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Oudeis
07-23-2011, 07:38 PM
Dear friends,



The Palestinian people are calling on the world to recognise Palestine as a state. Over 120 countries have endorsed the call, but the US and Israel are opposing and key European leaders are on the fence. If we can persuade Europe and the UK to support this non violent, legitimate bid now, it could spur a dramatic shift towards peace. Click to sign the urgent petition:

Sign the petition
In four days the UN Security Council will meet, and the world has an opportunity to embrace a new proposal that could turn the tide on decades of failed Israeli-Palestinian peace talks: UN recognition of the state of Palestine.

Over 120 nations from the Middle East, Africa, Asia, and Latin America have already endorsed this initiative, but Israel's right-wing government and the US vehemently oppose it. The UK and other key European countries are still undecided, but a massive public push now could tip them to vote for this momentous opportunity to end 40 years of military occupation.

US-led peace initiatives have failed for decades, while Israel has confined the Palestinians to small areas, confiscated their lands and blocked their independence. This bold new initiative could be the best opportunity to jump start a resolution of the conflict, but Europe and the UK must take the lead. Let’s build a massive global call for the UK and other European leaders to endorse this statehood bid now, and make clear that citizens across the world support this legitimate, non-violent, diplomatic proposal. Sign the petition and send this to everyone:

http://www.avaaz.org/en/independence_for_palestine_uk/?vl

While the roots of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict are complex, most people on all sides agree that the best path to peace now is the creation of two states. But repeated peace processes have been undermined by violence on both sides, extensive Israeli settlement-building in the West Bank, and the humanitarian blockade on Gaza. The Israeli occupation has shrunk and fragmented the territory for a Palestinian state and made daily life a crippling ordeal for the Palestinian people. The UN, World Bank and IMF have all recently announced that Palestinians are ready to run an independent state, but say the main constraint to success is the Israeli occupation. Even the US President has called for an end to settlement expansion and a return to the 1967 borders with mutually agreed land-swaps, but Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu has furiously refused to cooperate.

It’s time for a dramatic shift away from a futile peace process and on to a new path for progress. While the Israeli and US governments are calling the Palestinian initiative ‘unilateral’ and dangerous, in fact the world’s nations overwhelmingly support this diplomatic move away from violence. Global recognition of Palestine could crush extremists, and foster a growing non-violent Palestinian-Israeli movement in step with the democratic momentum across the region. Most importantly, it will rescue a path to a negotiated settlement, allow the Palestinians access to a variety of international institutions that can help advance Palestinian freedom, and send a clear signal to Israel’s pro-settler government that the world will no longer accept their impunity and intransigence.

For too long, Israel has undermined the hope for a Palestinian state. For too long, the US has appeased them, and for too long Europe has hidden behind the US. Right now, France, Spain, Germany, the UK and the High Representative of the EU are on the fence about Palestinian statehood. Let’s appeal to them to stand on the right side of history and support a Palestinian declaration of freedom and independence, with overwhelming support, and financial aid. Sign the urgent petition now to urge Europe to support the bid and back this move for long-term peace in Israel and Palestine:

"One small step for man, one giant leap..." Says I.

chasevans
07-23-2011, 09:09 PM
"...into the abyss?"
Chas
:nod:

Max
07-23-2011, 10:29 PM
I signed it but it won't change a thing while the Israeli gov stays facist and as long as the US supports them.

Oudeis
07-24-2011, 06:18 PM
From the mouth and the pen of Edmund Burke...

* "It's better to be good than evil, but one achieves goodness at a terrific cost."
* "All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing."
* "The price good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men."
* "The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing."
* "It is a man's own mind, not his enemy or foe, that lures him to evil ways."

http://www.historyguide.org/intellect/burke.html

Marty1
07-24-2011, 07:48 PM
Another fine Irishman ! I have not signed, there has to be agreement on both sides, both have responsibilities for peace in the region, I do believe there should Palestinian State when agreement takes place.

chasevans
07-24-2011, 09:05 PM
I see it as a religious divide rather than national. I don't believe our support for a Palestinian nation would bring peace. I do have sympathy for Palestine. Both sides are Semitic people, intervention it would seem would be like muddying the waters. Wish petitioning could solve it.
Regards Oudeis and Marty1,
Chas:neutral:

Max
07-26-2011, 12:17 PM
Another fine Irishman ! I have not signed, there has to be agreement on both sides, both have responsibilities for peace in the region, I do believe there should Palestinian State when agreement takes place.
There was supposed to be a state for Palestine in the original deal but don't know why it never set off. Jerusalem was supposed to be neutral where both sides could travel freely to their own states. The realistic option is the 1967 borders though now.

Oudeis
07-26-2011, 12:37 PM
I notice, and you could see for yourself, that they have so far garnered over 450,000 names.

When all is said and done this may not be the ideal solution, if there is ever to be such a thing--anywhere, anytime--, but we do know what has happened in the past when the plight of one group of people has been ignored and left to the careful attentions of a 'legitimate' state.

Perhaps we learn from the mistakes of the past only how to make them more palatable?

Tippo
07-26-2011, 11:43 PM
If I remember rightly Israel was based on terrorism
And as my memory has it in the process they hung
a couple of our lads in the Olive groves about 1947?
so much for the Olive branch carried by the dove of
piece. I'm holier than thow I dont think, what chance
of justice for the Palastinians with Jack Straw calling
the odds here and it would be the same in the the USA.
they have the call there to.

Cheer's,

Tippo.

wsteve55
07-27-2011, 12:02 AM
If I remember rightly Israel was based on terrorism
And as my memory has it in the process they hung
a couple of our lads in the Olive groves about 1947?
so much for the Olive branch carried by the dove of
piece. I'm holier than thow I dont think, what chance
of justice for the Palastinians with Jack Straw calling
the odds here and it would be the same in the the USA.
they have the call there to.

Cheer's,

Tippo.

But one man's terrorist,is anothers freedom fighter!

Oudeis
07-27-2011, 10:41 AM
Yes, there can indeed be much to be said around and about this important international issue, but there is also something that can be done and is being done too...

547,000 and counting...

Marty1
07-27-2011, 04:47 PM
The Obama administration's representative at the meeting, Ambassador Rosemary DiCarlo, U.S. Deputy Permanent Representative was definitive, saying, "My government has been clear all along. The only place where permanent status issues can be resolved, including borders and territory, is in negotiations between the parties -- not in international fora such as the United Nations."

Both President Obama and the U.S. Congress have weighed in to stop the September statehood bid, arguing that a unilateral move by Palestine will hamper the peace negotiations. Last month, the U.S. Senate passed a resolution that seeks restrictions on aid to Palestine if the decision is made to pursue statehood at the U.N.

Mansour was clear that the Palestinians understand that a bid for U.N. membership would have to come first from the U.N. Secretary General, Ban Ki-moon, then proceed to the U.N. Security Council, where the U.S. would stop a recommendation from going to a vote on the General Assembly floor.

As I said there has to be agreement, life may become a tad more difficult for those in Gaza, I hope I'm wrong !!

Oudeis
07-27-2011, 08:18 PM
What a funny old thing this law is, is it not?

Some points must be decided by the parties and others almost at random by disinterested/uninterested/vested-interested parties.
Take Lybia for example. A decision has been made to pay-out sequestered funds to the 'rebels', a far greater sum was hoped to be freed-up in the same way, but this has been nay-said by government lawyers. Nevertheless sovereign Lybian territory has been emptied and promised to these same 'rebels'.

Kinda-BTW
A decision to release a prisoner on health grounds (expert advice) has been baldly stated as wrong. So, what does that mean for other decisions taken by elected representatives following expert advice as laid down by law (or precedent)?
Might this lead to the transfer of a recent rail contract to a British manufacturer, from the foreign winner?

"Hold not your breath." Readeth commandment 8/9B.

A.D.W
07-27-2011, 08:54 PM
I would recommend a book called The Punishment of Gaza written by Gideon Levy. This is a book about the Zionist occupation of Gaza from 2005 to 2009 and is a fine read.

Oudeis
07-28-2011, 09:35 AM
...and then there is BP's license to drill for natural gas off the coast of the Gaza Strip...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhXvckF0eSw

Max
07-28-2011, 06:42 PM
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/falklandislands/8463934/Israel-supplied-arms-to-Argentina-during-Falklands-War.html

Marty1
07-28-2011, 08:21 PM
Israel 'supplied arms to Argentina during Falklands War'

Can this be true I wonder ?

Oudeis
07-28-2011, 09:14 PM
Israel 'supplied arms to Argentina during Falklands War'

Can this be true I wonder ?

It was bad enough that the French did.

[French exocet missiles were programmed into our ships defence system as 'friendly', so no counter measures were taken.] War is ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUZu8bvxJs4

Marty1
07-28-2011, 09:31 PM
I did hear about the efing frogs, Israel is a new one to me though !