Coming out of work on overtime this afternoon I passed down Castle Street and Lord Street. I noticed a huge amount of Goth teenagers congregating in Derby Square. Not only does it look really bad they are causing a lot of trouble. Lord Street was full of them screaming and running round and the square itself looks really tatty. They are lounging around the Queen Victoria monument in a really disrespectfull way

They are acting in an antisociaal behavior and I can't understaand why the police don't disperse them.

Anyone coming here for the first time and seeing that would get a really bad impression.

Hey, take away their eyeliner and matrix coats and they become hoodies...

:Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

Coming out of work on overtime this afternoon I passed down Castle Street and Lord Street. I noticed a huge amount of Goth teenagers congregating in Derby Square. Not only does it look really bad they are causing a lot of trouble. Lord Street was full of them screaming and running round and the square itself looks really tatty. They are lounging around the Queen Victoria monument in a really disrespectfull way

They are acting in an antisociaal behavior and I can't understaand why the police don't disperse them.

Anyone coming here for the first time and seeing that would get a really bad impression.

Is this post for real?

They usually congregate at the Pier Head, but just like the seagulls the bad weather brings them further inland. Agree, they should be dispersed by the police.

Is this post for real?


Don't tell us you were one of them! :)

Don't tell us you were one of them! :)

Ha Ha.
No.
The original post reads just llike a wind up!
They don't bother me.

If you had seen the noise they were making and the fact that Lord Street was full of them shouting, swearing and acting antisocially you would know it's for real.

Don't get me wrong I am not against Goths but surely somewhere should be provided for them to vent their teenie angst in.

If you had seen the noise they were making and the fact that Lord Street was full of them shouting, swearing and acting antisocially you would know it's for real.

Don't get me wrong I am not against Goths but surely somewhere should be provided for them to vent their teenie angst in.

Sorry S, now I realise you're serious.
They used to be by the old Quiggins and the Bluecoat, and always seemed rather innocuous.

Well that's it there is nowhere for them to go. But Derby Square is not the right place.

There's a hell of a lot of graffiti around the Victoria monument now if you got an take a closer lookm its quite sad.

Indeed and the irony is that that is outside the Crown Court. If they can't keep a semblance of order there where can they keep order?

They come from Formby and the affluent suburbs to indulge in a little safe Anti Social behavior away from the estates and other scall hang outs. Give 'em two years and they'll all be off to Uni only to be replaced by another load. I'm sure there's a bus that bring 'em all in.

Saturday afternoon is ridiculous by the Pier head :)

Hug a Goth I say.

I didn't realise they were casing such a problem.In my experience you can walk through/past them and they won't give you a second look.I don't think you could say the same about a similarly large assembly of dirty trackied scratters.

Coming out of work on overtime this afternoon I passed down Castle Street and Lord Street. I noticed a huge amount of Goth teenagers congregating in Derby Square. Not only does it look really bad they are causing a lot of trouble. Lord Street was full of them screaming and running round and the square itself looks really tatty. They are lounging around the Queen Victoria monument in a really disrespectfull way

They are acting in an antisociaal behavior and I can't understaand why the police don't disperse them.

Anyone coming here for the first time and seeing that would get a really bad impression.

What trouble are they actually causing apart from just arsing about? I've never had a spot of trouble from any Goth. They may hang around in groups but they're no scallies in trackies.

There is anti-social behavior where someone is kicking a window through, just by sitting around, they're doing no harm.

I quite agree Jona.

Although, goths and emo kids are 2 different things.

Goths, in my opinion, are the more shy and quiet of the 2.

Emo kids are probably the ones causing the noise, they do love attention. (they do annoy me somewhat)

But, in actual fact, I have never heard or seen any goth or emo commit any anti social behaviour. I.e being abusive to people passing by, vandalising property, etc.

Emo kids? please reveal more.....

Emo kids? please reveal more.....

Emo kids are into 'emotional hardcore' music. They dress in dark colours but with kitschy accessories. Skinny jeans, converse, designer haircuts, the guys with long fringes mostly combed over.
They are the ones you have most likely seen in gangs in Derby Square, and at the Pier Head, which they simply call 'The Pier'.

LOL I must be getting old - first I've ever heard of Emo Kids :eek: :)

I used to be a Goth in my younger days, well about 10 years ago. Black jeans, metallica T-shirt and bikers jacket. I even grew my hair once but let's not go there :handclap:

The funny thing about them is, once they were 'alternative', but now they're just the new fashion. It's 'cool' to wear stripes, beads and jeans that are too tight, too much make-up and spending the whole time looking sorrowful.

Still, largely they're ok, and are introvert in that they don't intimidate or attack members of the public for enjoyment. My only complaint is the rubbish grafitti and bottle smashing that seems to go on - perhaps this is their little rebellion? Either way, I prefer them 100x to scallies, and it seems that more and more kids are choosing poetry, indie/rock music and makeup to dangerous dogs, awful 'house' music and eyeballing every passer-by.

l.

Don't get me wrong I am not against Goths but surely somewhere should be provided for them to vent their teenie angst in.they could hang upside down in the williamson tunnels.

Don't defend the goths, when their in 1s, 2s or 3s their fine but get them in a huge group like at derby square and their tossers. They are always graffitying (made up word), jumping all over telephone boxes and for a passer by I'm sure 40 goth clones smoking weed and having a me against the world attitude is intimidating.

they could hang upside down in the williamson tunnels.

:handclap:

* Having said that they are better than walking past scallies and worrying about getting stabbed for glancing in the wrong direction and dodging a pitbull.

The funny thing about them is, once they were 'alternative', but now they're just the new fashion. It's 'cool' to wear stripes, beads and jeans that are too tight, too much make-up and spending the whole time looking sorrowful.

Still, largely they're ok, and are introvert in that they don't intimidate or attack members of the public for enjoyment. My only complaint is the rubbish grafitti and bottle smashing that seems to go on - perhaps this is their little rebellion? Either way, I prefer them 100x to scallies, and it seems that more and more kids are choosing poetry, indie/rock music and makeup to dangerous dogs, awful 'house' music and eyeballing every passer-by.

Very well said Snappel!!:handclap:

I was in Quiggins on sat, lots of goths and moshers knocking in and around there and Bold st, they don't seem to be any trouble other than blocking the pavement - quite colourful - if you can call 'black' that...

It's not Quiggins though is it? Not anymore.

twiz - what I mean is, you may be intimidated by seeing them, but it's a bit different to the scallies. When I lived in Kensington, all the time I'd see them throwing cans and rubbish at passing cyclists, deliberately forcing people off the pavement, and generally hanging around in mobs waiting for the next passer-by to insult.

Usually the goths take notice of people going past - they're too busy hugging each other and running about. Yes, the grafitti and vandalism is totally unacceptable - in fact on one occasion me and a mate were by the Victoria monument and this goth kid smashed a bottle, and my mate made him pick the bits up.

Central Hall............

I didn't realise they were casing such a problem.In my experience you can walk through/past them and they won't give you a second look.I don't think you could say the same about a similarly large assembly of dirty trackied scratters....

Same here.Never heard a ****ie bird out of them that doesnt go on with most Normal Kids growin up..
They'd S*** their keks and run a Mile if you pulled them up..
Unlike the Scum that terrorise Kids outside McDonalds on a Saturday Afternoon robbin' money off Decent Kids,
They'd stick a Knife in yer as soon as look at yer.
3 of them pulled my Youngest Son up when he was about 16,He gave the Big fella such a dig in the gob that he was out cold and the other 2 were gone like the Roadrunner...meep meep!!..Typical Cowards..

It's true! I remember being up at the courts once on my bike, chatting to a couple of BMXer mates, and suddenly word spread through the 100+ goths that 'scallies were coming'. All the goths cleared out like Wilderbeast as nine or ten scalls appeared from Chavasse Park.

Interesting what you said about your son. Often the scallies are really in your face until they realise they don't have the upper hand. On the train once this mob of them were being rude to everyone, and some old woman stood up and started shouting and they all got embarassed and sloped off. Funnier than that was when my mate caught one who'd been throwing stuff at him, and my mate kicked the absolute crap out him. He was mid-teens but screamed like a girl!

It's true! I remember being up at the courts once on my bike, chatting to a couple of BMXer mates, and suddenly word spread through the 100+ goths that 'scallies were coming'. All the goths cleared out like Wilderbeast as nine or ten scalls appeared from Chavasse Park.

Interesting what you said about your son. Often the scallies are really in your face until they realise they don't have the upper hand. On the train once this mob of them were being rude to everyone, and some old woman stood up and started shouting and they all got embarassed and sloped off. Funnier than that was when my mate caught one who'd been throwing stuff at him, and my mate kicked the absolute crap out him. He was mid-teens but screamed like a girl!

Normally the way snappel,Collar the Big mouth and the rest shut up rather pronto!!.
Keep them great Photies comin' by the way Lad..Superb mate...:handclap: :handclap:

They come from Formby and the affluent suburbs to indulge in a little safe Anti Social behavior away from the estates and other scall hang outs. Give 'em two years and they'll all be off to Uni only to be replaced by another load. I'm sure there's a bus that bring 'em all in.

Saturday afternoon is ridiculous by the Pier head :)

Hug a Goth I say.

I've known goths In their 20's even hanging around those kinda places.

Female Goths though.:unibrow: :PDT_Aliboronz_24: :unibrow:

Chavasse Park.

The Bushes of Chavasse Park was mostly full of drug addicts and lads wanting BJ's. Saw some smackheads go Into the old Chavasse bushes just to inject.:Colorz_Grey_PDT_24:

Can't stop laughing, reading about how Goths are supposed to be a nasty bunch. As youth cults go, they must be the nicest bunch of kids I've ever come across. Same with the Emo kids who basically are a better dressed version of them. In the parlance of the youth today, Goths are a bunch of pussies. Nice kids.:PDT_Piratz_26:

Goths are great and Liverpool seems to be a bit of a Goth city. I love it when they gather at the Pier Head and start their screaming. It echoes like mad and seems crazy in a fun sort of way. People are popping along from the Albert Dock to oggle them. Maybe they'll be the next big thing about Liverpool? Loads of them are playing music. Any year now we might have a Liverpool Goth band that will end up bigger than the Beatles.

I do like the female ones with black hair though but It's always the blonde ones I like.:eek:

They come from Formby and the affluent suburbs to indulge in a little safe Anti Social behavior away from the estates and other scall hang outs. Give 'em two years and they'll all be off to Uni only to be replaced by another load. I'm sure there's a bus that bring 'em all in.

Saturday afternoon is ridiculous by the Pier head :)

Hug a Goth I say.

I am sorry to say that Wallasey can be included in that as-well! Why is it that when ever I get the 432 back over the water; there is always a group of them in the shelter? Not only do they look a right mess, the silly girls in the group are always loud! Why can't they just wait with some decorumn? (that goes for emo's too)

It makes me rather ashamed to be associated with Wallasey!

Maybe they congragate under the Queen Victoria Monument because she wore black after her late husbands death? They think that she was a goth herself??? But it is rather intimidating and scruffy, I know that other cities have Goths but why do they have to be somewhere where everyone can see them? Can't they get some underground room? Or just go! I can't get over their attitude sometimes but that's another story.

Don't really have a problem with Scallies; if you don't disturb them, they wont disturb you. I met some nice scally like persons in Breckfield once and they were actually really nice people! (I might be in the minority here!)

Don't defend the goths, when their in 1s, 2s or 3s their fine but get them in a huge group like at derby square and their tossers. They are always graffitying (made up word), jumping all over telephone boxes and for a passer by I'm sure 40 goth clones smoking weed and having a me against the world attitude is intimidating.

That makes them sound like football fans - surely there not that bad

I know they're every bit as cloned as scallies but I find them a breath of fresh air. Scallies nearly always look thick as sh*t. On balance, I think I'd rather be stuck in a lift with a goth than a scally.

Becareful some of you lot are starting to sound like your parents.

Since the 1950s, most young people have identified themselves belong to, being part of a youth subculture

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youth_subculture

can you remember/ see yourself as part of a youth subculture, have a look at the list below

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_youth_subcultures

Becareful some of you lot are starting to sound like your parents.


That is true to be honest! We all need some sort of "identity" at some point in our lives!

Why people have a problem with Goths hanging round? Yes they do spraypaint, which they should be prosecuted for, but as for being noisy etc, there doing it in a non residential area. Go into residential areas like Norris Green, Old Swan, Anfeild ad you will see scally kids doing a lot more than screaming and shouting. And they vandalise peoples homes, not just a monument.

I have never had ny sort of problems with Goths, they keep to themselves and are usually intelligent people. Scallys on the other hand cause murder and look for it. I been on buses and trains and if a few Goths are sitting down minding there own business, you can guarantee the minute a scally gets on, they start giving the goths a hard time. I have spoken to Goths, Skaters etc wheter be on public transport or in the Krazyhouse and you find they are usually quite witty and with a brain. Rather be on a bus full of Goths than Scallies.

The original point I was making was not whether Goths are better than Scallies or vice versa. It was about huge amounts of young people hanging round the Victoria monument on a Saturday afternoon. If it were Scallies doing this I would have the same opinion. The fact is that the Victoria monument has been defaaced in the past and the Goths cause a lot of noise and look unruly.

I agree many of these young people are probably very intelligent, but somewhere should be provided for them rather than Derby Square.

Kids are going to hang out in huge groups anyway, rather it would somewhere like town or a park than a residential area. Yes they should be tackled regarding the graffiti, but as long as there not causing trouble or intimidating passers by then i don't see the problem. No matter were they go, someone will still moan.

The original point I was making was not whether Goths are better than Scallies or vice versa. It was about huge amounts of young people hanging round the Victoria monument on a Saturday afternoon. If it were Scallies doing this I would have the same opinion. The fact is that the Victoria monument has been defaaced in the past and the Goths cause a lot of noise and look unruly.

I agree many of these young people are probably very intelligent, but somewhere should be provided for them rather than Derby Square.

Didn't they have Quiggins? Or that area anyway?

the other thing is that the scateboarders go there too and try and jump off the steps, I am sure someone's going to get seriously injured there one day.

Didn't they have Quiggins? Or that area anyway?

the other thing is that the scateboarders go there too and try and jump off the steps, I am sure someone's going to get seriously injured there one day.

As long as its only themselves there injuring. Not be like the Scallies going round on bikes and whatever knocking people over.

Didn't they have Quiggins? Or that area anyway?

the other thing is that the scateboarders go there too and try and jump off the steps, I am sure someone's going to get seriously injured there one day.

Quiggins, near the Bluecoat, is blocked off now.
It's going to get demolished.

I wish goths really had magic powers so they could teach me them.

the other thing is that the scateboarders go there too and try and jump off the steps, I am sure someone's going to get seriously injured there one day.
My goodness! Really?
LOL!

For those of you who missed message 25, the Quiggins shops are now in Central Hall, Renshaw Street and it's here you can find them in their droves too, particularly hanging around in the doorway. To me, they offer no threat but I agree that perhaps a space could be made for them and skateboarders perhaps.

Quiggins were originally ironmongers and built a shop at 75 Renshaw Street in Edwardian times.
By the 1980s it was an antique shop.
They moved to School Lane to much bigger premises in the County Palatine Building.
It was a great favourite with Goths, among others.
It is due to be demolished as part of the Paradise Project, so Quigggins have taken up residence at Central Hall in Renshaw Street.
They hope to move to John Lewis (formerly G H Lee) when JL move to their new building in Canning Place.

So they'll be in Williamson Square next year. :shock: :)

Has'nt Quiggins moved to the building that used to be the Barcelona nightclub?

I don't see a problem them congregating round that particular area. So what. As long as they move out your way when you going past and not up to anything bad. They prob feel safer in large numbers.

I worked in Quiggins in Renshaw street when it sold hardware Phil, 1979 ish, brass door handles, nuts, bolts, screws, nails etc just like Campbell and Mabbs and Thomas and Nelson, I think that was 74a or 75 Renshaw st.

The original point I was making was not whether Goths are better than Scallies or vice versa. It was about huge amounts of young people hanging round the Victoria monument on a Saturday afternoon. If it were Scallies doing this I would have the same opinion. The fact is that the Victoria monument has been defaaced in the past and the Goths cause a lot of noise and look unruly.

I agree many of these young people are probably very intelligent, but somewhere should be provided for them rather than Derby Square.

Derby Square is such a soulless place at weekends. It needs more Goths nor less! :Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

I worked in Quiggins in Renshaw street when it sold hardware Phil, 1979 ish, brass door handles, nuts, bolts, screws, nails etc just like Campbell and Mabbs and Thomas and Nelson, I think that was 74a or 75 Renshaw st.

Thanks for that, Jed.
I wondered if it had been an antique shop in the 1970s, but put 1980s to be on the safe side.

When I left there (it was a real old time stood still place with the boss up the rickety narrow stairs behinds his big oak desk) it was some years before I noticed Quiggins in School Lane, the Renshaw Street shop had become a weird looking place selling African type stuff and I wondered if the name was related in any way and if so how they had diversed from hardware to the stuff Quiggins was selling now? Do you know?

When I left there (it was a real old time stood still place with the boss up the rickety narrow stairs behinds his big oak desk) it was some years before I noticed Quiggins in School Lane, the Renshaw Street shop had become a weird looking place selling African type stuff and I wondered if the name was related in any way and if so how they had diversed from hardware to the stuff Quiggins was selling now? Do you know?

75 Renshaw Street became an antique shop.
They kept the name Quiggins.
More different sections opened up, and they moved to School Lane.
I don't think 75 has been used since.

Someone at the Pier Head doesn't like Goths, if the graffiti on this memorial is anything to go by. This memorial was only cleaned about a year ago aswell.

Quiggins were originally ironmongers and built a shop at 75 Renshaw Street in Edwardian times.
By the 1980s it was an antique shop.
They moved to School Lane to much bigger premises in the County Palatine Building.
It was a great favourite with Goths, among others.
It is due to be demolished as part of the Paradise Project, so Quigggins have taken up residence at Central Hall in Renshaw Street.
They hope to move to John Lewis (formerly G H Lee) when JL move to their new building in Canning Place.

So they'll be in Williamson Square next year. :shock: :)

You can still see the Quiggins name in the mosaic in the floor of the shop entrance. ;) The CP building isn't to be fully demolished though,surely? I heard it was only the back end of it,the warehouse bit,that was going. The front facade is staying and being done up,supposedly.

Dave.

I quite like Goths, as has been pointed out, they do no harm to people as a rule, and they are colourful. I find them no threat whatsoever. This is from someone who does fear some of the kids of today, must stem from when I was mugged in Victoria Street back in the 70s and left for dead in the street.:shock:

It's not just goths. There are simply too many teenagers hanging around on our streets drinking, shouting, spraying graffiti and generally being direspectful. I believe that younger kids can be helped out of this behaviour, but the older ones are too far gone.
An example is the fact that they will winge that they have nothing to do, so a community centre will be built which they then go and destroy. They are just looking for an excuse to be violent. I got bored when I was younger, but I didn't use this as an excuse to go around vandalising everything. I found something to do and got a job.
Adults saying that kids have nothing to do are basically giving yobs the green light to do what they want. There is plenty to do all around the city, there is no excuse for being anti-social. I blame the parents more than anyone else.

Regarding the issue of dispersing gangs. The police only have the power to disperse gangs and take them home if the area has a section 30 order on it. This is rediculous and is why I think there should be a city wide permanant section 30 order which would give the police the power to disperse gangs and send them home anywhere in the city.:PDT_Xtremez_12:

the goths are the good guys, they will never cause any real bother to anyone,they might hang around in groups and make a bit of noise but they will never attack people. Theyre just kids having clean(ish) fun.

Hippys , goths, heavy metal kids, even the punks these days are the good guys.
Its the scallies/chavs to watch out for, the ones in the hoodies and tracksuits, they are the ones who carry knives etc.

yes, that's right.
Goths are no danger, but scallies are .

The original point I was making was not whether Goths are better than Scallies or vice versa. It was about huge amounts of young people hanging round the Victoria monument on a Saturday afternoon. If it were Scallies doing this I would have the same opinion. The fact is that the Victoria monument has been defaaced in the past and the Goths cause a lot of noise and look unruly.

I agree many of these young people are probably very intelligent, but somewhere should be provided for them rather than Derby Square.


Would you still have the same opinion on these people if they were wearing suits ?
I'm pretty sure you wouldnt. i think youre problem is with the way they look, you havent even told us that they have done anything wrong apart from making a bit of noise.
Just because the monumnet was defaced in the past, thats no reason to move these kids on, if they are not cuasing any trouble, leave them alone.

Leave the police to deal with real troublemakers

Totally agree. Many of them are geeky and at least make efforts to move out of the way as you make your way past/through them - unlike a gang of disrespecting knuckle dragging scallies would.

Apologies if you've had this, it's from way back. I remember this story each time I pass them.

City Goths go safely thanks to Tate Gallery art project

Jul 12 2006

By Jessica Shaughnessy Daily Post Staff

AN UNLIKELY crime-busting operation has reduced robberies in Liverpool's city centre by a third.

Vulnerable teenagers were taken off the streets and away from the clutches of robbers to take part in an art project.

Now robberies in the city centre have dropped by 34%, thanks to the initiative run by Merseyside Police and Tate Liverpool.

Robbers and muggers were preying on a group of "Goth" teenagers who congregated in Derby Square and at the Pier Head at weekends and during school holidays.

More (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0100regionalnews/tm_method=full%26objectid=17369005%26siteid=50061-name_page.html)

Give the Goths a break, we are so conditioned in this climate of fear created be our repressive goverment, that we fear any one who is "different".
Goths just walk about the city from the Pier to the Courts to the Gardens and back again. Who has actually seen a Goth causing trouble, it's all hearsay. Goths are Great, Emo's aint bad either. Goths are an easy target for the Police to go after with their Section 30.

This man talks sense!

Yes, other than the occasional smashed bottle at the Law Courts I've never seen any trouble. They're introvert and more interested in their music and art than trying to be intimidating to people they don't know.

Give the Goths a break, we are so conditioned in this climate of fear created be our repressive goverment, that we fear any one who is "different".
Goths just walk about the city from the Pier to the Courts to the Gardens and back again. Who has actually seen a Goth causing trouble, it's all hearsay. Goths are Great, Emo's aint bad either. Goths are an easy target for the Police to go after with their Section 30.

I don't get why kids discriminate for wearing clothes but won't discriminate over skin colour.

Why? Should they?

Why? Should they?

Didn't say they should.

But most kids/teens find It ok to discriminate over clothes or lifestyles but won't discriminate over skin colour or religion. Their too daft to see the double standards.

Clothes are choice, skin colour is not.

It's all borne of fear, either way.

Didn't say they should.

But most kids/teens find It ok to discriminate over clothes or lifestyles but won't discriminate over skin colour or religion. Their too daft to see the double standards.

I find most scally kids are very discriminative of peoples skin colour and religion. Only have to see the graffitti at our local Tandoori house round my way to see that. Plus on a few walls on businesses owned by darker skinned proprieters.

I find most scally kids are very discriminative of peoples skin colour and religion. Only have to see the graffitti at our local Tandoori house round my way to see that. Plus on a few walls on businesses owned by darker skinned proprieters.

Definately !


they have this pack mentality and attack anything or anyone a bit different from their pathetic selves.

Didn't say they should.

But most kids/teens find It ok to discriminate over clothes or lifestyles but won't discriminate over skin colour or religion. Their too daft to see the double standards.

Not double standards at all. You can discriminate for peoples lifestyles, hair style, basically anything. Theres no rules to discrimination.

I don't discriminate at all.....I treat everyone the same, like crap

I don't discriminate at all.....I treat everyone the same, like crap

I hate everyone equally :PDT_Aliboronz_24:

I don't discriminate at all.....I treat everyone the same, like crap

Errrrrrrrr I wuz only kiddin':hug: shapers.

Errrrrrrrr I wuz only kiddin':hug: shapers.

Aww i know dear, love you really.....well not love :shock:

Hi Shytalk,

You must be reading the wrong books, the popularity of Jazz had waned before The Beatles played The Cavern.

Hi Shytalk,

You must be reading the wrong books, the popularity of Jazz had waned before The Beatles played The Cavern.

I wasn't reading books, I was there.:PDT_Aliboronz_24: