wales


Thanks for that Taffy. I'll have a look for it.

[julieoapw]

Yes, I have one and have borrowed another one from the library. I've also heard him speak a couple of times and he's very interesting. Turns out he know my grandfather well. That book that you mentioned about Industrial Cities is also good although so far have only been able to read it in the reference library. Thanks for the tips.


Julie have you read the books by Prof D Ben Rees on the Welsh of Merseyside. Worth a read if you haven't

[julieoapw]

Yes, it's a great shame so many have closed.


1/3 of the churches in Toxteth were Welsh of some kind. Look at this big beauty. "Toxteth Cathedral". Rotting away:

http://www.toxteth.net/places/liverpool/churches/images/princes%20road%20welsh%20pres%203.jpg


http://www.toxteth.net/places/liverpool/churches/images/princes%20road%20welsh%20pres%202.jpg
http://www.toxteth.net/places/liverpool/churches/princes%20road%20welsh%20presbyterian%202.htm

[PhilipG]

Here's a photo of Rev Prof D Ben Rees's Church in Smithdown Place, Wavertree.

There's a connection with the Cameo Cinema.
The Presbyterian Church of Wales, Heathfield Road/Smithdown Place was opened about 1924. The congregation moved here from Webster Road (built 1887). That building was converted into the Cameo Cinema in 1926.

[taffy]

[QUOTE=Waterways;109012]1/3 of the churches in Toxteth were Welsh of some kind. Look at this big beauty. "Toxteth Cathedral". Rotting away:

http://www.toxteth.net/places/liverpool/churches/images/princes%20road%20welsh%20pres%203.jpg

QUOTE]

Here's another Welsh Chapel built in 1863 in Chapel Rd, Garston by the same architects of the Toxteth "cathedral", the Audsley brothers. This time on a simpler scale. Both churches belonged to what was to become known as the Presbyterian Church of Wales. They also built a mission room , Bethel, in Canterbury St, Garston. The latter building was demolished in the late 1940s.

Whilst there were many Welsh people in Garston in the mid 19th C, the growth of the Bibby's Copper Works on Blackburne St and later also the Crown Copper Works on Window Lane, led to a further influx of Welsh workers and their families.

[Kev]

Difficult to see but here it still stands in Garston:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/110/269211488_64b52e5db6.jpg (http://farm1.static.flickr.com/110/269211488_64b52e5db6.jpg)

[taffy]

Difficult to see but here it still stands in Garston:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/110/269211488_64b52e5db6.jpg (http://farm1.static.flickr.com/110/269211488_64b52e5db6.jpg)

I have that photo too Kev . One reason why I posted the 1929 image !! At least in that one the tree hadn't grown too much. I was referring to the Canterbury St Bethel mission that had been demolished.

[taffy]

Further to my earlier post about the John Bibby and Son Copper Works in Garston, here's an interesting gravestone in St Michael's Church, Garston. It marks the burial place of John Owens who died age 75 in 1896. He was born in North Wales and joined John Bibby and Son at their Seacombe copper works when it opened in 1836 at age 15. He stayed with John Bibby following their move to Garston in the mid 1860s. The works finally closed in the mid 1930s having been bought up and immediately closed by ICI metals.

The Welsh families were housed in Bankfield Cottages, now called Brunswick St. These are some of the oldest properties in the "under the bridge" area of Garston. Bankfield house recently demolished was the Copper manager's House. Both the cottages and house were built by John Bibby of Allerton for his key workers.

[Howie]

Wales joins in for Capital of Culture fun
Feb 5 2008
by Catherine Jones, Liverpool Echo

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/liverpoolecho/jan2008/0/2/3AC43E2C-C46B-3A27-9F6C34C5180E542C.jpg

WALES is to be involved in a number of artistic activities planned in Liverpool throughout 2008.

The Arts Council of Wales (ACW) is working on a variety of projects to coincide with Capital of Culture.

ACW chief executive Peter Tyndall said: “The fact Liverpool is this year’s Capital of Culture is of great importance not only to the city itself but also to surrounding regions, which includes north Wales.

“North Wales and Liverpool have a long shared history. Artistic collaboration can both draw on this heritage and help to develop new links and interchange.”

Last week Wales made its debut at the British Dance Edition event in Liverpool.

Dance promoters from all over the world converged on the city in search of the new trends in British dance.

Two world-class Welsh dancers, Marc Rees and Tania Raman, performed a showcase.

Other events lined up include Flintshire-based Uma Arwen O'Neil‘s dance-film project which explores the connections between north Wales and Liverpool. It launches this month and runs until May.

Ensemble Cymru is planning a music and narration production with projected images looking at the links between Wales and Liverpool such as the strong Welsh communities and Welsh chapels in Merseyside, plus the shared industrial history of north Wales and Liverpool.

Ty Cerdd – Music Centre Wales aims to hold a National Youth Jazz concert in Liverpool during the spring.

The Pavilion theatre in Rhyl will stage Willy Russell’s Our Day Out which will tour north Wales and Liverpool during June and July, while Theatr Clwyd present The Voyage, set during Queen Victoria’s reign when over 50,000 Welsh people lived in Liverpool.

Finally, Machynlleth Tabernacle will present an exhibition on the life and works of Owen Owen between August 4 to September 6, showing the strong connections between Wales and Liverpool during 1847–1910.

Source: Liverpool Echo (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/02/05/wales-joins-in-for-capital-of-culture-fun-100252-20436070/)

[taffy]

Old Welsh Chapel, Chapel Rd, Garston Feb 2008 view, just before the trees bud into leaf and obscure it for another year !! The chapel is now a private residence.

[taffy]

Wales watch
Feb 23 2008 by Catherine Jones, Liverpool Echo

EIGHT days of cultural celebrations marking the Welsh influence on Liverpool start next weekend.

Singer and broadcaster Aled Jones will join the Welsh Choral Union and RLPO to mark St David’s Day at the Philharmonic Hall on March 1 and begin the festivities.

The events include a bilingual service at St Nicholas’s church on Sunday, March 2, a folk culture lecture at the Friends Meeting House in School Lane, on Monday, March 3, and a talk on the history of Welsh people in Liverpool at the Athenaeum on Friday, March 7. The week will end with a St David’s Day dinner at the Adelphi on Saturday March 8.

Meanwhile on Wednesday March 5, an evening of “rhymes and rhythm” takes place at the Bethel Welsh Presbyterian church in Heathfield Road, Wavertree.

The evening features the national poet of Wales, Professor Gwyn Thomas, Liverpudlian Anglo-Welsh poet Dr Deryn Rees-Jones, and Welsh triple harpist, Liverpudlian Robin Huw Bowen.

Arthur Thomas, from the Bethel church, said: “Professor Thomas is one of the most prolific poets in Wales today. He writes in Welsh but his themes are global and will be translated for those who do not speak the language.

“Dr Deryn Rees-Jones is a senior lecturer in English at Liverpool university and has recently been voted one of the 20 best poets of the next generation by the Poetry Book Society.”

The evening starts at 7.30pm and entry is £5.

The Welsh have had a presence in Liverpool for hundreds of years.

Details of all the events and ticket prices are available by visiting the website www.liverpool-welsh.co.uk/cc2008.htm

Source Liverpool Echo

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/02/23/wales-watch-100252-20513743/

[julieoapw]

That's interesting Taffy - thanks for the link. Busy working on my guided walk for next Saturday afternoon which will be about the Scouse Welsh (the Squelch?)

[quincyg]

That's interesting Taffy - thanks for the link. Busy working on my guided walk for next Saturday afternoon which will be about the Scouse Welsh (the Squelch?)

having Welsh blood myself that sounds interesting. Any more info please?

[julieoapw]

Meet at 2PM at Victoria Monument in Derby Square on Saturday 1st March. Cost £3. I hope to cover the importance of chapel, Welsh builders, Eisteddfods in Liverpool, Little Wales, The Welsh bonesetters, Owen Owen and Sir Alfred Lewis - that's if I get my finger out and get writing!

Other walks on my site: http://www.geocities.com/liverpool08guide/walks.htm

[quincyg]

Meet at 2PM at Victoria Monument in Derby Square on Saturday 1st March. Cost £3. I hope to cover the importance of chapel, Welsh builders, Eisteddfods in Liverpool, Little Wales, The Welsh bonesetters, Owen Owen and Sir Alfred Lewis - that's if I get my finger out and get writing!

Other walks on my site: http://www.geocities.com/liverpool08guide/walks.htm

St David's day, how apt. I'll do my best to get down there.
cheers
Karen

[taffy]

Meet at 2PM at Victoria Monument in Derby Square on Saturday 1st March. Cost £3. I hope to cover the importance of chapel, Welsh builders, Eisteddfods in Liverpool, Little Wales, The Welsh bonesetters, Owen Owen and Sir Alfred Lewis - that's if I get my finger out and get writing!

Other walks on my site: http://www.geocities.com/liverpool08guide/walks.htm

Don't forget T J Hughes shop as well. Also not every Welsman worshipped in a chapel. Remember St David's Church of England church, Brownlow Hill's services were all in Welsh and several other Church of England churches ran some services in Welsh eg St Paul's

[julieoapw]

Yes, I will also be talking about St Davids.
Having trouble finding out anything about T J Hughes on the web - if you have any link, I'd be greatful
Julie

[quincyg]

hey Taffy, check this thread out. do you know anything about this dragon outside the arena?

http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8286

[taffy]

Yes, I will also be talking about St Davids.
Having trouble finding out anything about T J Hughes on the web - if you have any link, I'd be greatful
Julie

Not seen anything on the internet. I once attended a talk about the history of T J Hughes shop. Their present one in London Rd was once owned by Owen Owen. T J Hughes had a smaller shop on London Rd nearer the town centre. If you contact the company, they should be able to help you with the store's history.

[taffy]

hey Taffy, check this thread out. do you know anything about this dragon outside the arena?

http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8286

Sorry don't know anything about this one. Interesting though.

[quincyg]

spotted this from the bus and went up today to get some pix.

war memorial in Bootle
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e28/quincyg/blogging2/Picture1390.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e28/quincyg/blogging2/Picture1392.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e28/quincyg/blogging2/Picture1393.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e28/quincyg/blogging2/Picture1391.jpg

[Waterways]

This overtly displays the Liverpool Welsh connections. The Welsh virtually built Bootle.

[pasha]

annwyl (a place,dear,beloved,darling,fond)
am (about,at,around,because.)
yr (he drives,she drives,it drives,he sends, she sends, it sends, he works, she works, it works,)
aelodau ( limbs, members)
eglwys (church)
a syrthiodd (i go he fell )
yn ( crookedly , obliquely, slopingingly crooked, oblique,sloping)
ryfel (war a war, warfare, a warfare)
ail ( a second time, again, like )
fyd (world, a world, state, a state, life, a life.)
this is the english meaning of these words
debbie

[quincyg]

annwyl (a place,dear,beloved,darling,fond)
am (about,at,around,because.)
yr (he drives,she drives,it drives,he sends, she sends, it sends, he works, she works, it works,)
aelodau ( limbs, members)
eglwys (church)
a syrthiodd (i go he fell )
yn ( crookedly , obliquely, slopingingly crooked, oblique,sloping)
ryfel (war a war, warfare, a warfare)
ail ( a second time, again, like )
fyd (world, a world, state, a state, life, a life.)
this is the english meaning of these words
debbie

I have Welsh heritage, my ancestors spoke the language, I haven't a clue. so thanks for that.

[pasha]

your very welcome just go on google (free on line welsh translation)
im a scouser living in wales, so i think im adopted now lol
debbie

[pasha]

hapus dewi sant

[marky]

'Little Wales' Plaque, Pall Mall.

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee262/south_liverpool/Little_Wales_Plaque_Pall_Mall.jpg

[julieoapw]

Thanks for that Marky - where abouts in the street is the plaque? Has it been there a while or just gone up?
thanks
Julie

[marky]

The Little Wales plaque is on the right of Pall Mall, as you head out of town (North of Leeds Street junction). I only noticed it as I was looking at the former 'Liverpool Warehousing Co.' buildings.
A Google search states it was put up as recently as August last year:
http://www.scottiepress.org/projects/welsh.htm

[julieoapw]

Thanks Marky
I'll have to go down and have a good look - I didn't notice it last time I was there so I probably need to go further down.
Julie

[lindylou]

Travelling around north Wales and Anglesey, I have seen some curious looking churches.

I have borrowed Quincy's L'pool dock rd silo photo to show how the silo reminds me of a church in Amlwch - does anyone know anything about the strange shape of these churches ? (well I think they are an unusual shape for a church) :)

The first photo was taken in Ruthin. The black & white picture of Amlwch I found on the internet.

[julieoapw]

They're are fascinating - I never seen anything like that. Hope someone can explain them to you.
Julie

[pasha]

hi lindylou, well i have found the one in amlwch, it's roman catholic, it's called our lady star of the sea. omg that took me ages.
any way it has something to do with the thetis a submarine built in cammell laird's.
she had her first sea trial on the 4th march 1939.
she sank during trails on the 1st june 1939 with the loss of 99 lives. how sad is that.
a full naval funeral with all honors was held, so maybe at the church,
well she was salvaged, repaired, and recommisined as h.m.s.thunderbolt.
she was then lost with all hands on march 4th 1943.
any way i hope this helps.
debbie
im not very good with p.c.'s otherwise i would have put all the link's up
but if you on wikipedia it'll tell you everything about the thetis
debbie

[Waterways]

hi lindylou, well i have found the one in amlwch, it's roman catholic, it's called our lady star of the sea. omg that took me ages.
any way it has something to do with the thetis a submarine built in cammell laird's.
she had her first sea trial on the 4th march 1939.
she sank during trails on the 1st june 1939 with the loss of 99 lives. how sad is that.
a full naval funeral with all honors was held, so maybe at the church,
well she was salvaged, repaired, and recommisined as h.m.s.thunderbolt.
she was then lost with all hands on march 4th 1943.


The only submarine ever to sink twice.

[pasha]

yea that's right, i think it was doomed from the begining
debbie

[lindylou]

Thanks Pasha

[pasha]

your welcome if i get find any more on the other's i,ll let you know
debbie

[Mark R]

I took this in 1988. Known as 'Ty Hyll' in Welsh, it can be found on the A5 at Capel Curig. When I used to go to Wales as a kid we would always pass it.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2338/2399888275_c50b394132_o.jpg
Info can be found here:

http://www.snowdonia-society.org.uk/The%20Ugly%20House.htm

[lindylou]

Took this photo last year in Betws Y Coed. of a girl playing the Welsh harp.

[Mark R]

My favourite Welsh Castle: Harlech (1988)
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2258/2399888277_9cc65b2541_o.jpg

[Mark R]

Another of Ty Hyll.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2025/2399888271_5249acffc0_o.jpg

[kevin]

The only submarine ever to sink twice.

I thought they were all designed to sink?

It's the failure to come up that's the problem.
:unibrow:

[julieoapw]

Ooh, it's the Ugly House - what a blast from the past! Always used to pass that en-route to hols in Wales and once visited it.

(This refers to Mark R's post a few posts up)

[julieoapw]

Just read the info on the Ugly House via the link Mark provided and I realise I was fibbed to as a child - my Dad told me it was a witch's house! I'll never trust him again!!!!


I took this in 1988. Known as 'Ty Hyll' in Welsh, it can be found on the A5 at Capel Curig. When I used to go to Wales as a kid we would always pass it.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2338/2399888275_c50b394132_o.jpg
Info can be found here:

http://www.snowdonia-society.org.uk/The%20Ugly%20House.htm

[Ged]

You may have pointed in the general direction of it asking what it was and he said 'which house'.

[julieoapw]

Groans!


You may have pointed in the general direction of it asking what it was and he said 'which house'.

[knowhowe]

here's an interesting link to some good information and pictures:

"The influence of the 1905 Revival amongst the Merseyside Welsh community by D Ben Rees"-

http://www.freewebs.com/lancs/merseysidelancashire.htm

[lindylou]

Llandudno town centre with rather nice Victorian carved lamp posts.

[quincyg]

Berw Colliery, Anglesey where my gtgtgt grandad lived and worked. one of his son's moved to Liverpool from there.
Anglesey Council are restoring them :handclap:
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e28/quincyg/BerwColliery.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e28/quincyg/BerwCollieryFront.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e28/quincyg/BerwCollieryFront1.jpg

photos from my distant Welsh cousin Stephen

[lindylou]

That last pic reminds me of this derelict farm building - I took these photos when we were driving aimlessly around the country lanes - over past Llansannan way possibly towards Gwytherin. (not sure where it was) :)

[quincyg]

lovely :PDT_Piratz_26:

[Mark R]

That reminds me, has anyone ever seen that house on the Denbigh moors (in the distance)? We used to always drive past it. When we went again some years later, it looked like it was decaying...

[lindylou]

We've driven over the moors a few times. I will look out for it next time.

here are a couple my son took with his mobile phone:

[Mark R]

Great pics lindylou. Very atmospheric.

[quincyg]

We've driven over the moors a few times. I will look out for it next time.

here are a couple my son took with his mobile phone:

:handclap: look like summat from a Hammer film

[taffy]

For those who wish to learn more about the history of the Welsh in Garston, I'd recommend the privately published 50 page new booklet " Chapel Road Garston" by Arthur Thomas. It's an excellent read. Copies available from the Garston & District Histoical Society

[knowhowe]

http://www.bwpics.co.uk/gallery/miscimages/yew.jpg

One of my favourite trees: an ancient yew on the shore of Lake Bala, 2004

http://www.bwpics.co.uk/gallery/miscimages/tegid.jpg

Sunrise: Lyn Tegyd, August 2001

[knowhowe]

That reminds me, has anyone ever seen that house on the Denbigh moors (in the distance)? We used to always drive past it. When we went again some years later, it looked like it was decaying...

Is it the great big place? I defied the 'keep out' signs and went for a mooch around it twenty-odd years ago. Fantastic place- no roof but a very impressive fireplace in a room full of sheltering sheep. It's called Gwylfa Hiraethog, which, I'm told, translates as 'watchtower of the Hiraethog mountains'. It was in a bad state back then so must be terrible by now.

[lindylou]

Is it the great big place? I defied the 'keep out' signs and went for a mooch around it twenty-odd years ago. Fantastic place- no roof but a very impressive fireplace in a room full of sheltering sheep. It's called Gwylfa Hiraethog, which, I'm told, translates as 'watchtower of the Hiraethog mountains'. It was in a bad state back then so must be terrible by now.

oh, I know that building. it has been derelict for years. Not sure if it is still there. I will look out for it.

[lindylou]

I'm resisting the temptation of posting more photos of Wales. :PDT_Xtremez_42:

... it's a case of 'don't start me !!' - - - I LOVE Wales and I have trillions of photos and video footage. There's hardly any part of north Wales I havn't been to. I have some fab pics. There are just too many.

[Mark R]

Is it the great big place? I defied the 'keep out' signs and went for a mooch around it twenty-odd years ago. Fantastic place- no roof but a very impressive fireplace in a room full of sheltering sheep. It's called Gwylfa Hiraethog, which, I'm told, translates as 'watchtower of the Hiraethog mountains'. It was in a bad state back then so must be terrible by now.

Yes, that sounds like it. It looked big. I've got some photos of it from about 20 years ago. I'll dig them out and put them up here. Thanks for the anecdote - really interesting!



I'm resisting the temptation of posting more photos of Wales. :PDT_Xtremez_42:

... it's a case of 'don't start me !!' - - - I LOVE Wales and I have trillions of photos and video footage. There's hardly any part of north Wales I havn't been to. I have some fab pics. There are just too many.

I know exactly what you mean lindylou! Put them up anyway!! (Maybe we should start a 'Welsh' thread on its own :))

[lindylou]

Yes, that sounds like it. It looked big. I've got some photos of it from about 20 years ago. I'll dig them out and put them up here. Thanks for the anecdote - really interesting!




I know exactly what you mean lindylou! Put them up anyway!! (Maybe we should start a 'Welsh' thread on its own :))

Maybe in the photograph section ??

[Mark R]

Great! :PDT11

[Ged]

I'm off to Llanwrst in June, a few of us staying over the weekend for a landmark birthday celebration. We love Wales too, the usual places though, Betswycoed, Bala Lake, Swallow Falls, Caernavon, Rhyl, Abergele, Llandudno, Colwyn Bay and the Welsh mountain zoo. Stayed at the Robin Hood camp, Lyons' - one in Towyn too. Been the sea world in Angelsey - in fact my brother lived in Bangor for a few years in the late 70s.

Yes, keep posting those pics.

[lindylou]

Yes, keep posting those pics.

we will ... in our new thread :)

[lindylou]

I am posting these pics here as it is information rather than just photos.

The legend of Beddgelert:
http://www.greyfriarsbobby.co.uk/gelert.html

http://www.beddgelertonline.co.uk/index.html

[Howie]

Welsh salute to Liverpool links
Apr 19 2008
by Catherine Jones, Liverpool Echo

CAPITAL of Culture spreads across the border next month when Liverpool links are celebrated at a Welsh arts festival.

A new play telling the story of Liverpool evacuees in World War II and a performance by the Royal Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra are among the highlights of the Wrexham Arts Festival 08.

Fifteen major events take place between May 2 and June 7, many of them involving Liverpool artists or celebrating the life of the city.

Claire Brock, of Wrexham borough council, said: “The festival is totally dedicated to “The Liverpool Connection”.

“North Wales has always had strong links with Liverpool and the theme has been chosen to celebrate the 2008 Capital of Culture.

“It's an exciting programme and many people have close connections with Merseyside.”

A concert by the RLPO at Wrexham’s William Aston Hall will kick off the festival on May 2, while Liverpool Cathedral organist Professor Ian Tracey will perform at St Giles church on May 10.

Music events include a concert involving a selection of songs from Liverpool, American saxophonist Scott Hamilton and Liverpool’s Lee Bolger, and a performance by the Mersey Beatles in an evening which also features members of Merseyside Dance Initiative’s Afro-Caribbean youth dance group.

Michael Stevens’ specially-commissioned new play We’ll Keep a Welcome, based on the experiences of children evacuated from Liverpool to north Wales, takes place at Rhos’s Stiwt theatre on June 5-6.

Wrexham’s arts centre and museum will host exhibitions celebrating Liverpool’s architecture and its Welsh community and culture.

The festival also includes a poetry competition on city life, and an “in conversation” of the author of the Liverpool Sagas, Val Williamson.

Full details of the arts festival programme are available by visiting www.wrexham.gov.uk

Source: Liverpool Echo (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/04/19/welsh-salute-to-liverpool-links-100252-20786914/)

[pasha]

oh my god ged your coming to wales, i,ll have to tell the kids to stay indoors there's a madman coming down lol :ninja:

debbie

[kevin]

Feeling just a tad anti-Welsh this morning - no doubt I'll get over it.

I read yesterday that prescriptions in Wales are free - and that more people are registered with Welsh doctors than the population of the country. People living close to the border register over the border to get the free prescriptions.

Mentioned it to my wife and she told me her job pays £5,000 more in Wales and that there is a non-contributory pension fund (she's a government employee).

Somebody will no doubt correct me but it sounds like the Welsh are getting benefits funded, in part, by English tax payers.

Think I'll move there!

[lindylou]

ooh interesting - I've always fancied living in Wales. :unibrow:

I wasn't aware about this. Might think about moving there after all :) :)

[pasha]

kevin where do you get your info from?
there has been free prescriptions in wales now for 2 years
and i have lived here for 25 years and have never heard of such rubbish
(people coming across the border to get free prescriptions)

""oh yea right i,ll just nip across the border to wales to to save myself £4.50 on a prescription " lol
where's the border kevin so i can inform the welsh assembly about foreigners.

what aload of old ****e

[lindylou]

must admit I'd never heard about it Pasha. :neutral:

I'm never away from Wales - have been going there every summer since the 1960s.

[kevin]

kevin where do you get your info from?
there has been free prescriptions in wales now for 2 years
and i have lived here for 25 years and have never heard of such rubbish
(people coming across the border to get free prescriptions)

""oh yea right i,ll just nip across the border to wales to to save myself £4.50 on a prescription " lol
where's the border kevin so i can inform the welsh assembly about foreigners.

what aload of old ****e


You've never heard of it and therefore it doesn't exist?
It was on Radio 4 yesterday - I'd never heard about the free prescriptions before so perhaps they don't exist?
Don't know what they base their claims on but I think they said there are 10,000 more people registered with doctors than the supposed population of the country.

'Crossing the border' may merely involve walking to the other end of the street for some people so it's hardly a Checkpoint Charlie situation, is it?

Sorry you've got so wound up over this. Next time you go the docs, perhaps you can ask them to increase your (free) medication?
:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Samp]

I think some pictures from Lindylou would be a good free tonic!

[Mark R]

You've never heard of it and therefore it doesn't exist?
It was on Radio 4 yesterday - I'd never heard about the free prescriptions before so perhaps they don't exist?
Don't know what they base their claims on but I think they said there are 10,000 more people registered with doctors than the supposed population of the country.

'Crossing the border' may merely involve walking to the other end of the street for some people so it's hardly a Checkpoint Charlie situation, is it?

Sorry you've got so wound up over this. Next time you go the docs, perhaps you can ask them to increase your (free) medication?
:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

Yes, I've heard of it as well.

[pasha]

do know what i know now why people want to leave this forum
because you have prat's like him coming on it, who knows nowt.

how old are? in your 50's i suggest you go the doc's and sort your jealousy out.

you honestly think we are getting our

( free) prescriptions with english people's tax lolol your a joke
and your wife says her job pay's £5,000 more and she works for the gov (can she speak welsh ) sadly i dont think so so i dont think you,ll be moving here then.
i,ll tell you what you stay there and pay your english taxes and we,ll get our free prescriptions here with it ok.

[lindylou]

I think some pictures from Lindylou would be a good free tonic!

ha,ha, thanks Samp. :)

[pasha]

samp i dont need to look at lindy's picture thanks although there lovely because i live here and i see the views every day

[pasha]

while i,m going across the border to get my free prescripton

[kevin]

do know what i know now why people want to leave this forum
because you have prat's like him coming on it, who knows nowt.

how old are? in your 50's i suggest you go the doc's and sort your jealousy out.

you honestly think we are getting our

( free) prescriptions with english people's tax lolol your a joke
and your wife says her job pay's £5,000 more and she works for the gov (can she speak welsh ) sadly i dont think so so i dont think you,ll be moving here then.
i,ll tell you what you stay there and pay your english taxes and we,ll get our free prescriptions here with it ok.

My original post was meant to be quite light hearted but I seem to have struck a nerve. Jealous of Wales? I think not. I like the place and have had many holidays there, but wouldn't particularly like to live there full time.

'Who knows nowt'. Indeed, that's why I said 'no doubt somebody will correct me'. I was commenting upon something I'd caught part of on the radio and it was a (slightly) provocative post trying to get somebody to respond and clarify the issue. Your knee-jerk (with special emphasis on jerk) reaction hasn't exactly done that - so I still 'know nowt'.

As this thread is meant to be a 'happy post' perhaps it's best if I butt out - too much instant aggression for my liking.
:eek:

PS - My wife's job pays more in Wales because they are struggling to get enough qualified professionals, for her particular specialism, to work there. Her family is Welsh, but you are correct in your assumption that she doesn't speak Welsh. Neither do any of her Welsh relatives.

[kevin]

Just starting this for anyone who would like to chat about the Welsh history in Liverpool. Its meant as a happy thread. Talk about Liverpool Welsh and Welsh in general.

please join in if you would like to celebrate the Welsh culture. but please its a happy thread, not a thread for having a go at the Welsh.

:PDT_Aliboronz_24:


Gnomie,
Apologies for causing a stir on your happy thread. Tongue was fairly well planted in cheek but some are too thin skinned to notice.

Here's to more happy posts in future.

[knowhowe]

Wouldn't be more pertinent to be getting angry about the fact that we mugs, the English are still being made to pay for our prescriptions when the Welsh and Scots can run their system perfectly well without having to impose such disgraceful 'health taxes' upon their people?
Oh, and prescriptions in England are now £7.10 not £4.50!

[kevin]

Wouldn't be more pertinent to be getting angry about the fact that we mugs, the English are still being made to pay for our prescriptions when the Welsh and Scots can run their system perfectly well without having to impose such disgraceful 'health taxes' upon their people?
Oh, and prescriptions in England are now £7.10 not £4.50!


Going off thread a little, as you're in Chester:

Had a Welsh boss a few years ago who was a bit of a prat (nowt to do with him being Welsh, I hasten to add). Learnt a bit of trivia about Chester which I used next time I had a row with my boss.

Me 'Do you ever go to Chester, Dave?'

Him 'Sometimes'.

Me 'Can you warn me next time you go?'

Him 'Why?'

Me 'Because it's still technically legal for an Englishman to shoot a Welshman, with a bow and arrow, in Chester'.

That was the beginning of the end and I left a few months later.

[Mark R]

Going off thread a little, as you're in Chester:

Had a Welsh boss a few years ago who was a bit of a prat (nowt to do with him being Welsh, I hasten to add). Learnt a bit of trivia about Chester which I used next time I had a row with my boss.

Me 'Do you ever go to Chester, Dave?'

Him 'Sometimes'.

Me 'Can you warn me next time you go?'

Him 'Why?'

Me 'Because it's still technically legal for an Englishman to shoot a Welshman, with a bow and arrow, in Chester'.

That was the beginning of the end and I left a few months later.

I think it is also legal for an Englishman to shoot a Scotsman (with a bow and arrow) if he is found within the walled city of York.:shock:

[knowhowe]

Haha. Yes, I believe this is still technically true and they never got rid of the old law. Don't know if it's ever been tried though or if you'd get away with it if you did...
There's been justifiable emnity between Welshman and Cestrian for umpteen centuries, Chester being the hated HQ for the subjugation of that nation.
I admire the viewpoint of the great medieval bard Lewys Glyn Cothi, who'd been booted out of Chester for marrying a local girl without the permission of the mayor and his cronies...

Go, complaint, to Gwynedd's sun,
I complain of the mongrels,
So crafty they were, so cold,
Mobs in the town of Chester.
It's they who plundered my house
Of my bed and fine bedspread,
And they have left me barer
Than salmon swimming a stream.

I will shave, by Saint Non's hand,
All of the lads of Chester.
On every churl I'll whet it,
Rib of steel, if I come there.
Not one leaves, till Saint Dwyn's Feast,
The hot town head unbroken.

I'll carve, if I come near them,
Twenty thousand naked curs.
That day, after drinking wine,
I'll wield the blade of Cyffin,
I'll deal with my hands a hurt
To that two-faced town yonder.

From the towns of Rhos at dawn,
By nightfall to dark Chester:
Let me kill, if my day arrives,
With Dafydd's sword two thousand!

"That two-faced town yonder"- still as true today as it was then. And then there's the Chester-Wrexham footy matches!!

[pasha]

kevin
i am a scouser who moved to wales abt 25 years ago my husband is welsh my kids are welsh. i have never signed on the dole or had handout's, i used to pay for my prescriptions but now it's quite nice to go an get something free not that we have presc every day.
but i,ll tell you something there is a women in our street who moved into her council house about 8 years ago with her kids having left a battered wife's home up the road. that women had everything done in her house, new bathroom,new kitchen, new window's she was the first one to get central heating, a year later her husband came to stay for about 7 month's with them. every one was in a uproar as they had all this done for her, we bought our house 3 years before she moved in so it did,nt bother us. we had the road done in the street ( to make it wider the trees where removed) but not much, she complained to the council that people where parking up on the curbs the only reason people did this was because to many cars in the street and they could not get past. she now has her finger's in all pies, she is a member on a new council coming out. no one talks to her because she complains about kids in the street.
oh and quess where she's from ? (middlesborough)

she has her rent payed for,council tax payed for, school dinner's payed for, oh and she has never payed for prescriptions,or dentist.
so when you say about the welsh getting free this and free that/
it's not just welsh people who live here.

debbie

[kevin]

kevin
i am a scouser who moved to wales abt 25 years ago my husband is welsh my kids are welsh. i have never signed on the dole or had handout's, i used to pay for my prescriptions but now it's quite nice to go an get something free not that we have presc every day.
but i,ll tell you something there is a women in our street who moved into her council house about 8 years ago with her kids having left a battered wife's home up the road. that women had everything done in her house, new bathroom,new kitchen, new window's she was the first one to get central heating, a year later her husband came to stay for about 7 month's with them. every one was in a uproar as they had all this done for her, we bought our house 3 years before she moved in so it did,nt bother us. we had the road done in the street ( to make it wider the trees where removed) but not much, she complained to the council that people where parking up on the curbs the only reason people did this was because to many cars in the street and they could not get past. she now has her finger's in all pies, she is a member on a new council coming out. no one talks to her because she complains about kids in the street.
oh and quess where she's from ? (middlesborough)

she has her rent payed for,council tax payed for, school dinner's payed for, oh and she has never payed for prescriptions,or dentist.
so when you say about the welsh getting free this and free that/
it's not just welsh people who live here.

debbie

Debbie,
There is ALWAYS a bigger picture.
I really didn't set out to wind you up or offend you.
Kevin

[pasha]

hi kevin
no worries
i,m not normally like, it's just that to me you where having a go at the welsh and i class myself as an adopted welsh/scouser.
i get the mick taken out of me here people trying to mimick my accent but i take it with a pinch of salt, isn,t it funny it does,nt matter where you are in the world people know where you come from.

debbie

[kevin]

hi kevin
no worries
i,m not normally like, it's just that to me you where having a go at the welsh and i class myself as an adopted welsh/scouser.
i get the mick taken out of me here people trying to mimick my accent but i take it with a pinch of salt, isn,t it funny it does,nt matter where you are in the world people know where you come from.

debbie

I work in Cheltenham - how well do you think a scouse accent goes down there?
:eek:

[kevin]

My initial 'free prescriptions' comment was prompted by a series of events. It seems that both Scotland and Wales are providing certain things free which the English have to pay for - two most obvious examples are prescriptions and university fees. We've also ended up in a system whereby it appears that Scottish and Welsh MP's vote on matters purely affecting England, whilst English MP's have few impacts on what now happens in Scotland and Wales.
I know this is an over-simplification, but do you get my drift?

I harbour no ill will towards the Scots and the Welsh over this, but blame our own politicians. Are we just paying the price for our previous conquests of those countries?

[lindylou]

must admit I'd never heard about it Pasha. :neutral:



.. after me saying that - I heard someone mention it on the radio yesterday.

I wasn't aware of it before this though.

[Gnomie]

Llanfyllin

Can anyone tell me any info on it please.

I have found out that my great grandfather was born there in 1880
any ideas what kind of industry was in the area at that time.

any pics of the area now?

cheers:PDT11

Tony

[pasha]

http://www.workhouses.org.uk/index.html?Llanfyllin/Llanfyllin.shtml


hi gnomie what about this

debbie

[Gnomie]

http://www.workhouses.org.uk/index.html?Llanfyllin/Llanfyllin.shtml


hi gnomie what about this

debbie

Brilliant Stuff :handclap: Thank you Pasha.

Interested read that :PDT11

[pasha]

hi gnomie
i,m glad you enjoyed it i was,nt sure if that's what you wanted, if you google it there is loads of information on the place

debbie

[taffy]

Llanfyllin

Can anyone tell me any info on it please.

I have found out that my great grandfather was born there in 1880
any ideas what kind of industry was in the area at that time.

any pics of the area now?

cheers:PDT11

Tony

Here's some more info

http://history.powys.org.uk/school1/llanfyllin/fyllmenu.shtml

[Gnomie]

Here's some more info

http://history.powys.org.uk/school1/llanfyllin/fyllmenu.shtml

Cheers Taffy, great stuff, Thank You:PDT11

[Motorhemp]

Some snaps of Parys (Copper) Mountain in Anglesey where some of my family live. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parys_Mountain
Its been seen in episodes of Dr. Who and I'm told used as a location in Mortal Kombat, but as this information came from a local in an Amlych pub who staggered into the door on his way out who knows!
If you join the society (don't know the details yet other than web link: http://www.parysmountain.co.uk/) you can go down the old copper mine. A strange place with very unusual colours.

[lindylou]

Thanks Motorhemp. That's a place we intend to explore this year. We have been to Anglesey many times over the years and yet not been to Parys mountain.

[Motorhemp]

Its well worth it even if just for the strange other-worldy feeling it emanates. Also told there is an underground lake in the mountain held back by ice and rubble which if it ever breaks through will wash Amlych away!!!

[Samp]

I think it is also legal for an Englishman to shoot a Scotsman (with a bow and arrow) if he is found within the walled city of York.:shock:


My family on my dad's side are Scottish, on my mam's side (mam being of Welsh origin) are welsh.

There is nothing down for me if I visit Chester and they find out.

I do like a pint in the Boot.


I have posted this to keep the thread going!

[lindylou]

I've probably got this wrong - but I heard a strange little myth about the clock in Chester being built to face the other way from Wales - so the Welsh couldn't see the time !! Ha! Have you heard that one ?

[knowhowe]

I've probably got this wrong - but I heard a strange little myth about the clock in Chester being built to face the other way from Wales- so the Welsh couldn't see the time !! Ha! Have you heard that one ?

You're quite right. If you look up at the Town Hall tower, there's a clock on three of its four sides- but the side facing Wales has none!
It gives rise to the old saying that "Chester folk wouldn't give the time of day to the Welsh".
Charming eh?

[Howie]

Welsh to honour a city success story
Jun 14 2008
by Catherine Jones, Liverpool Echo

ONE of the most famous members of Liverpool’s Welsh community is being celebrated in a special exhibition to mark Capital of Culture.

The links between Liverpool and North Wales will be highlighted in the six-week exhibition at the Welsh Museum of Modern Art (MoMA) highlighting department store founder Owen Owen.

Arts Council of Wales is backing the project which is being put together with the help of the Owen family.

Owen Owen’s great, great grand-daughter Genevieve Raw-Rees, a student in Liverpool, said: “The idea for the exhibition came about because the Arts Council Wales circulated information about Liverpool as the Capital of Culture and invited arts organisations to take part.

“MoMA Wales was interested and said yes.

“I live just off London Road opposite the site of the original Owen Owen store, and I’m delighted to have been asked to help put the exhibition together.”

Owen Owen was born in Machynlleth, the home of MoMA Wales, in 1847 and arrived in Liverpool in 1868 hoping to make his fortune.

The 21-year-old had spent several years working for his uncle’s drapery store in Bath.

He had £300 in his pocket and having already discovered trade was booming in Liverpool on an earlier visit, decided it was a town of opportunity.

Owen founded a small shop in London Road and, unable to afford any advertising, displayed a notice in the window saying: “This shop is opened to supply the public with the newest and best fancy goods at the lowest possible prices.”

The exhibition runs at the Machynlleth museum, between Dolgellau and Aberystwyth, from July 28 to September 6.

Source: Liverpool Echo (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/06/14/welsh-to-honour-a-city-success-story-100252-21071723/)

[marky]

1881 Caergwrle Buildings, Wavertree Road/Thorburn Street. An early date-stone when compared with other major roads. I've seen other Welsh stones around, Bootle for example.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3229/2681250581_5ff4ee04a4.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/25632502@N00/2681250581/

[redjed1]

Hi, My mums mum was welsh (from Anglesey). Her family moved to Liverpool about 1900 and (from the 1891 census) her parents only spoke welsh, while their children were bilingual. I wonder how they got on with their Liverpool neighbours?

They lived in Walton - were there "welsh" parts of Liverpool where they all lived? My (scouser) grandad used to stay with them and had to learn welsh to be able to speak with them.

When I was small, my nan used to teach me a bit of welsh. I still feel an afinity with Wales, especially when driving along their roads with the signs written in welsh and english. Good on them for insisting on keeping the welsh language going.

[squiggs]

Llanfyllin

Can anyone tell me any info on it please.

I have found out that my great grandfather was born there in 1880
any ideas what kind of industry was in the area at that time.

any pics of the area now?

cheers:PDT11

Tony

Ohhh me too !, we could be related !

[squiggs]

The other side of my family come from Amylch spelt Amlach on the 1851census everyone must know them the name was Thomas Hughes LOL !, seems to live in 8 "Tclyue" its hard to make out !.

[pennymeadow]

Hi all, i'm a new member to your site and found you all by accident browsing & decided to join you. I have Scottish family on my Mother's side who were known as the fighting Mactaggarts in Scotland. They were renowned Barefist fighters who had a reputation for many years as people not to mess with. My mum wondered why they weren't mentioned very often at family gatherings, lol. My Dad's side who were called Parry came to Liverpool during the early years of the 20th C from a little Welsh village next to Ffestiniog and lived in St Domingo Road untill their deaths. They had 9 children who were all born in Everton and who all worked and stayed in the Liverpool areas. My Auntie Elsie worked at Hendersons at the time of the big fire.:PDT_Aliboronz_09:

[shytalk]

Welcome to the forum Pennymeadow. Are you in Liverpool?.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[lindylou]

Hi and welcome to the forum. There's lots of pics of Wales here too - -

http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/places-nature/9095-wales.html

[pennymeadow]

Thanks for the welcome. I'm in sunny Skem (Skelmersdale). Love going to Liverpool, & travel there whenever i get the chance. Mainly visit Fairfield as i have an Auntie who has lived in the same house for 71 years, since she was 10.:)

[pennymeadow]

Welcome to the forum Pennymeadow. Are you in Liverpool?.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

Noticed your American address Shytalk. Are you an expat yourself?. I have alot of family in Columbus, Indiana and Kentucky.They are very Southern in their accents and it was my Mum's Mum who went over to America as a Gi bride from Liverpool.:)

[pennymeadow]

:):):):):)
Hi and welcome to the forum. There's lots of pics of Wales here too - -

http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/places-nature/9095-wales.html

Hi Lindylou, i have enjoyed looking through the forum containing all the wonderful photos that people have taken on their travels around Wales. They are stunning.

[shytalk]

Noticed your American address Shytalk. Are you an expat yourself?. I have alot of family in Columbus, Indiana and Kentucky.They are very Southern in their accents and it was my Mum's Mum who went over to America as a Gi bride from Liverpool.:)

I'm in northeast Arkansas, I moved here from Florida in 2006 when I retired. I lived in Florida for 24 years but I am still pure scouse. :) Can't see any reason to get rid of an accent that is so good.

[pennymeadow]

Totally agree Shytalk, Scouse is a great & friendly accent. Good on you for keeping your accent for all these years. By now there must be a slight twang of American in there by now though surely?. You probably sound Scouse to Americans but American to us LOL:). It's facinating that you are the other side of the world but can keep in touch with everything on this site.:handclap:

[shytalk]

By now there must be a slight twang of American in there by now though surely?. You probably sound Scouse to Americans but American to us LOL:):handclap:

YERWOT?

[anonymouse]

This may be of interest to those that missed it the first time around:?

Llwydiarth Fawr on Anglesey - home of the Mayor of Bootle (http://www.anglesey.info/LlwydiarthFawr.htm)

[lindylou]

Thanks for that link - it's an interesting site.

[gerry_2]

YERWOT?

Quite a nice cultured scouse accent Shy is that for the benefit of your American friends. Where I come from its YERWO. In one of your previous threds you wrote about your shop in Gramby St and the cobblers shop, I knew the chap in the cobblers he was an old friend of mine Charlie Riely aka (Ike). At that time I managed the Vine Hotel on the corner of Vine and Faulkner streets. That was in the early sixtys.

[Blue70]

I have Welsh ancestors going back to the 1800s. I have an ancestor from Overton in what was then Flintshire, probably another that later married into that family who was called Jones and an ancestor from Laugharne in South Wales.

Col

[Ronijayne]

Don't think I have seen this thread before. Do I qualify to post (if I have not already, haven't read back very far!)

My Grandmother was of Welsh heritage.

We went to Wales so many weekends every year. Most of my childhood photos are taken in Wales.

I belong to the St. David's society here in Manhattan and I am on the list for Welsh Assembly events. Last year Aeronwy Thomas came to read her own and her father Dylan's poetry. I had a few drinks with her and her husband, she said she gives Welsh classes at home. Sadly she died recently.

Cymru am byth

Roni

[Blue70]

Dylan Thomas has links to Laugharne in South Wales where one of my Welsh ancestors came from.

Col

[George]

Mark, have a look at the book " Building the Industrial City" edited by Martin Doughty, pub 1986. It has a very interesting chapter on " The Welsh Influence on the Building Industry in Victorian Liverpool". It seems most of the 100,000 houses built in Liverpool in the 19th C were built mainly because of Welsh initiative and enterprise using building materials from North Wales

Hell! no wonder me house is in a sorry state.

I was under the impression all building materials came from local quarry's in Liverpool,reason being it was cheaper to extract and transport Sandstone from them.

[Howie]

Woman's memories of Second World War impact on North Wales
Sep 1 2009
by Andrew Gilpin, Daily Post

IT was the moment the nation had dreaded: On September 3, 70 years ago, Britain was left with no choice but to declare war on Germany.

Thus began the deadliest military conflict in history in which more than 60 million people were killed. A terrible era which helped shape the modern Britain and Europe of today.

Among the horror came unforgettable tales of courage and stoicism: Dunkirk, the D-Day landings, the Blitz.

When war was declared, its impact on North Wales was immediate. The sky did not fill with enemy planes nor did bombs rain down.

But a pervading sense of fear bordering on panic set in everywhere. And in what proved ? at first ? to be a huge over-reaction, North Wales was swamped with thousands of evacuees pouring in from the Liverpool area.

Most were children, wrenched away from their families, not knowing where they were being sent.

Local people did their bit and helped look after youngsters. Yet many soon went back when the expected bomb attacks on Liverpool failed initially to materialise.

Laurette Danson MBE, a lifelong resident of Colwyn Bay, has good reason to be upset.

?Many evacuees went back to Liverpool. It was very sad because they went back to the bombing,? she says. ?We had five evacuees in our house ? five of the little things. A brother and a sister were taken back by their mother and father and we heard that they were killed by a bomb a fortnight after returning.

?The youngest of the five children was seven, and there was a little girl of five. She looked like butter wouldn?t melt in her mouth but she ran the gang. Bless her, she went back and she was killed.

?The parents, they sent these children so they would be safe but then there are sitting at home and thinking ?I want them back and we will all be together?. They either came or sent for them to go back and back they went.?

Mrs Danson, now in her 80s and still an active member of Colwyn Bay Town Council, can clearly remember the day war broke out.

?My parents and my elder sister and I were sitting in our drawing room listening to the wireless. Mr Chamberlain came on and he said that the country was at war. It was an awful thing to hear this country was at war. My parents, they were even more distressed. I was a teenager at the time.

?This town was inundated with evacuees from Liverpool and the people of Colwyn Bay received them into their homes. It was the law of the land and you had to take them in.

?They sent trainload after trainload of children coming in. My sister and I went along and met the trains and helped take the little ones to people?s houses,? recalls Mrs Danson.

Months later, as the bombs started to fall on Liverpool, she looked across the sea to a city on fire.

Then there were the little things you would notice ? for instance, iron railings around houses taken away to be smelted down for ammunition.

Amid the gloom was a ray of sunshine. Soldier Anthony Danson was stationed nearby and was befriended by her family. She got on well with him and he became her future husband with whom she had four children.

A sense of defiance in the face of evil has never left Mrs Danson.

?This was our land. It was awful, but we were all very patriotic. That was the wonderful part about it, we were as one. Sadly I don?t see it today,? she says.

?We all stood together to protect this land and it meant something to us, Britain. It didn?t matter whether you were Liberal or Labour, you stood together.?

Major Basil Heaton, farmer of the Rhual estate near Mold, played a key role in the Normandy landings on D-Day in 1944.

He was the first off his landing craft on Gold Beach amid sniping and machine gun fire from defending Germans. It was the start of a long, exhausting but successful day in which his men helped secure the beachhead.

But five years earlier, Major Heaton, now 85, was a schoolboy in his mid teens. He was back home from boarding school enjoying a summer holiday on September 3.

?I remember it quite clearly. It was a lovely, sunny day. We heard the announcement in the library. We all said good Lord, we were frightened the bombs would come straight down.

?That afternoon, my father and mother started packing. My father went back to the Royal Navy in Liverpool, from which he had retired.

?My mother went to Prestatyn to command a company of the Woman?s Auxiliary Territorial Service and my brother and I were rather left on our own. We were at home because it was the summer holidays but we then returned to boarding school.

?Within a few days or weeks around eight to 10 evacuees arrived from Liverpool, although I think they went back after a few weeks. They didn?t like it at all. They weren?t country people, they wanted to go back.?

But the Heatons? large farmhouse wasn?t left alone for long. It soon become a land army hostel with Army girls living there for the rest of the war ?taking over half the house,? recalls Major Heaton.

?I had no doubt I would follow them. When I left school I joined up straightaway. I felt positive about it. It had to be done. The country pulled together. Whether it would pull together now I don?t know. There was a terrific feeling of comradeship.?

Derrick Pratt, a North Wales historian now living in Welsh Frankton, grew up in Wrexham.

His first memory of the war as a youngster of 12 is that of his father leaving and going off to fight.

His dad was wounded in the arm during the D-day landings, but at least he survived, many school pupils were to lose their father in the fighting.

The Wrexham area was relatively unscathed but the fear was still strong, and Mr Pratt recalls how some would leave their homes to go out into open countryside to sleep under the hedgerows at night, where they believed they would be safer.

?I became the man of the household and had to cope with official instructions ? stuff that came through the letterbox on how to make your house gas proof, and how to strengthen bedroom ceilings.

?It was completely unrealistic. There was great joy when we got our own gas masks, but we had a lot of problems with the baby gas mask for my younger brother.

?I learned to dig for victory in the school gardens, and everybody had allotments. The back gardens were dug up and I remember planting out our back garden.?

Mr Pratt helped out building an air raid shelter near his home. We didn?t have a wheelbarrow of our own so I sawed my sister?s pram into half and used it to move the bricks from a cottage demolished in Market Street, Wrexham. In the end we only used it a couple of times.?

Looking back on a conflict which began 70 years ago now, Derrick Pratt expresses some surprise that we managed to win.

?We had a First World War mentality,? he says. ?It took a long time to get our act together.?

Perhaps it was, in the words of Roosevelt?s secretary of state Cordell Hull, the British ?indomitable spirit? which ultimately ensured our victory.

Source: Daily Post North Wales (http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/2009/09/01/it-was-a-lovely-sunny-day-as-we-heard-it-was-war-we-were-scared-bombs-would-come-straight-away-55578-24573962/)

[taffy]

Hell! no wonder me house is in a sorry state.

I was under the impression all building materials came from local quarry's in Liverpool,reason being it was cheaper to extract and transport Sandstone from them.

Most 19th C property in Liverpool was of course largely built in brick with the odd bit of sandstone for windows and lintels. Much of this brick came from Ruabon.

[kevin]

Much of this brick came from Ruabon.

Poland?
;-)