I don't know whether these have any impact on local communities but I can't help giggle when I see them walking together with their uniforms with a hint of blue.

Every day I see at least 4 from the drive from the top of Lodge Lane to the bottom going about their business.

Yet the long drive along Aigburth Rd, you don't see any.

What's your experience of them?

Do you want to become one Kev, here's how (http://www.how2become.co.uk/pcso.htm?keyword=|googlepcso|communitysupportoffic er).

No chance mate :PDT1

They are a common sight around Anfield. They are always walking around here.
The local asbos goad them.

Joking aside, you see them all over the place and they seem to have replaced the regular beat bobbies who now cruise round in patrol cars. Thats all very well if they can be effective, but they have no power of arrest and once the local local scallies get wind of that their lives must be hell.

Its funny how their faces just don't seem to fit in to the local areas they are put in.

Although they've not got powers of arrest, they free up the time of the "real" police to go and arrest the scallies, by taking on the "community support" role (does exactly what it says on the tin :unibrow:), making and maintaining links with people and businesses (saw some in Tesco tonight), doing talks, visiting schools, rescuing-the-cat-from-the-tree kind of stuff. They can deal with minor things, like dropping litter, by way of fixed penalties too.

Unfortunately cos they're not sent intentionally to confrontational situations (they're left to the constables) they're not always as fully equipped when it comes to body armour, but to a scally who hates the police, CSO or Constable makes no difference...

Ah! times change. In bygone days the local beat copper was also the community copper. (See an article in Scottie Press, St Josephs Parish). No armour - just a baton and whistle. Baton never used - or hardly ever. They knew their local people (scallies or otherwise - and the otherwise meant the really great people of the Pool - mostly the poor). Local coppers all had nicknames. When a copper was in trouble - many locals would phone for help from the nearest red telephone box, and even sometimes pitch in. Coppers walked the beat "as laid down" - going through a strict routine to be where they were supposed to be at any given time. This was for their saftey: no radio and quick call for 'back-up'. Only at night could you hear the THREE WHISTLE BLASTS from a copper in trouble. Community Policing -not a new idea. I'm surpised to hear of their limited powers. The old Special Constable had, at least a power of arrest. Although it was often a pain in the neck. No intent to disparage the contribution of the Specials in the Pool.

Has anyone had any thoughts on the two CPOs that left a drowing child to die because they 'hadn't been trained' in water rescue?

Hobby Bobbies need to go.Useless man hours doing useless things.They may look nice walking round but they do nothing!!!!
Useless.The kids love taking the urine outta them.
More money being wasted.
:handclap:

CSO Powers include:

:: Power to issue penalty notices in respect of offences of disorder

:: Power to issue fixed penalty notices for truancy

:: Power to issue fixed penalty notices for cycling on a footpath

:: Power to issue fixed penalty notices for dog fouling

:: Power to issue fixed penalty notices for graffiti and fly-posting

:: Power to require name and address for anti-social behaviour

:: Power to detain

:: Power to use reasonable force to prevent a detained person making off

:: Power to enter and search any premises for the purposes of saving life and limb or preventing serious damage to property.

Yet they seem bound completely by procedure even when faced with someone drowning, why put themselves at risk eh for 16k a year? :rolleyes:

Well, I see them walking around, more of a deterant I think.
Unlike specials they have very limited powers, as for Blunket
condeming the actions of the 2 who didn't jump in and try
and save the lad, he introduced them so he is really saying
" Oh I made a mistake", also suppose the 2 PCSO,s couldn't
swim ?. Instead of the lad drowning it could have been 3.
Wonder how many real police officers whould have jumped in ?
with all the gear they wear they would have sunk like a brick

There is a difference though isn't there. You have the PCSO's and the Specials. Don't the specials give up their own time and not get paid to patrol?

The parents were very quick to blame the cppo's but where were they?

Did they know were their kids where and how many parents do know where their kids are or what they are up to before shuffling the blame on to others.

There is a difference though isn't there. You have the PCSO's and the Specials. Don't the specials give up their own time and not get paid to patrol?

Yes they do and get issued with a warrent card, and correct me if I,m
wrong, have power of arrest. It dosn't really matter who was about
Real bobby, PCSO, special or member of the public, what stopped anyone
else jumping in ?. As far as I,m aware members of the emergency services
are told not to endanger their own life, allthough most would.

I can,t point the finger at the chocolate bobbys. They are there to do a job no matter what it is or how menial it is. It just so happened that they were at the scene, isn,t it tough that they couldn,t swim. What if there was nobody about, the kid would have died anyway. It,s just one of those sad things in life.

Parents should not put the blame on anybody but themselves for not teaching them how dangerous it was to go swimming unsupervised. Putting the blame on anbody that was there is just futile, and blaming someone in authority is in my book try to claim compensation.

There must be thousands of these CPOs on around 16k a year. Why didn't the Gov just emply half the amount of bizzies, thats assuming the pollice earn around 30k?

There must be thousands of these CPOs on around 16k a year. Why didn't the Gov just emply half the amount of bizzies, thats assuming the pollice earn around 30k?

Sort of defeats the object. The idea of PCSO,s is to free up time
to allow real police officers to do what they are paid for, ie, solve
crimes and not have to worry about trivial matters like dropping litter
having said that every bobby has to reach an target every month, so
even the easy trivial stuff adds to his quota

An analogy >>>>

Man see's Fire, people trapped, next to him a fire extinguisher, the man dont make a move to help, WHY ?? cos he aint been trained how to use the appliance. People burn, people die.

Another analogy >>>>
Road accident, head through windscreen, jugular severed, no move by Mr Joe Public, Why not ? Cos he aint been trained in FA, person dies.

Come on Mr Chief of Police, stop making soft stupid excuses and join us in the real world.

In both cases above Mr Joe Public would have made an attempt to save a life. Its an instinct not a thought.

Even the man who gave you CSO's , Mr David Blunket, says they were wrong to do nothing. See this link >>>>>

http://news.uk.msn.com/Article.aspx?cp-documentid=6202088

I think I have said enough.

Phredd

An analogy >>>>

Man see's Fire, people trapped, next to him a fire extinguisher, the man dont make a move to help, WHY ?? cos he aint been trained how to use the appliance. People burn, people die.

Another analogy >>>>
Road accident, head through windscreen, jugular severed, no move by Mr Joe Public, Why not ? Cos he aint been trained in FA, person dies.

Come on Mr Chief of Police, stop making soft stupid excuses and join us in the real world.

In both cases above Mr Joe Public would have made an attempt to save a life. Its an instinct not a thought.

Even the man who gave you CSO's , Mr David Blunket, says they were wrong to do nothing. See this link >>>>>

http://news.uk.msn.com/Article.aspx?cp-documentid=6202088

I think I have said enough.

Phredd

Well Phredd,
must admit my initial feelings were much the same, P/C gone mad,etc, but it was made apparent,though not emphasised,in the news reports, that the lad had already gone under by the time the CSO'S arrived,and faced with quite a large expanse of water, were basically in a situation were they were at a loss what to do for the best,and sought help from a more experienced source! But, the media decided to make it appear that the 2 CSO,s had stood and watched,as the incident occured!!!!! I can only despair of the media, and wonder how the 2 CSO's must be feeling right now,with thier new found infamy!!!!
Steve.

i feel the CPO,S did the right thing not going to the rescue of that ten year old,where was the lads parents?why were they left to play near a vast pond on their own?its no use blaming other people for their own lack of parental care.

i feel the CPO,S did the right thing not going to the rescue of that ten year old,where was the lads parents?why were they left to play near a vast pond on their own?its no use blaming other people for their own lack of parental care.

And how old were you before you could go out and play without your parents?
Am sure at 10 years old you were like most kids...OUT PLAYING!:PDT10

i played in the street,right by my house because i had responsible parents. i was never allowed to play near water,a railway line, or hang around shops or street corners to intimidate people. parental control is always lacking in situations like this.yes i have three children and YES when the two eldest lived at home i knew were they were 24/7 as i do with my 13 year old now.i take full reponsibility for my children, they never came to any harm with the care i have given them.

I personally would have been in there like a shot and I have not been 'trained' in water rescue. These CPO's were about as much use as a chocolate fireguard and are not 'fit for purpose'.

:disgust:

I personally would have been in there like a shot and I have not been 'trained' in water rescue. These CPO's were about as much use as a chocolate fireguard and are not 'fit for purpose'.

:disgust:

You are missing the point, he was allready under water, somewere
what about the other people around ?.

You are missing the point, he was allready under water, somewere
what about the other people around ?.

Why would other people go to the rescue when we have hobby bobby's standing there.Isn't it there duty to keep the public safe ?:PDT10

I would of dived in if I had been there.

what if they had jumped in and drowned themselves they could have left a couple of kids without a dad just because the parents couldnt be bothered to take care of their OWN kids, they should stop putting the blame on other people and take responsibility for their own lack of parental skills

Why would other people go to the rescue when we have hobby bobby's standing there.Isn't it there duty to keep the public safe ?:PDT10

I would of dived in if I had been there.

You answered your own question. There were 2 fishermen who told
the PCSO,s were the lad was last seen, why did they just stand there ?
As I have said the lad was not visible, he could be anywere and as has been
what if they drowned ?, be a different story then wouldn't it ?.
Hero PCSO,s dive in to save boy, unfortunately both drowned leaving
wives and children. The emergency services are told NOT to endager
their own lifes, I agree most do and well done to them

So then my opinion is this...
No need for hobby bobby's.They do bugger all round here except give the kids something to skit.
They should all go back to being security guards at the local shops.:PDT10

So then my opinion is this...
No need for hobby bobby's.They do bugger all round here except give the kids something to skit.
They should all go back to being security guards at the local shops.:PDT10

I know what you are saying, and to a point I agree. The idea I think
is 2 fold, 1 to provide some sort of visual detterent, 2 to try and free
up the real police from dealing with farcical things like dropping litter
etc, however, I have said before the real bobies have a monthly quota
to reach, so minor things all help meet it. Anyway my personal view is
the 2 PCSO,s acted rightly, if Fire and Rescue were called, a fireman would not be allowed to just jump in without a safety line, so why should
the PCSO,s ?. END OF from me.

Why would other people go to the rescue when we have hobby bobby's standing there.Isn't it there duty to keep the public safe ?:PDT10

I would of dived in if I had been there.

.....and not done a lot of good really! Have you ever tried looking for anyone underwater? and in the meantime,they drown!!!This has happened many times,and has led to the present caution against throwing yourself into a situation, where you might easily add to the death count!Does anyone remember the p/c's in Blackpool ,some years ago,who drowned in rough seas,on the prom' trying to save a dog,and it's owner?

Just a little off the subject here but...
The other day my nephew who works all week was driving his car home from work with a friend.
Halfway home down the east lancs the Matrix team pulled him over.However it just wasn't a stop.It was guns out,get on the ground etc etc.Treated like a pair of thugs.The car was stripped searched (they took everything out) and the lads where searched in every possible place of their body in the street.
Luckily enough a film crew happened to be near and filmed the whole thing.
Yesterday my nephew gave an interview to channel 4 on "why the Matrix are bullies".
I myself have been pulled by these Matrix and yes they are complete bullies.No wonder the kids have very little respect for them if that's the way they treat "joe public".
So watch for channel 4 news thursday and see our local bobbies doing what they do best!!!!:PDT11

Thanks for the MATRIX info will set the timer and record it....

Matrix dont carry guns. ARV's do. To stop a vehicle or people at full response i.e. like the yanks do every day to everyone, needs spot on grounds.
Was his mate or his car known to police?
ACAB?

I don't think the car or either of them are well known to the plod.
It was this "high profile" thing they decided to do,pull youths in.
Some of it was aired on ch4 news last thursday.There's supposed to be more interview stuff with some kids and my nephew.Maybe this thursday we'll see it.
Regarding ACAB..
Not really.Am sre there are 1 or 2 who live in "the real world".

A MOVE to give community support officers the same uniforms as ordinary police officers has been condemned by Merseyside Police Federation. Read (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2007/10/11/cop-uniform-row-100252-19931343/)

waste of space and money, sorry :PDT_Xtremez_42:

.

When's the last time you saw a copper walking about a neighbourhood?

.

I've seen proper policemen come round ours on horseback, bizarre. The trouble nowadays with police patrolling is that if they have to make an arrest, the rest of their shift is done in with paperwork so in that respect CSOs are a useful idea as they can provide a permanent presence/deterrent. Thing is, the yobs know their powers are limited and take the piss none stop. If the police officers procedures could be simplified then their time would be freed up to provide a real deterrent on the streets.

If there wasn't a PCSO walking around my neighbourhood there wouldn't be a copper in his/her place.

But thats all they do, with little smiles on their faces, getting paid 16k do do so. Most of them arnt from the communities they patrol and really have no right to go into those communities handing out easy to enforce fines on easy targets, further alienating themseleves in the process, like traffic wardens.

When all we want is more coppers taking a no tollerance approach to anti social behaviour and solving crimes etc.......

Joking aside, you see them all over the place and they seem to have replaced the regular beat bobbies who now cruise round in patrol cars. Thats all very well if they can be effective, but they have no power of arrest and once the local local scallies get wind of that their lives must be hell.



They don't have Powers of Arrest but they do have the Power to detain people upto 30mins untill a patrol Arrives .

Ah! times change. In bygone days the local beat copper was also the community copper. (See an article in Scottie Press, St Josephs Parish). No armour - just a baton and whistle. Baton never used - or hardly ever. They knew their local people (scallies or otherwise - and the otherwise meant the really great people of the Pool - mostly the poor). Local coppers all had nicknames. When a copper was in trouble - many locals would phone for help from the nearest red telephone box, and even sometimes pitch in. Coppers walked the beat "as laid down" - going through a strict routine to be where they were supposed to be at any given time. This was for their saftey: no radio and quick call for 'back-up'. Only at night could you hear the THREE WHISTLE BLASTS from a copper in trouble. Community Policing -not a new idea. I'm surpised to hear of their limited powers. The old Special Constable had, at least a power of arrest. Although it was often a pain in the neck. No intent to disparage the contribution of the Specials in the Pool.


Specials only have the powe of citizeens arrest!

CSOs on Merseyside have now been given the power to disperse youths and seize motor vehicles.

http://www.merseyside.police.uk/html/news/news/december/mp03-12c-pcso-powers.htm

Yet they'll still plod along in twos in some weird alternative universe, head in the clouds etc.

CSOs on Merseyside have now been given the power to disperse youths and seize motor vehicles.

http://www.merseyside.police.uk/html/news/news/december/mp03-12c-pcso-powers.htm



Does anyone know what the 2 discretionary powers are. On their website they say there are 20 standard powers and a number of discretionary powers, 2 of which have been awarded in Merseyside.

One of them is probably the "Power to disperse groups and remove persons under 16 to their place of residence" but what is the other one?

I don't think its the "seize motor vehicles" one as that is in the standard 20.

Yet they'll still plod along in twos in some weird alternative universe, head in the clouds etc.

And doing bugger all else Kev,:PDT11

Saw two of them again at the bottom of Lode Lane, honestly they looked like they were in a world of their smiling and chatting to each other, I thought they were skipping holding hands at one point.

Saw two of them again at the bottom of Lode Lane, honestly they looked like they were in a world of their smiling and chatting to each other, I thought they were skipping holding hands at one point.


:handclap::handclap::handclap: I only found out the other day that we have got a community policeman in the Dingle, but in the 5 years I have been here, I've never clapsed my eyes on him.

We got a little and large.
One rather little,carrying far too much weight the other too thin.
They two of them could be a comedy act!!

16K for that, no wonder they are all smilie happy people :PDT_Aliboronz_24:

Busy, copper on yer beat,

with yer elephantine feet.

Why the batton, why the bike ?

Why the walky, talky mike.

When you get to heaven's gate,

take those bleedin' boots off mate.



I think the above was by Roger McGough (Maybe Chris G will know ?)

4 CSOs posts are being cut in Wirral

http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-news/regional-news/2007/12/15/wirral-to-cut-down-on-police-csos-64375-20252777/

Busy, copper on yer beat,

with yer elephantine feet.

Why the batton, why the bike ?

Why the walky, talky mike.

When you get to heaven's gate,

take those bleedin' boots off mate.



I think the above was by Roger McGough (Maybe Chris G will know ?)

Reminds me of a similar tune that Ronnie Barker done in porridge..
Do you see yon' screw
with his looks so vein
with his brand new keys on his brand new chain
with a face like a ferret and a pea for a brain
And his hand on his whistle in the mornin'.:handclap: