John Middleton, The Childe of Hale (1578-1623)

[Kev]

John Middleton, the Childe of Hale (1578-1623)

In 1578, the village of Hale, near the New Liverpool John Lennon Airport, John Middleton was born...

He was the tallest man in the world at the time...9ft 3inches!

[Paul D]

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2971/childescott3dy.jpg


Here is the lovely little cottage where he lived in Hale.


http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/8674/hale36wl.jpg

[Kev]

A lovely part f the local area - cheers Paul. I often take a walk down to the lighthouse ;)

[Paul D]

A lovely part f the local area - cheers Paul. I often take a walk down to the lighthouse ;)

Next time you go Kev take your camera and share your pics with us.:)

[Kev]

Oh I will do :unibrow:

[Max]

Went to Halewood earlier.

Shame I wasn't near Speke to go to Hale Village, but I was originally just going to Sainsbury's in Woolton and back. Then while riding out I was curious were the road with the Coach and horses pubs is on leads to so I rode down there and ended up in Halewood Village!

Want to go to Hale next time.

A two page article on the Childe of Hale written by someone who grew up around the outskirts around there on here.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

http://www.forteantimes.com/articles/187_childe1.shtml

If he really was 9ft 3 inches then he's still the current tallest. other than that, bible tales had Goliath at 9ft 9.

Wonder if the Wrestling story is true. Would rock to wrestle someone that tall and big.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Max]

Isn't it counted as Cheshire too, yet it's closer to Liverpool than places like Widnes and Runcorn.

[SteH]

It is Cheshire - part of Halton Borough Council, despite having an L24 postcode unlike Widnes/Runcorn which are WA.

[john]

Totally right SteH

[Max]

It is Cheshire - part of Halton Borough Council, despite having an L24 postcode unlike Widnes/Runcorn which are WA.

It's not more than 2 miles away from Speke and closet to Merseyside more than Cheshire and Halton, yet it's theirs! :mad:

[Norm NZ]

Greeting all! Is it possible that you are mistaken about the correct location of Hale village? I know the area very well from 'long-ago'!! and I'm sure it was always part of the old 'Lancashire' county, before 'Merseyside; came into being! Also there is another 'Hale' which is in Cheshire!! somewhere near to Northwich I think. Max! dont tell me you did'nt stop for a drink in the 'Childe of Hale' pub when you were there!! Regards to all.

[shytalk]

I googled it.

PUBLICANS
Alan Gibbs & Donna Goodyear.

ADDRESS
6 Church End, Hale Village, Liverpool, Merseyside L24 4AX Tel. 0151 4252954 Fax. 0151 4255538

[Waterways]

Greeting all! Is it possible that you are mistaken about the correct location of Hale village? I know the area very well from 'long-ago'!! and I'm sure it was always part of the old 'Lancashire' county, before 'Merseyside; came into being!

Totally correct. I used to go bike riding around there. It is virtually a part of Liverpool, like Bootle to Liverpool. The council has suceeded in getting a debate on a bigger city. Ideally Liverpool should incorporate Hale, all Knowsley and much of Sefton council areas, Ormskirk and all the North of the Wirral. They are all a part of the Liverpool socio/economic group. And also dropping very Lancashire St.Helens and Southport. There is suggestion of making all this titled Liverpool Bay.

Now making all that a city state like Hamburg would be brilliant. What Liverpool should have been post 1945, as Hamburg was.

[Max]

Ain't been there yet Norm, might be going on the weekend on my bike.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Norm NZ]

"Enjoy the trip, and thr 'drink' Max!! and let me know if the 'Wellington Hotel" on the main rd, (just around the corner from Hale Village) is still there? I enjoyed many a dance there way back in the past!:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[johnlemmon]

hello Norm NZ, your post just came up on my screen, i take it you are awake while these Northern Hemisphere types are asleep..

Lemmo...:037:

[Max]

Will post pics later.:Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

The Wellington is still there.

The planes are so low around there.

[Norm NZ]

hello Norm NZ, your post just came up on my screen, i take it you are awake while these Northern Hemisphere types are asleep..

Lemmo...:037:

Hiya Lemmo! Yep, here in the southern hemisphere, so when i'm on the PC all our Liverpool mates are probably still asleep!! mind you! kev seems to keep some strange hours,! I think his wee kids keep him awake some nights:celb (23): I missed yesterday (Sunday) had a day out!! Regards NormNZ

[Norm NZ]

Will post pics later.:Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

The Wellington is still there.

The planes are so low around there.

"Thanks Max" Keep the head down, as you cycle down Hale Road!!:celb (23): Regards, NormNZ

[Max]

Was some tough bike ride on the way back though.

It was ****ing down and I only wore a t-shirt and it was a 40 minute ride to Wavertree and traffic in speke and Garston is terrible on some parts. **** Pot holes.

Like a ghetto further into Speke, but Hale's lovely and the air is nice to breath.

For some reason, people throw pennies onto Middleton's grave and the church uses the money as upkeep.

On the other side of the Mersey is Runcorn and Widnes and there ugly!

Forgot to take a pic of the Hale Manor but got everything else thats relevant to look at.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Norm NZ]

Hi Max! You certainly took the 'long way' to Wavertree! You could have cut down Bailey's Lane to Halewood, carried on to Hunts Cross, past Woolton Village, then on Via Menlove Avenue to Allerton Rd, then up Church Rd and into Wavertree past the 'Coffee House' (Stopping on the way , for a 'quick bevy!) 'Sorry' It's the old taxi driver mentality coming out in me!!! But hope you enjoyed the ride anyway!!! Regards.:celb (23):

[Max]

I was thinking about going that way but theres a direct road to it in Speke.

[Max]

http://static.flickr.com/93/249201635_c09268252e.jpg

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There Ya go my Ninjas.

Got more soon.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Max]

http://static.flickr.com/92/249279698_a75a2e2ade.jpg

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http://static.flickr.com/80/249298239_b1a43f176c.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/96/249298241_d2396f644f_o.jpg

[lindylou]

Smashing photos Max. :)

[Kev]

Brill Max, well played fella, sorry, I meant my Ninja friend

http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/user_profile/images/88894.jpg

[Max]

http://static.flickr.com/81/249303722_c436e01f2d_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/79/249303724_49dd0f8456_o.jpg

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http://static.flickr.com/75/249306655_df3cee915b_o.jpg

Thats all of em folks.

[Max]

Might goo back in two weeks to a month maybe to take ones I missed or forgot.

[Brenda]

Well done Max, those pics are great!
:PDT_Piratz_26:

[shytalk]

Nice pics max, keep them coming.:celb (6):

[Norm NZ]

"Many Thanks Max" Great Pics! I get the feeling that you've taken them just for me!!! Lot of the people there were customers of mine when I worked for Irwins the grocers (Garston Village) and I well remember them all!

[James.]

Some great photo's there

I spent 15 years of my life living down

the road from there and never got further than Hale Park :neutral:

I never really knew the truth of the childe of Hale until now so thank you for

sharing that bit of knowledge

The rumour that spread around the schools was he was remembered for a certain part of his body being well-oversized

:gossip:


Like a ghetto further into Speke, but Hale's lovely and the air is nice to breath.
It took 10 years of work for

the idiots round there to get it to that condition.
Im glad I moved when I did :)

[johnlemmon]

brilliant

pictures

you guys make us ex-pats dead jealous...

lemmo...:037:

[ChrisGeorge]

Hi all

Great photographs, Max. And just to clarify, Hale used to be part of Lancashire until the administrative changes of the 1970's lumped it in with Halton. More logically, it should be part of Liverpool as you say along with Sefton (by the way where does that leave Bootle?). Also in the 1970's there was a fire in the parish church that meant that weddings had to be performed in the village hall instead, which appears among the photographs you kindly posted. I wrote a poem on seeing a happy couple emerging from the hall after their wedding, including getting in a mention of the Giant.

Chris

[Sloyne]

Excellent pics Max. One of the places I always try to visit whenever I come "home".

Last time I was there I was speaking to a gentleman who told me a legend about John Middleton. He said he, John Moddleton, was the legendary "Little John" of Robin Hood fame. He explained that John Middleton was on his way to join the Crusade of Richard I (The Lionheart) when he met up with Robin Hood in Sherwood Forest. I guess there's no way of knowing the veracity of the tale. I also met a gentleman of Polish origin who said he owned, and lived in, Hale Point lighthouse.

[theninesisters]

Pictures of what you can get up to on a Thursday night at St Mary's - Hale!

Also included some very rare pictures of when the bells went back in the tower - plus a few of the church when it was gutted!

[ChrisGeorge]

Why Hale is top day out
Mar 22 2007
by Catherine Jones, Liverpool Echo

HALE Village has been revealed as part of an alternative tourist map of the north west.

The village was put forward after the BBC’s Inside Out programme appealed for people to say where they go for the “perfect day” out in the region.

Hale claims to have once been home to a real life giant and is highlighted as one of the best hotspots.

It was nominated by Tracey Morgan, from Speke, who is fascinated by the story of John Millington, born sometime in the 1570s, whose gravestone in Hale Village says that he was 9ft 3ins.

In tomorrow night’s programme Tracey visits the village to see the grave of “The Childe of Hale”.

Story continues (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/liverpoolecho/news/echonews/tm_headline=why-hale-is-top-day-out%26method=full%26objectid=18789412%26siteid=500 61-name_page.html)

FACT CHECKER NEEDED! That should of course be John Middleton not John Millington!!! :PDT_Xtremez_42:

[naked lilac]

Thanks for those memories on HALE.. Loverly village.. Loverly thatched roof homes.. JUST great photos.. keep them coming Max... ta

[Steven]

Brill Pickies mate. Thanks for sharing. I took a few last year in the same location but they are not of the same quality as yours. Would you mind if I copied some of these and sent them to relatives and mates overseas.?

Cheers:PDT11

[naked lilac]

Brill Pickies mate. Thanks for sharing. I took a few last year in the same location but they are not of the same quality as yours. Would you mind if I copied some of these and sent them to relatives and mates overseas.?

Cheers:PDT11

oh please share.. would love to see them... Steven

[Steven]

oh please share.. would love to see them... Steven


I thought you had already seen them Paulette ?

[naked lilac]

I thought you had already seen them Paulette ?

no.. never saw them... :PDT_Aliboronz_11:

[Ged]

Great pics Maxie - your best yet.

[Max]

Not really, there my old camera phone pics I did before I had any camera.

I'm going to go back sometime and redo them.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Ged]

No, look lad, I told you they are didn't I - those muscles don't scare me.

:)

[Max]

I scare people with my expression and eyes more than my pecks.

[Ged]

After seeing your pic - I agree. :unibrow: :)

[Max]

Once I take over all of South Liverpool and name It all Wavertree, I will take Hale Village too back for Merseyside and make plans to resurrect the Childe but make Improvement.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

His eyes will have Illusionary Powers to turn people Insane. It will make people think they are In another world for 72 hours, really It will only last a second but their minds will think there being stabbed In gut with swords for 72 hours.

This technique will be called God Of The Moon.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[theninesisters]

Once I take over all of South Liverpool and name It all Wavertree, I will take Hale Village too back for Merseyside and make plans to resurrect the Childe but make Improvement.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

His eyes will have Illusionary Powers to turn people Insane. It will make people think they are In another world for 72 hours, really It will only last a second but their minds will think there being stabbed In gut with swords for 72 hours.

This technique will be called God Of The Moon.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

Pah, after burning all the churches in the area, the parish of Childwall will spread all the way to Hale as it once did. I will let you keep Hale :PDT_Piratz_26:

[Max]

I will take Childwall over by the time you have any Ideas.

My army called The Wave's of Wavertree will make sure of that.

Once Childwall Is called Wavertree the Abbey will be renamed Wavertree Abbey Obviously and will become one of my many homes.

I will keep the pub though, need that Satelite Tv and Ale makes money and money Is king.

[Max]

Went to Hale again after not finding anything In Halewood to snap!

Too many country lanes though In between.:034:

[Ged]

Hale Max Hail Max

[Max]

Hi Max! You certainly took the 'long way' to Wavertree! You could have cut down Bailey's Lane to Halewood, carried on to Hunts Cross, past Woolton Village, then on Via Menlove Avenue to Allerton Rd, then up Church Rd and into Wavertree past the 'Coffee House' (Stopping on the way , for a 'quick bevy!) 'Sorry' It's the old taxi driver mentality coming out in me!!! But hope you enjoyed the ride anyway!!! Regards.:celb (23):

I tried that way recently accept I went from Woolton to Halewood and that was longer.:eek:

Bailey's lane I found doesn;t go Into Hale either.

When I was on Higher Road I should of went through Carr Lane Or Ramsbrook but ended up through Halebank and Widnes I think too.

No wonder I got burned, only fields, farms and nothing else.:eek:

[ChrisGeorge]

I tried that way recently accept I went from Woolton to Halewood and that was longer.:eek:

Bailey's lane I found doesn;t go Into Hale either.

When I was on Higher Road I should of went through Carr Lane Or Ramsbrook but ended up through Halebank and Widnes I think too.

No wonder I got burned, only fields, farms and nothing else.:eek:

Hi Max

You are talking I think about the area around Ditton which is a pretty dull landscape, one of the dullest in England I should say!

Chris

[eddie french]

Chris,
I went to your Myspace and then clicked thru to Scouseproud. A lot of work there.
On your YouTube vids you have one of Albert Dock and You are standing by a small hexagonal shaped building. It used to be part of the customs set up.
Anyway, I just wanted to say that in an earlier life I re-roofed that little building. It was during the big renovation of the south docks and I was working for Walsh Roofing (From Huyton) back then. I was sent to do it on me todd with a small ladder and just the tools I could carry.
How things have changed.
Ed

[Max]

Hi Max

You are talking I think about the area around Ditton which is a pretty dull landscape, one of the dullest in England I should say!

Chris

I think that was more Halebank Village.

[William128]

Hello people here on the Hale topic.
I have been following your words about Hale on this topic for a bit, but, never got back to making an account here. I did email Chrisgeorge the other day via the contacts listed in his website-displayed here in the threads.
I hope you don't mind me sharing a website address with you, which you may be interested in? www.halevillageonline.co.uk
I made the website around 18 months ago while my mother was ill, I needed a release or something to take my mind of her illness-the website was the result..
The site is now into the end of it's second year online and has around 43 thousand hits. Although I am adding new items and material to it,, it is never finished and is always on the move and not static..
I think from the feed back and comments from people in the village, they are fairly pleased to have something online for the village. I know get stopped in the village on a weekly basis asking what has been added or how is the site and your mother.

I have enjoyed reading your comments about Hale Village and your views of the place over the last several months..

There are loads of photographs-colour and black and white, along with various pages of history of locations which are being updated or added to..

If you have any comments good or bad about the website, fire away.

William:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[ChrisGeorge]

Hi William

Welcome to the forum. I did set up a thread based on your email to me. You will find it at Hale Village (http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6163). Others are welcome to comment on your site either in this thread on the Childe of Hale or else on the other thread that I started. The best of luck to you with the site, William. :handclap:

Chris

[William128]

Hi William

Welcome to the forum. I did set up a thread based on your email to me. You will find it at Hale Village (http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6163). Others are welcome to comment on your site either in this thread on the Childe of Hale or else on the other thread that I started. The best of luck to you with the site, William. :handclap:

Chris
Hi ChrisGeorge.

Sorry about that,, I never spotted it,, It's a bit like a rabbit in the headlights thing for me here LOL..
Trying to find my way around the forum etc..

Many thanks

[Steven]

Hi Yer Feller,

Wow ! its nearly a year ago since myself and another member from here walked around the *Child of Hale's* Grave.
It was a lovely sunny day and we both marvelled at the wooden statue but also tut - tutted at the graffitti.

[lindylou]

Hello William, I have saved your web-site in my favourites. I will take a look as soon as I get a moment :)

Welcome to the forum.

[William128]

Hello William, I have saved your web-site in my favourites. I will take a look as soon as I get a moment :)

Welcome to the forum.
Many thanks lindylou..
I have on there a short video of the church yard at St Marys Church, showing the Childes grave along with the Ireland Blackburnes grave, taken this year around June-July I think.
There is still so much more I intend to put up on the site,, it's just finding the time and getting the right weather..
I understand from one of the guys who does voluntary work around the churchyard,, that the coins being thrown/placed onto the Childes grave are a kind of bring good luck or the type of thing why you throw coins into a wishing well, also may be as a lasting heartfelt remembrance of the Childe of Hale too.
The coins that are on the grave do get removed now and again by a member of the church-with no disrespect and all that to the Childe,, the money goes into the church coffers for maintaining the church yard.
I have some recent pictures of grave renovation going on by some of the volunteers. The graves are several hundred years of age as you may be aware of. The volunteers are removing weeds and overgrown grass from around the edges of the old graves which I must say,, do look better for it..
I'll get these pictures onto my pc and upload them here in the next 24 hours..

[Max]

Hale should become part of Liverpool, It's closer to Speke than places like Runcorn and Widnes.

The Cannon on High Street though should be made operational.:PDT11

[William128]

Here are a few pics of the voluntary work going on at the back of the church yard..
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y258/Denim402/0109.07120.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y258/Denim402/0109.07032.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y258/Denim402/0109.07001.jpg
They were taken at the start of September.

This video I made was done around June/July.. It starts off with the Childe Of Hales grave.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=RP-9gAUwe-4

[ChrisGeorge]

Article on the "The Childe of Hale" (http://www.forteantimes.com/features/articles/146/the_childe_of_hale.html) by John Reppion with photographs John Reppion and Elizabeth Boardman from The Fortean Times, September 2004. Enjoy!

Chris

[researchwriter]

Article on the "The Childe of Hale" (http://www.forteantimes.com/features/articles/146/the_childe_of_hale.html) by John Reppion with photographs John Reppion and Elizabeth Boardman from The Fortean Times, September 2004. Enjoy!

Chris*swells with pride at article being mentioned*:D

[ChrisGeorge]

Article on the "The Childe of Hale" (http://www.forteantimes.com/features/articles/146/the_childe_of_hale.html) by John Reppion with photographs John Reppion and Elizabeth Boardman from The Fortean Times, September 2004. Enjoy!

Chris


*swells with pride at article being mentioned*:D

Is that you, then, are you John Reppion? If so, good work. :handclap:

Chris

[Cadfael]

When I'm next up the tower at St Mary's, I'll get some pictures from the top of the tower.

[Steven]

I was thinking of taking some visitors there. Does anybody know if the 'Childe of Hale' pub still lays on meals? I had many a good scoff there in the past. lol No wonder the Childe of Hale was 9 foot 3 inches.

[ChrisGeorge]

When I'm next up the tower at St Mary's, I'll get some pictures from the top of the tower.

That would be super. Thanks, Cadfael. :PDT11

Chris

[researchwriter]

Is that you, then, are you John Reppion? If so, good work. :handclap:

ChrisIt is indeed. Cheers Chris. :PDT_Aliboronz_24:

Very interesting thread.

[ChrisGeorge]

Good work, John. :PDT11

[William128]

I was thinking of taking some visitors there. Does anybody know if the 'Childe of Hale' pub still lays on meals? I had many a good scoff there in the past. lol No wonder the Childe of Hale was 9 foot 3 inches.
Hi Steven.
Yes,, they do meals and good ale too...:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[ChrisGeorge]

I was thinking of taking some visitors there. Does anybody know if the 'Childe of Hale' pub still lays on meals? I had many a good scoff there in the past. lol No wonder the Childe of Hale was 9 foot 3 inches.



Hi Steven.
Yes,, they do meals and good ale too...:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

Sounds lovely. I'll have to check it out next time I'm over.... :PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[researchwriter]

Hi Steven.
Yes,, they do meals and good ale too...:PDT_Aliboronz_24:yeah, not been in there for a good while myself but it's always been a nice pub.

[Mark R]

Childe of Hale Cottage:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3015/2447972087_e56d00f586.jpg

The plaque:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3194/2448797410_015672de26.jpg

Tree Sculpture:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2014/2447972249_c02de69f68.jpg

Grave:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2144/2447972407_10c6542c49.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2127/2448796434_09142f8c53.jpg

[Max]

I'm going back down to tomorrow, found where you get to the crop field and bbc says Tuesday morning weather Is sunny.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

I went last Friday and dulled up after a hazy spell.:disgust:

Can't wait to drive though, takes 40 minutes to cycle there from Smithdown to Ramsbrook lane.

[Ged]

Good on you Maxie - watch out for the bog monster though.

[Max]

Villages and shorelines at the moment are giving me the best Ideas for photos, Liverpool I'm struggling for a little for something stunning. Too much construction work and restricted space and I won't do north until I can drive except for Crosby since the roads are murder down there.

Plus Hale at the shoreline Is really relaxing and kills any negativity I have Inside, thats why I love going down there.

[Ged]

Take your bike on the train to Waterloo Max and cycle down South Road (the station's on South road, just turn left as you come up the stairs) to Marine Gardens at the very bottom. Do a right along Marine Crescent and Beach Lawn and beyond to Burbo Bank - it's very relaxing down there. Grassendale-esque but with the beach view - you'll enjoy it - don't delay.

[SteH]

Childe of Hale pub :PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Max]

Take your bike on the train to Waterloo Max and cycle down South Road (the station's on South road, just turn left as you come up the stairs) to Marine Gardens at the very bottom. Do a right along Marine Crescent and Beach Lawn and beyond to Burbo Bank - it's very relaxing down there. Grassendale-esque but with the beach view - you'll enjoy it - don't delay.


Gonna wait till I can drive for the north, I can get the Northern line trains from St Michael's In Aigburth but It takes too long.

I like Grassendale, 10 minutes from my house through Sefton Park and Aigburth Vale.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

Still trying to compose a decent shot of It though.

[dazza]

Vine Cottage, in Hale Village does not exist anymore.

It was sited adjacent to the Childe of Hale's cottage, opposite Parsonage Green [the hub of the village]. Despite no evidence of the cottage existing today, it does however survive on record, and happily adds more flavour to the mystery of Hale, home of giants!

Writing in 1851, edward Pye, recounts a local legend, of an ancient vine tree said to be over 300 years old! That would place it, and possibly the cottage, in the 1550's. Whether you believe him or not is for you to decide? Just think for a moment. The giant of Hale's shadow would have been cast across it's walls, as he walked through the jigger. He may have even drunk the wine made from the vintage crop? Maybe, that was the secret of his great height?

"Near the house is an antique vine, said to be above three hundred years old. The stem is above a foot in diameter, and, although rugged and perforated through in several places, still spreads its branches luxuriantly over the adjoinign cottages, and produces a yearly vintage of grapes."

Extract from The Village of Hale - A Rural Sketch, by Edward M. Pye. 1851


I like the idea of a vine tree being more famous [and possibly older] than the cottage? It has something of Jack and the Beanstalk about it?
http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab174/dal8077/HaleVineCottage.jpg

[ChrisGeorge]

Very interesting, thanks, dazza. My grandfather had a black grape vine in his greenhouse in Mossley Hill. It's a bit hard to conceive of a grape vine lasting through the frosts of a British winter but perhaps the building kept it from feeling the worst of the cold. I am assuming that rather than gain his size from eating the grapes, John Middleton had that rare pituitary disorder known as acromegaly that made him grow to such a size. This disorder is what the Forties actor Rondo Hatton suffered from. He appeared as the Creeper in a Sherlock Holmes film with Basil Rathbone. See "Rondo Hatton -- The Creeper" at http://thehumanmarvels.com/?p=850

Chris

[underworld]

My mother is buried in the same graveyard as John Middleton.

[underworld]

Hale should become part of Liverpool, It's closer to Speke than places like Runcorn and Widnes.

The Cannon on High Street though should be made operational.:PDT11

And has a Liverpool postcode - L24, the same as Speke.

[dazza]

Very interesting, thanks, dazza. My grandfather had a black grape vine in his greenhouse in Mossley Hill. It's a bit hard to conceive of a grape vine lasting through the frosts of a British winter but perhaps the building kept it from feeling the worst of the cold. I am assuming that rather than gain his size from eating the grapes, John Middleton had that rare pituitary disorder known as acromegaly that made him grow to such a size. This disorder is what the Forties actor Rondo Hatton suffered from. He appeared as the Creeper in a Sherlock Holmes film with Basil Rathbone. See "Rondo Hatton -- The Creeper" at http://thehumanmarvels.com/?p=850Chris

I couldn't resist putting a slight Tom Slemen top-spin to the story! Hale is one of the few places of my childhood imagination that enjoyed a kind of mythical status. The place of giant's and tall story's, in a village that looks like it hasn't changed too much over the centuries. It still has some of that appeal and charm to it.

A 300 year old vine![I'm still getting used to the idea of drinking a wine made in Britain...Yuck!!! I guess it's local myth, though probably the vine is of some great age, we may never know the exact date? It adds a little to the mythos of Hale, in the same way as the Childe story does. The 1851 article [as reported] is real, as is the cottage and location. Though I think you're right, John Middleton was born 400 years too early, he could've been in the movies?

[carmaxsam]

its halton i think i am sure

[Cadfael]

My Uncle's Great Grandfather's grave is across from the Childe's Grave - the only one with a skull and crossbones on!
13017

[underworld]

its halton i think i am sure

It is Halton. I used to live there....and hated it!