Liverpool Garden Festival Site

[Kev]

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/icliverpool/oct2004/2/1/0009C379-05E9-116D-806280BFB6FA0000.jpg

A new public park will be created as part of the redevelopment of the former Garden Festival site at Otterspool. The city's executive board has approved a deal which will lease Priory Wood in St Michaels to Langtree McLean, the company which is preparing to bring the derelict south Liverpool landmark back into use. Councillors stressed that there had never been any intention to develop the wood on Riverside Drive and it would be retained as open space, with full public access.

More (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0100regionalnews/tm_objectid=15932833%26method=full%26siteid=50061% 26headline=woodland%2dpark%2dfor%2dfestival%2dsite-name_page.html)

So what do u think about that then?

[Max]

Which area is otterspool in? Ain't been therefor years!

They could put more in parks around here like Picton and Sefton Park too.

[Howie]

Which area is otterspool in? Ain't been therefor years!

They could put more in parks around here like Picton and Sefton Park too.


It's down the south end on the river as you approach Aigburth from the town. One day you might be able to get a tram there if they ever build Line 3. :rolleyes:

[Max]

Wasn't there supposed to be plans for a tram going from town up to Allerton road?

[Howie]

See www.merseytram.co.uk

[Kev]

It's down the south end on the river as you approach Aigburth from the town. One day you might be able to get a tram there if they ever build Line 3. :rolleyes:

He'll be about 90 by then :rolleyes:

[Scousemouse]

Quote originally posted by Kev
"LIVERPOOL'S first new public park for 25 years"

Is it really 25 yrs since they built a wall around Everton and called it a park? How time flies! :(

[Kev]

THE new consortium behind Liverpool's garden festival site has failed to submit a planning application more than a year after unveiling a new vision for its future, the Daily Post can reveal.

Last April, developers Langtree O'Rourke said they intended to lodge plans with the council within a month.

But, more than a year on, the company last night admitted they had still not delivered any planning application to Liverpool council.

One of the project's senior managers could not give the Daily Post even a loose deadline for delivery on the main part of the development - 1,370 homes and a row of eight-storey luxury apartment blocks.

David McLean managing director Richard Dean said the consortium was still committed to re-opening the much-loved Oriental gardens in time for the city's Capital of Culture celebrations in 2008.

But today we can reveal:

* No budget has been allocated to the company tasked with restoring the Chinese and Japanese gardens to the glory of their 1984 heyday;

* There is still no plan for what to do with the 90,000 sq ft Festival Hall dome, which has lain unused for the best part of two decades;

* Negotiations are still continuing with the receivers for the site's previous owners Planestation, over undisclosed issues;

* Local consultation has raised several "issues" with the design, which Langtree McLean says have yet to be resolved before they can submit any plans;

* No date has been set for final delivery of the luxury housing estate that would cover about a third of the site. continues... (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0100regionalnews/tm_objectid=17202511%26method=full%26siteid=50061% 26page=2%26headline=garden%2dfestival%2dvision%2ds talled-name_page.html)

[Paul D]

I thought that would have been a great place to put a few towers and I thought their scheme was too low rise.

[Kev]

AN EXPERT on Japanese horticulture who helped design Tatton Park's famous gardens has called for Liverpool's International Garden Festival site to be restored.

Masao Fukuhara, a professor at the Osaka University of Arts in Japan, is keen to see Japanese gardens reinstated in Merseyside.

His comments came ahead of a series of talks on the history of traditional Japanese gardens organised by the Japan Society North West.

Last night he spoke at Wirral's Ness Gardens and will tonight present a lecture at Tatton Park.

Prof Fukuhara said: "I will be visiting the International Garden Festival site as I am particularly hoping for the Japanese gardens at the site to be restored with the festival itself, because it is a great place for people in Merseyside to see different types of garden design. There is something spiritual and peaceful about Japanese gardens.

"Just as English gardens are becoming increasingly popular in Japan, so are Japanese gardens in England."

The International Garden Festival site at Otterspool was created in 1984 in the wake of the Toxteth Riots three years earlier.

The site, bordering Toxteth, had been used for 50 years as a civic rubbish dump and it was transformed into a stunning garden by Merseyside Development Corporation.

It included traditional gardens from Japan, China, India and other countries and was visited during six months by 3.5m people after being opened by the Queen.

But when the site closed the then city council decided against taking over the Garden Festival site. It was used for a while as a privately-run garden theme park known as Pleasure Island, but eventually closed and is now in ruins.

Merseyside developers Langtree has teamed up with housebuilders David McLean to develop large areas of the site for residential and leisure use, with the former gardens restored.

FOR further information on Prof Fukuhara's talks contact Alice Hynes on: 0151 795 2128.

[robbo176]

heres some photos of the japanese gardens taken in July when I got lost in the garden festival site (we went to Otterspool & somehow managed to wander into the Garden Festival Site)

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/robbo176/otterspool041.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/robbo176/otterspool042.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/robbo176/otterspool044.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/robbo176/otterspool048.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/robbo176/otterspool050.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/robbo176/otterspool049.jpg

[Kev]

Brilliant photees, thanks for sharing. I'm glad someone wondered in there!!

[lindylou]

It's a shame to see it like that. I went 3 times when it was open as the Garden Festival.

They should make it into another nice park. There's already the remaining features still there which could be restored. The pathways could be cleared and some new planting.

[Kev]

How do u get in there?

[Scousemouse]

You can watch a film of the Garden Festival as it was, HERE (http://www.bbc.co.uk/liverpool/capital_culture/2004/04/garden_festival/index.shtml) :disgust:

[Kev]

You can watch a film of the Garden Festival as it was, HERE (http://www.bbc.co.uk/liverpool/capital_culture/2004/04/garden_festival/index.shtml) :disgust:

arh, brings a tear to my eye :tear:

[robbo176]

How do u get in there?
Hi Kev I don't know :rolleyes:
we started walking from Otterspool towards the Albert Dock & only realise we were in the festival site when we saw the Japanese garden ,it was a lot harder to find our way out luckily 2 lads were sagging school in there & showed us a gap in the fence otherwise we might have still be in there

Mandy

[Scousemouse]

There used to be a hole in the fence on the seaward side, just past the pub.
I haven't a clue if it's still there though. So not much help there then! :celb (6):

[Kev]

Liverpool's International Garden Festival Site

Saturday 30th September 2006

An early morning drive took me and my eldest lad to the very small car park that is hidden just off the round-a-bout on Riverside Drive. The gate was open so we went through, the man walking his dog plus well trodden pathways were reasurance that we were ok.

Walking around the edge of the fence we saw plenty of openings into the site but carried on round until another much larger gap appeared with well trodden paths on the other side, where many had been before us.

We were immediately greeted by a huge hill, that we decided to walk up. From the top (which is very small area to stand) we could see all around, the Anglican Cathedral, the Festival Dome, southwards towards Garston. That was a unique experience.

http://static.flickr.com/111/256248712_ef006bf2b8.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256248712/)

http://static.flickr.com/117/256248736_bb5354aa5e.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256248736/)

http://static.flickr.com/121/256248776_35e3ae2e38.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256248776/)

http://static.flickr.com/99/256248804_ea3f767a6f.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256248804/)

Returning towards ground level we continued following the path around until little reminders of what was once a world class tourist attraction began to appear. The old paths, wooden bridges, overgrown lakes even a large hand impression that I seem to remember included dinosaur ones.

http://static.flickr.com/100/256250474_d8a68b4c2c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256250474/)

http://static.flickr.com/83/256248870_e16ed57af8.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256248870/)

http://static.flickr.com/98/256249043_2837893725.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249043/)

http://static.flickr.com/104/256249138_3e79704a65.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249138/)

As we carried on, a shiver went down my spine as the Japanese gardens came into view. I was excited and stunned. They have stood here for decades in this condition, a testament to the original build quality? Lets hope these are restored soon.

http://static.flickr.com/80/256249208_1dc08bc382.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249208/)

http://static.flickr.com/120/256249318_6bb715b861.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249318/)

http://static.flickr.com/86/256249501_4194fa7288.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249501/)

http://static.flickr.com/119/256249558_967c8a2155.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249558/)

http://static.flickr.com/92/256249685_ba3aea88e7.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249685/)

http://static.flickr.com/105/256249767_34ba68ed5b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249767/)

http://static.flickr.com/97/256250153_47ccf31948.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256250153/)

http://static.flickr.com/87/256250007_85fda67c68.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256250007/)

http://static.flickr.com/108/256249401_a82aeb9cbd.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256249401/)

Time was flying by as we began our exit towards the promenade towards the River Mersey. Even that was beautiful as we walked towards the railings.

http://static.flickr.com/95/256250614_2ec1391214.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256250614/)

http://static.flickr.com/81/256250710_c1d6e9628a.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/256250710/)

[Max]

Was that the dome that used to have Pleasure Island in it?

I also see you found my handprint.:Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

[Kev]

Was that the dome that used to have Pleasure Island in it?

I also see you found my handprint.:Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

Its was Max, remember the Rollerbaldes and The Quazar?

[Paul D]

That place has so much potential I wish they'd give it priority and develop it.

[Louis]

Its was Max, remember the Rollerbaldes and The Quazar?

they were great, i went there a few times

[Max]

Its was Max, remember the Rollerbaldes and The Quazar?

Only just yeah with all the tubes you could go in I think.

[lindylou]

I was really interested in those photos Kev.

It's so sad and depressing to see the state of the place tho' .. I had 3 great days out at the Garden Festival all those years ago.
I remember all the various features so well. I remember all the crowds of people and the queues to get in. There was a great atmosphere.

Who would have dreamed then that the site would end up looking like it does now.

Eerie and depressing.

It would make a fantastic park.

[scouserdave]

I was really interested in those photos Kev.

It's so sad and depressing to see the state of the place tho' .. I had 3 great days out at the Garden Festival all those years ago.
I remember all the various feartures so well. I remember all the crowds of people and the queues to get in. There was a great atmosphere.

Who would have dreamed then that the site would end up looking like it does now.

Eerie and depressing.

It would make a fantastic park.
I feel the same Lindy.

We had a cracking day there with some of our Chinese friends from London. I'm not sure whether they were more impressed with the Garden Festival or the fact that the waiters in China Town spoke Cantonese/Manchurian in a Scouse accent!

Guess who's doing the cuddling in the pic?:celb (23):
http://www.liverpoolpictorial.com/gardenfestival84a.jpg

[Kev]

The most recent news (http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showpost.php?p=18469&postcount=10) on the site has stated that developers Langtree has teamed up with housebuilders David McLean to develop large areas of the site for residential and leisure use, with the former gardens restored, 2 weeks ago.

[lindylou]

A few old photos of the Garden Festival:

http://community.webshots.com/user/maidmarion114

[scouserdave]

I feel the same Lindy.

We had a cracking day there with some of our Chinese friends from London. I'm not sure whether they were more impressed with the Garden Festival or the fact that the waiters in China Town spoke Cantonese/Manchurian in a Scouse accent!

Guess who's doing the cuddling in the pic?:celb (23):
http://www.liverpoolpictorial.com/gardenfestival84a.jpg
While searching for my Rock Against Racism pics (still ain't found them), I found these pics. I'll post a few more after tea. The baby's not ours btw. We had to wait a few more years before ours came along.

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image000.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image001.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image002.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image003.jpg

[ChrisGeorge]

Good pics everyone! I have not read enough to know whether anything is going to be one at the Garden Festival site for 2008? I sincerely hope so because it looks a bit of an eyesore now, doesn't it.

I was going to post the following in the new creative area. However, because of the close proximity of the area I am talking about to the Garden Festival site I thought it might fit here. Time, summer of 1965.

Sunset Over the River Mersey

In the misty summer distance,
the sun disappears in the hazy
Welsh hills beyond the Wirral:

one of the colour slides I took
as a teenager with my 35 mil
Zenith Russian camera, an orange-

purple sky and the reflection
on the muddy shore of Otterspool,
not exactly exotic but beautiful

despite the black, dun glutinous mud
(soil around Liverpool's black-brown),
maybe a car tire, the twisted wheel

of an old baby pram, just south
from the Beatles' Cazzie Shore.
I painted the same scene in acrylic;

long, slim painting to match the scene,
the layout of my slide, presented the pic
to some friends; never saw it again.

Christopher T. George

[lindylou]

You havn't changed Scouserdave. Just that your hair is longer in those days.

[scouserdave]

You havn't changed Scouserdave. Just that your hair is longer in those days.
Thanks Lindy. Your a star luv!:PDT_Aliboronz_11:
I'll upload some more in a few minutes. Just wish I concentrated more on taking pics of the buildings, but you don't think about things like that at the time.

[scouserdave]

Last lot folks. Hope you found them of interest. I know I did, as I only found the photos by accident!:PDT_Aliboronz_24:
BTW, at the time, my mate Tai, in the right of the first pic was Head Waiter of the Jade Garden restaurant, Wardour St. Him and his family have now had their own Chinese restaurant in Munich for the last 20 years. Top man:PDT_Piratz_26:

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image004.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image005.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image006.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image007.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image008.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image009.jpg

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image010.jpg

[scouserdave]

Have to say a big thanks to Lindylou. Her Rock Against Racism pics prompted me to go searching for mine. Still haven't found them, but it prompted me to dig up all sorts of pics including the Garden Festival ones:PDT_Aliboronz_11:

[lindylou]

This forum has been great for jogging memories. :)

The George Roberts thread (Famous Scousers) has jogged my memory about a group mentioned called The Harlems. I'd completely forgotten about them.

There must be lots of Garden Festival pics in peoples' photo albums.
As you say, we should have taken more notice of the buildings.
You just don't think at the time.

Probably people are a bit more aware of what to photograph now we have more sophisticated camera equipment. I know I am taking a lot more pics of more interesting subjects than I used to.
I've started taking my camera out with me just incase I see something good. :)

[jimmy]

Bulldozers move in on Garden Festival DomeNov 22 2006

By Larry Neild, Liverpool Daily Post

DEMOLITION will start of the landmark dome at the Liverpool International Garden Festival site today to pave the way for a £250m transformation.

Local companies Langtree and McLean will this morning deposit ambitious plans for the derelict site that will see more than 1,300 new homes built around the cleared dome area, as well as the restoration of the original gardens created for the festival in 1984.

The vandalised dome will be scrapped after hopes of relocating it were dashed on cost grounds.

One of the biggest hurdles to the redevelopment, management of the 56-acre parkland, was resolved just 24 hours ago after months of intensive behind-the-scenes discussions.

It has seen the Land Restoration Trust appointed to manage and cultivate the site’s stunning attractions, which include the original Chinese and Japanese gardens. The gardens will be fully restored and made accessible to the public.

The cleared dome site will form the centrepiece of a residential scheme that will see the building of more than 1,300 homes.

The plan is for 936 two-bed apartments, 372 one-bed apartments and 66 townhouses. Many will be homes with balconies overlooking Otterspool Promenade and the river estuary.

Langtree and McLean have been involved in protracted talks with city planners about the scheme, which will see the creation of the city’s first major parkland for 25 years.

If the planning committee approves the new plans next spring, the companies plan an almost immediate start on the development.

Improvements to local traffic islands are included to make access easier, and Priory Woods, linking Otterspool with St Michael's in the Hamlet will be improved, with the installation of CCTV to make it safer.

Last night, Langtree chairman John Downes said the aim was to have the new park and restored gardens element completed in time for Liverpool’s Capital of Culture Year in 2008.

Mr Downes said: “We are eager to get started and deliver what will be a stunning redevelopment and regeneration project for Liverpool.

“Until all the pieces were in place we did not want to submit our planning application. Having worked on the development alongside the planners we are hopeful that the process will not be prolonged. If approval is given, as we hope, next spring, we are eager to immediately start work.

“The dome, sadly, cannot form part of our plans. It is in a poor state and is incapable of being moved elsewhere.”

The project was welcomed last night by city council leader Cllr Warren Bradley.

He said: “The former International Garden Festival site is one of the most important gateway routes into the city and demands a development of the highest quality.

“Clearly this scheme will be subject to the normal planning procedure, but it is very encouraging that progress is being made with this site.”

As well as apartments, in blocks up to eight storeys high and family houses, the scheme includes a number of retail and community units.

The Langtree McLean partnership acquired the site in ay 2005 and since then have been working on a master plan for the area. Until now the complexities of the site have thwarted the scheme.

The new park will be funded through the residential development around the dome area, using a dowry for the long term management of the gardens.

A public exhibition about the development is to take place at the Atrium at the entrance of the Liverpool Daily Post & Echo Building in Old Hall Street from Monday until Friday next week. Details will be available at www.festivalgardens.co.uk (http://www.festivalgardens.co.uk)

[Kev]

Excellent news :PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[snappel]

Nooooo! I wanted to get back there for some more photos!

Oh well, it is dangerous and derelict, and that whole area needs redeveloping... sniff...

[jimmy]

:) snappel I am sure you wont let us down, by not accepting the challange, dangerous and derelict as the area may be, bring on the photographs, thanks.

[snappel]

Oh, I've been before! To be fair it's in a poor state now... It's just we were playing hide and seek with the security guard and I only got a few snaps. Nice that they're restoring the gardens though...


http://www.level-two.co.uk/reports/images/pleasureisland/Dscf5455.jpg

http://www.level-two.co.uk/reports/images/pleasureisland/Dscf5424.jpg

[Kev]

....ready for 2008 too :) . Give it a week and there will be nothing left of the dome, it'll look weird.

[Max]

So the Jap part will be restored?

[Kev]

So the Jap part will be restored?

The gardens? yes

[Paul D]

The appartments they're going to build are more cheap and nasty stuff why can't they build something for the people of Liverpool there?

[MissInformed]

I completely agree Paul!
I am sick of new apartments and 'town houses'...more money for property developers!
That place has been in disuse so long, but all the key features are there if they wanted to do something....
makes me quite sick!

rant over!

[Paul D]

It's funny how one minute we're awash with empty appartments and then this comes up and they're bulldozing the site even before they've had planning permission,it seems they use that arguement when it suits them i.e to reject a tower on the Waterfront.I'd love too see a huge baths built, complete with wave pools,slides maybe an indoor beach surrounded by palm trees is that too much to ask? they can build things like this in other countries and they don't have rain 24/7 like us,this is the reason why we have out of control teens in this country it's because there's nothing to do.

Rant Over.:)

[GingerTheCat]

The only thing that annoyed me was the news there would be CCTV cameras in Priory Wood.

Stop spying on me! Please!

Hope you don't mind me plugging my website Kev and all.

www.riversidegardens.org.uk

It's suffering a bit from a slow start really. Probably doesn't help with me spending most of my time on Yo! (curse that arcade!)

Mike

[theninesisters]

The city council at their best - i.e After a brown envelope stuffed full of money.

A few years ago, the Council would not talk to the land owners of Pleasure Island and were told by an independant bod to 'bloody well stop arsing around and play ball' - I'm trying to find the link as I had it on my cobblers site at one time.

So we have a lovely enviroment in which it is one of the ways in to Liverpool for 2008 and what are people going to see? A bloody building site.

The amount of land it holds and what do we 'need'? More bloody houses when you only have to go down Edge Lane to see deraliction everywhere.

:013: My god the council annoy me!

[theninesisters]

Ha, found it!

When Liverpool won the battle to be Europe's Capital of Culture in 2008, to bold promises of two million extra visitors and a flood of inward investment, its residents could have been excused for thinking they had been here before.
On the southern outskirts of the city, stretched along the Mersey, is a decaying monument to another grand cultural project that was meant to bring economic regeneration in its wake: Liverpool's spectacular International Garden Festival.

These days seagulls and vandals are the only visitors to the dilapidated 100-acre site, but in the six months the festival ran, in 1984, 3.6 million visitors came to see the grand Japanese and Chinese gardens, the Blue Peter ship, the Yellow Submarine, and the water features.

Launched by Michael Heseltine, whose close involvement with projects to kick-start the area's economy while secretary of state for the environment had earned him the nickname "minister for Merseyside", the festival was meant to usher in an era of hope, after the Toxteth riots of 1981 had opened the Thatcher govern ment's eyes to the potential costs of economic deprivation.

Fast-forward almost 20 years, though, and a stand-off between Liverpool city council and Wiggins, the developers who hold the lease for the land, means that most of it is still standing empty and overgrown. "They have let the site deteriorate appallingly," said Mike Storey, Liberal Democrat leader of the council, which took over the freehold of the land from the defunct Merseyside Development Corporation.

After a dispute about the suitability of Wiggins' various plans for the site, which Mr Storey dismissed last week as "pie in the sky", the council has slapped a "dilapidation order" on the firm, insisting it tidy up the former landfill site, and restore the Chinese and Japanese gardens to their former glory, or risk being taken to court.

The council is also planning to strip the site of its "fixtures and fittings", including the crumbling dome which formed the heart of the festival and is now expected to be shipped off to nearby Southport to be used for its own garden festival.

If the planners of the Millennium Dome had wanted a cautionary tale to show them what happens when politicians fail to think beyond the brief shelf-life of an ambitious project, they only needed to look here, at the dome of the north. Everyone agrees that this prime site ought to be brought back into use before the Capital of Culture throws itself open to visitors from all over Europe.

"You can't have a major route into the city where you look to your left, and see turnstiles from the 70s and a smashed-up dome," said Mr Storey. "We would like to see a mixture: one-third of the site would become housing, with some appropriate retail, and we would like the rest of the site to become a coastal park."

As the history of the garden festival site makes clear, though, the problem with regeneration is that everyone involved has a different idea of how to make a success of it. And in this case, none of the parties is even speaking to the other.

"Out of the blue, in October 2002, the council wrote to us to say, 'We're not going to talk to you any more'," said Tony Freudmann, Wiggins' senior vice-president. "I am left speechless by their attitude. The council is now wearing two hats, as landlord and planning authority."

Louise Ellman, Labour MP for Liverpool Riverside, which includes the garden festival site, would like to bang heads together. "Suddenly there was a total breakdown in communications," she said. "The council has to swallow their pride, get a grip, and get back talking."

Mr Storey and his colleagues may, though, be awaiting the outcome of Wiggins' financial travails, and hoping the council may be given the chance to get its hands on the site again. The firm suspended trading in its shares earlier in the year, and announced it was in talks over a "reverse takeover" bid by the Scottish property group LNC.

As the stand-off goes on, local activists continue their wait of almost 20 years for the land to be given back to them.

Jean Hill, from the Garden Festival Campaign, who lives around the corner from the site, said: "I don't think we need to fill every piece of riverside with housing. We've started to think about things like the Eden Project. Those things are more money-making than anyone thought 10 years ago. But all we can do is wait."

Dome of the North

1984 Liverpool International Garden Festival attracts 3.6 million visitors

1986 600 homes built on north side of festival site

1993 Merseyside Development Corporation leases land to a company which opens an amusement park called Pleasure Island

1997 Pleasure Island fails to make money. Developers Wiggins buy the business and lock up the site

1998 Merseyside Development Corporation, which is about to be wound up, hands lease to Liverpool city council. Wiggins submits second unsuccessful plan for site involving a marina, and 'vertical theme park' in tower on the waterfront

2002 Relations between Wiggins and council break down completely after third set of plans are rejected

2003 Liverpool wins bid to be European Capital of Culture in 2008

[MissInformed]

ooohhhhh this all infuriates me!!!:disgust:

[shytalk]

I moved from Liverpool to Florida in 1981, my first visit back to Liverpool was in '84. I visited the Garden Festival and it was spectacular. My sister told me it would be closing soon after. My comment at the time was that they should sent to Disney to borrow some managers, it could have been a permanent attraction. Sadly it was just wasted.

[AK1]

It's funny how one minute we're awash with empty appartments and then this comes up and they're bulldozing the site even before they've had planning permission,it seems they use that arguement when it suits them i.e to reject a tower on the Waterfront.I'd love too see a huge baths built, complete with wave pools,slides maybe an indoor beach surrounded by palm trees is that too much to ask? they can build things like this in other countries and they don't have rain 24/7 like us,this is the reason why we have out of control teens in this country it's because there's nothing to do.
Rant Over.:)

Dont agree with that at all!!! There is no excuse for kids to be running around vandalising property and beating people up. There are plenty of things for them to do and alot of them aren't even kids. Some of them are 18+ and should be out getting a job. They say that they're bored, but I get bored and I don't hang around on the streets vandalising property. Comments like yours just give them fuel for commiting more crime!!!!

[AK1]

I moved from Liverpool to Florida in 1981, my first visit back to Liverpool was in '84. I visited the Garden Festival and it was spectacular. My sister told me it would be closing soon after. My comment at the time was that they should sent to Disney to borrow some managers, it could have been a permanent attraction. Sadly it was just wasted.

I don't think asking Disney Managers now would do any good. They are only in it for the money now and this is one of the reasons why Disney is losing custom every year.

[shytalk]

I don't think asking Disney Managers now would do any good. They are only in it for the money now and this is one of the reasons why Disney is losing custom every year.
I wasn't suggesting it should be done now, it would have worked years ago. I don't know about the other Disney parks but the ones in the USA are continually busy, even though they have priced themselves out of the local market. I lived near the Florida parks for 25 years so I know first hand how busy they are.

[lindylou]

Dont agree with that at all!!! There is no excuse for kids to be running around vandalising property and beating people up. There are plenty of things for them to do and alot of them aren't even kids. Some of them are 18+ and should be out getting a job. They say that they're bored, but I get bored and I don't hang around on the streets vandalising property. Comments like yours just give them fuel for commiting more crime!!!!

yes, and some of them are old enough to father children too, which is often happening. :disgust:

[Paul D]

Dont agree with that at all!!! There is no excuse for kids to be running around vandalising property and beating people up. There are plenty of things for them to do and alot of them aren't even kids. Some of them are 18+ and should be out getting a job. They say that they're bored, but I get bored and I don't hang around on the streets vandalising property. Comments like yours just give them fuel for commiting more crime!!!!

Of course there's more to it but say you live in the middle of Norris Green there's the baths and que tumbleweed nothing.It's the biggest council estate in Western Europe and money's scarce and you can only kick a ball around for so long there's simply nothing to do.We need things to entertain our people not another few thousand appartments,this is a prime site being sold for profiit at the expense of us.It's better than nothing but not good enough it's a wasted opportunity,as Roger Daltry said recently Liverpool with it's Worldwide musical heritage and here we are playing a f'in tent,only in England,that's says it all really.

[lindylou]

I agree with you about not needing yet more apartments.

There are far too many now. :rolleyes:

[lindylou]

By the way Paul, did you read in the Echo this week about our Anfield youth club football floodlit pitches being trashed YET again - and the footie coach attacked. Also the ref was beaten up :disgust: :disgust:

A huge amount has recently been spent refurbishing the youth centre (as I already said a while back on this same subject) - and the local thugs are determined to destroy it. It was covered in vile graffit just weeks after it was completed - in fact the builders were often under attack.
A car was left burning on the site just this week.
My son used to be in the team and they had to have police there for protection while they played football ... have you ever heard anything like that !! police protection while you play football ?? :disgust:

It doesn't matter what is spent, they are determined to smash anything they can get their slimey hands on.

[Paul D]

The thing is the rot's already set in and this country will continually deteriorate due to the toothless laws of the land,if you think it's bad now wait another 10 years,thug culture has took over now.:disgust: now back to the Garden Festival site.:D

[ChrisGeorge]

Of course there's more to it but say you live in the middle of Norris Green there's the baths and que tumbleweed nothing.It's the biggest council estate in Western Europe and money's scarce and you can only kick a ball around for so long there's simply nothing to do.We need things to entertain our people not another few thousand appartments,this is a prime site being sold for profiit at the expense of us.It's better than nothing but not good enough it's a wasted opportunity,as Roger Daltry said recently Liverpool with it's Worldwide musical heritage and here we are playing a f'in tent,only in England,that's says it all really.


Hello Paul

It seems to me it's a matter of incentives, and at present being part of the pack and being a destructive lout rules for these kids. Somehow they will have to be reached to show them a better way. Whether the parents or the local authorities can do it, I don't know. But if something isn't done you won't have a city that's worth living in.

Chris

[Kev]

25th November 2006

http://static.flickr.com/120/305746108_b85ed73c75.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/305746108/)

[ChrisGeorge]

John Lennon's Eye

Violent night on Merseyside: a rocket
fired through a Croxteth bedroom window,
a phone box and a car gutted in Woolton.

Liverpool, Euro Capital of Culture, St. George's
wrapped like a birthday gift, John Lennon
is Mona Lisa with a red guitar, a vast poster
printed with 30 gallons of ink, but tonight
someone cut out John Lennon's eye.

His glasses bloody on Yoko's "Season of Glass";
the bark of Chapman's Charter Arms .38;
dark night on Menlove Avenue, Ocean Child hit
in a drive-by, a drunken off-duty copper. Oh Julia!

Bloody St. George's Hall, the bloody assizes.
Release the white doves, play elegies.
Strawberry fields glisten with bloody leaves.

Ghost guitars echo in Gambier Terrace,
in Mathew Street, crushed carnations
and musical notes trampled underfoot.
Someone cut out John Lennon's eye.

Christopher T. George

[lindylou]

more thought provoking words from ChrisG.

that's very good Chris.

[Max]

25th November 2006

http://static.flickr.com/120/305746108_b85ed73c75.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/305746108/)


Did you go on a fairy across the Mersey?

[Kev]

Did you go on a fairy across the Mersey?

A fairy? No. A Ferry? Yes, and very windy it was too.

[Max]

The gardens? yes

A Japanese garden is nothing without ninjas slicing everything.

[snappel]

Ha ha! It would get ruined!!

[Howie]

Sad farewell to festival dome
Nov 29 2006
More than 20 years after watching the dome being built at Liverpool’s Garden Festival site, City Editor Larry Neild was there again yesterday – to watch it being pulled down
by Larry Neild, Liverpool Daily Post

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/icliverpool/nov2006/4/6/0F750A91-E061-F94C-30FB029A5A40C808.jpg

A MACHINE dubbed Edward Scissorhands was yesterday recruited to snip its way through the large dome at Otterspool, once the centrepiece of Liverpool’s International Garden Festival site.

The £350,000 snipper resembles an extra from War of the Worlds and is so powerful it can cut through steel girders and concrete with the ease of a pair of nailclippers.

Over the next few days, “Edward” and a team of human helpers will reduce the dome to large chunks of steel, destined to be sold as scrap to China.

The dome was, in 1984, the exhibition hall at Britain’s first International Garden Festival, opened by the Queen in the summer of that year.

Story continues (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/liverpooldailypost/news/regionalnews/tm_headline=sad-farewell-to-festival-dome%26method=full%26objectid=18177458%26siteid=50 061-name_page.html#story_continue)...

[Kev]

The site will look odd without it for a while whilst we all get used to it. Demolishion pics would great if someone could get down there.

[marky]

I went past today...too dull for pics, except a couple of 'memory joggers'. Looked to be about 99% intact and no sign of activity. I did notice signs saying the road may be subject to delays between 11.30 and 1.30. Also seen some film crew caterers (Tele-caterers) and a policeman on the car-park facing the Britannia.

[A.D.W]

I went past today...too dull for pics, except a couple of 'memory joggers'. Looked to be about 99% intact and no sign of activity. I did notice signs saying the road may be subject to delays between 11.30 and 1.30. Also seen some film crew caterers (Tele-caterers) and a policeman on the car-park facing the Britannia.

Yes it was a mite dull. I took these anyway.

http://www.liverpoolviews.co.uk/garden/bgf3011061.jpg

[A.D.W]

http://www.liverpoolviews.co.uk/garden/bgf3011062.jpg

[GingerTheCat]

I woke to a scraping metallic sound this morning and guessed they had started the demolition. But when I got there with my camera there wasn't much action.

Plenty of people with cameras though. (That wasn't you I spoke to by the roundabout was it Cissie?)

I think the film crew thing was something completely different. They had a car on the back of trailer and were filming it driving up and down Riverside Drive.

Mike

[marky]

The rear was being smashed in this morning, but my camera couldn't focus with the sun directly behind the hall.

[PhilipG]

The rear is completely open today.
Hard to tell just how much has gone.

[Kev]

2nd December 2006: Took a trip myself this morning, managed to gain access through another hole in the fence.

http://static.flickr.com/118/311880900_ef76656973.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311880900/)

http://static.flickr.com/103/311880990_ab8ed90fea.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311880990/)

http://static.flickr.com/122/311884812_0800fb9a20.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311884812/)

http://static.flickr.com/115/311884393_5363e8c307.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311884393/)

http://static.flickr.com/108/311884600_91a63b9a66.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311884600/)

http://static.flickr.com/121/311885023_a36bdb67af.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311885023/)

http://static.flickr.com/113/311885203_0665f55226.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311885203/)

Other pics from around the festival site taken today can be found here (http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2192&page=2).

[A.D.W]

Fine pictures.

:)

[Kev]

More images from around the site today (2nd December 2006) - Images of the Dome taken today can be found here (http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=2602):

http://static.flickr.com/104/311885574_337e615cc8.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311885574/)

http://static.flickr.com/117/311885435_f590f576d4.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311885435/)

http://static.flickr.com/106/311885365_c3ce2f2113.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311885365/)

http://static.flickr.com/119/311885300_8127a0c123.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311885300/)

http://static.flickr.com/107/311884871_416826291c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311884871/)

http://static.flickr.com/119/311884428_2b883161f5.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311884428/)

http://static.flickr.com/100/311884116_5047ce0ffc.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311884116/)

http://static.flickr.com/117/311883915_ec5ff6a379.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311883915/)

http://static.flickr.com/101/311879464_8122c96c98.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311879464/)

http://static.flickr.com/108/311879266_2423a77e70.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311879266/)

http://static.flickr.com/116/311879094_90c969c629.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311879094/)

http://static.flickr.com/121/311878578_1129ff217c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/311878578/)

[A.D.W]

http://www.liverpoolpictorial.co.uk/gardenfest/image006.jpg

"Behave yourself and act your age young man!", says the old lady.

:)

[bustcapl]

glad to see something finally happening here!

[GingerTheCat]

I just stumbled across the following which is taken from http://www.sundials.co.uk/tbsig.htm and it made me wonder what happened to the sundial. Anybody know anything about it or even have photos of it. Did it find a home in Merseyside?


Where in England during 1984 did Brookbrae exhibit a large analemmatic dial?

In the garden of the George Wimpey Homes at the Liverpool International Garden Festival the central attraction was a sundial designed by Christopher St J H Daniel. It was laid out on the ground and measured 15ft across. The visitor stood at the appropriate point astride a line marked with the mouths. His shadow (if he had been lucky enough to pick a sunny day!) fell across an ellipse of hour stones to indicate the time. Now that the Festival has closed, negotiations are taking place to try to find a permanent home in Merseyside for this intriguing sundial. There is now no public analemmatic sundial in this country, but they do exist abroad.

Cheers

Mike

[Kev]

A NEW custodian was appointed yesterday to look after Liverpool’s International Garden Festival site for the next 150 years. The respected Land Restoration Trust will become stewards of the 56-acre site at Otterspool after signing a deal with developers Langtree McLean.

The traditional Chinese and Japanese gardens – currently derelict and badly vandalised – will be given a facelift and new attractions added to the site.

Langtree and David McLean, who plan to build 1,300 riverside homes on the site, will provide a dowry of £2m that will be invested to help meet running costs over the years.

Two decades of neglect have left the garden site in a pitiful state, the vegetation has been allowed to grow wild since the site closed in the 1980s.

Saplings planted in 1984 when the IGF became the showcase for Liverpool have now matured into young trees, the pathways are in good shape and the man-made hills command stunning views of the river estuary.

Langtree McLean last week submitted the planning application for their planned £250m development.

As part of the project, the 56 acres of gardens will be transformed into a new waterfront park, which, following restoration, will be maintained as a vital green resource for the people of Liverpool. Langtree managing director John Downes said: “We will do the restoration work and then hand the completed gardens to the trust.”

It is likely that experts in oriental gardens will be hired to help rebuild the Chinese and Japanese gardens and the lake that links them.

The aim is to re-open the gardens to the public in the summer of 2008 as Liverpool celebrates being European Capital of Culture.

The Land Restoration Trust was only established in 2004 as a joint enterprise by English Partnerships, the Environment Agency, the Forestry Commission and Groundwork.

David Evans, of the LRT, said: “We restore derelict, neglected or under-used brownfield land and maintain it for people and nature in the form of publicly-accessible green spaces.

“We believe our partnership with Langtree McLean will be a highly successful one, turning the Festival Gardens back into something which the region can be proud of, connecting both the existing and new community.”

IC Liverpool

[marky]

Wednesday Dec. 6th

[snappel]

Wow, it's really going!

[Kev]

Cheers for the update, of all Liverpool's spaces of development, this for me has to be the most interesting.

[The Teardrop Explodes]

..these 'homes' though. Yet more generic lo-density spread?

[XL391]

..these 'homes' though. Yet more generic lo-density spread?
Exactly. The domes framework was quoted as being in good condition. Could have been a swimming pool or something else. Instead, tear it down to make more space (thus, more money) for even more faceless bloody apartments!! :rolleyes:

[marky]

At around 12:30 they were upto the front curved part...its got to go soon.

[Kev]

Thanks for the pic, I'm gonna try and get down there again soon :). Isn't it weird seeing it like this?! I think I want it back :tear:

[A.D.W]

Thanks for the pic, I'm gonna try and get down there again soon :). Isn't it weird seeing it like this?! I think I want it back :tear:


I'll put two bob down and say it'll be all gone by tuesday.

[marky]

Garden Festival Red Concrete Sitting Bull sculpture...this is now located at the Southern end of Otterspool Promenade (you can see it from the bottom of Riversdale Rd.). It hasn't yet been re-painted.

[Kev]

Marky, thanks for the pics, I'm glad this thread is generating so much interest and enthusiasm. It's unique that we are can show the timeline of events the the park's history :celb (23):

[marky]

I'm just wondering about the locations for some of the sculptures...add any info missing from this list:

Sitting Bull...Otterspool Promenade
Yellow Submarine...Speke Airport
Blue Peter ship...Location Unknown (it used to be outside the Police H.Q. Prior to this it was briefly at Lime St. until it suffered from vandalism)
The Tango...Concert Square
Palanzana...Byrom St (Below Churchill Way flyover)
Kissing Gate...Lime Street
Wish You Were Here...This was part of the Seaside/New Brighton Exhibit in the Museum Of Liverpool Life (now closed)

[snappel]

I managed to find the ship last year, in a (council?) yard on an industrial estate in Old Swan. Bit of an effort to get near it, but it was right next to the red animal (which as we know is now on the promenade). Hopefully they'll put it somewhere soon...

http://www.forties-design.co.uk/photos/boat.jpg

[Kev]

A big thumbs up from me - cheers for all the great pics :PDT_Piratz_26:

[scouserdave]

2nd December 2006: Took a trip myself this morning, managed to gain access through another hole in the fence.
Other pics from around the festival site taken today can be found here (http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2192&page=2).
Kev, a bit late, but cracking pics. Thanks:PDT_Piratz_26:

[GingerTheCat]

In reply to Markys sculpture list you might find this interesting. Taken from the 1984 Festival Guide booklet...

Sculpture Terraces

Over the Sculpture Terraces, Richard Deacon's two rhythmic forms seem to hover mysteriously, reflecting the sky and water vistas of the Festival. A skeletal bird made of wood rises over the upper terrace, while a galvanised steel boat sails below.

Festival Sculpture

As visitors arrive at the Herculaneum entrance, they are greeted by a tall sculpture , Allen Jones's colourful Dancing Couple. It sets a properly festive mood and announces the prominence given to the sculptor's art.
Imagine a flight over the Festival site, all 125 acres of it. Below is a vast sculpture. Its scale is superhuman but its millions of tons of earth and rubbish have been shaped into new, dramatic form by the imagination and machinery of man. It demands to be crowned with sculptures on a more human scale.

And indeed it is. The Festival displays work from every generation and every part of the country - a stunning combination which demonstrates why Britain leads the world in the range and variety of its sculpture.

There are sculptures everywhere. Works by Dame Elisabeth Frink - a barking dog - and by the late Dame Barbara Hepworth are set in the United Kingdom Government Pavillion garden. Perhaps the most famous of all, Henry Moore, is represented by an epic 1975 bronze, Three Piece Reclining Figure, Draped, which stands in the Festival Hall piazza, near Dame Elizabeth's lifesize bronze Goodwood Horse.

A larger-than-life family of sunbathers, John Clinch's Wish You Were Here, lolls over the esplanade railings; a high flying show-off, Peter Logan's Wind Acrobat, twists and turns overhead; and Kevin Atherton's Three Bronze Deckchairs are placed to observe the scene - and to be sat on.

One of the most striking views across the Mersey is framed by William Tucker's six metre high Victory, made from hand textured glass fibre.

Nicholas Pope's three-part stone sculpture near the main waterfall draws together three counties. Appearing in Merseyside, it has been made in a Staffordshire stone, mottled hollington, as a response to the landscape of Herefordshire. The gracefully emblematic tree and seed forms by the Mill Pond have been carved by Stephen Cox from a nine ton block of pepperino, a green stone. They are named Palanzana, after the Italian volcano where the stone is found.

The Dry Dock play area by Wirral sculptor Graham Ashton commemorates Liverpool's maritime history in a somewhat surreal way. Phillip King's Head, nearby, playfully contradicts the angular quality of its component parts.

Mike

[XL391]

Is the dome down then? :(

[Kev]

This is an excellent thread, many thanks to all and the comments SD :)

[marky]

December 13 2006 A.M.

[Kev]

omg!

[marky]

There's still a tiny pic of 'Wish you were here" on the Liverpool Museums' site:
http://www.liverpoolmuseums.org.uk/mol/collections/graphics/small/river-room.jpg

[XL391]

A shame... :( Ripped down and there isn't even any planning permission yet... :disgust:

[Kev]

Things are moving at last though. I do feel a bit sad its gone but things now need to move forward, the site needs to become accessable to everyone to enjoy the gardens, not just security guards, teenagers and urban explorers for the next 25 years.

[snappel]

Yes, I agree. I used to go there quite a lot on my mountain bike, and then went back this time last year for good explore which was fun, but it needs sorting now. Too many burst out cars and places for kids to get hurt.

Let's just hope it's all done tastefully and that the developments don't get wrecked by the local yobs.

[Kev]

MORE than 20 years of history has come crashing to the ground with the demolition of this famous Liverpool landmark. more (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/liverpoolecho/news/echonews/tm_headline=city-history-demolished%26method=full%26objectid=18261955%26sit eid=50061-name_page.html)

[The Teardrop Explodes]

a crap waste of what was a semi-decent structure and could've, given time and imagination, become a decent resource for the city.

[Kev]

a crap waste of what was a semi-decent structure and could've, given time and imagination

25 years? As for imagination....

[XL391]

a crap waste of what was a semi-decent structure and could've, given time and imagination, become a decent resource for the city.

Totally agree with you. :)

[The Teardrop Explodes]

25 years? As for imagination....

But Kev for those 25 years there's been nothing going on with the city has there? Now as soon as a bit of cash and a bit of a boom reaches us developers want to geta slice of it and build another souless housing estate there.

"The dome was too far gone." As if.

[PhilipG]

The photos posted in this thread prove that the dome wasn't "too far gone".

Right from the start they wanted to build houses on most of the site.
Now, they've got what they wanted.

We had 6 months of the Garden Festival, followed by 22 years (so far) of dereliction!
I wonder if COC 2008 will turn out to be the same. :unibrow:

[Kev]

We had 6 months of the Garden Festival, followed by 22 years (so far) of dereliction!
I wonder if COC 2008 will turn out to be the same. :unibrow:

I hope not! the garden festival was on a small area of land compared to the beneits to the c of c on the whole city and region.

[A.D.W]

I pass this site every night on my way home from work and it was sad to see the dome no longer there. Just a few bits of flotsam and fluff are all that remain of the Festival Dome.

:neutral:

[johnmed]

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Mate came over on New Year's Day, took him round the IGF, and afterwards he went home and found these, his parents photos from 1984! Enjoy

[scouserdave]

Fantastic John!
Thanks alot:PDT_Piratz_26:

[Max]

http://www.sjsfiles.btinternet.co.uk/jlfestivalb.htm

http://www.sjsfiles.btinternet.co.uk/jlfestivala.htm

One of inside the dome.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[ChrisGeorge]

Hi Max

I left a comment for you on your fine Otterspool pics at Flickr (http://www.flickr.com/photos/maxmolyneux/366453665/?#comment72157594495473023). The word you were searching for is "capstan." :)

Chris

[Max]

Thanks.

[PhilipG]

Hi Max

I left a comment for you on your fine Otterspool pics at Flickr (http://www.flickr.com/photos/maxmolyneux/366453665/?#comment72157594495473023). The word you were searching for is "capstan." :)

Chris

I hope you weren't trying to get Max on Capstan Full Strength? :Colorz_Grey_PDT_24:



They were ciggies, Max.

[oritelad]

arr shame this has jst been left to rot i went a few days before it closed down it was good that it got converted into a theam park type place for kids i would of still been going if it was still open it was a bit hard to get to i sopose the train was your best bet soon as it closed everythink got ripped out then just left for years and years with a guard looking over the place i cant see this place reopening the land will just get used for more posh expensive apartments looking over the mersey

[Max]

I can't find the Oriental Gardens when ever I go down there.

[phredd]

Being in HM forces at the time and in some jungle area in Brunei I missed having the pleasure of the festival.
Read a lot about it in the papers at the time and 'wished'.

The last I heard about it was when it closed. I seem to remember reading in one news paper that it was closed because they had found Methane Gas in the area from old landfill.

Passed it a few times on our way to the Albert Dock and wished I had seen it in all its glory.

Phredd.

[PhilipG]

Being in HM forces at the time and in some jungle area in Brunei I missed having the pleasure of the festival.
Read a lot about it in the papers at the time and 'wished'.

The last I heard about it was when it closed. I seem to remember reading in one news paper that it was closed because they had found Methane Gas in the area from old landfill.

Passed it a few times on our way to the Albert Dock and wished I had seen it in all its glory.

Phredd.

It was open from May to October as always planned.

They were always aware of the methane gas, and there was some some sort of little building which dealt with it.
Perhaps somebody else knows exactly what was done.

[theninesisters]

It was open from May to October as always planned.

They were always aware of the methane gas, and there was some some sort of little building which dealt with it.
Perhaps somebody else knows exactly what was done.

Try:

http://www.matan-international.com/intro.html

[Max]

Last time I was near there I went through a public pathway on the promenade and It lead to where the dome used to be and that entrance gate was open so I could get out.

Their was direction signs to Pleasure Island and St Michaels on the pathway the railings were broken on the pathway and I was getting lost due to It being my third time to Otterspool.

Do you still have that hairstyle Scouserdave?:Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

[Max]

Oh yeah and where are the Oriental Garden parts please?:Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

[oritelad]

arr no the dome has gone now it got left up for many years after the park closed this must mean they are starting the houseing development planned for on that site so take you photos quick before the old park is lost forever and btw the park closed because of lack of visitors as it was not in a good area not gas lol

[Kev]

Oh yeah and where are the Oriental Garden parts please?:Colorz_Grey_PDT_16:

Have a look at this Max, the gardens are somewhere over the hill in the background.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c60/gedfleming/L1040951.jpg

[Kev]

anyone seen this before?

http://www.festivalgardens.co.uk/images/gardenfestivalLARGE.jpg

[PhilipG]

anyone seen this before?

http://www.festivalgardens.co.uk/images/gardenfestivalLARGE.jpg

No.

It says "festival gardens".
Is it a drawing, or have they been built?

[Kev]

It's a render Phil, an image of the proposed develeopment. I've noticed recently though that the trees around the festival park seem to have been stripped as you can see into the gardens from the rd now.

[PhilipG]

It's a render Phil, an image of the proposed develeopment. I've noticed recently though that the trees around the festival park seem to have been stripped as you can see into the gardens from the rd now.

Thanks, Kev.
I suppose it'll be another gated development, then.
Hope that park is going to be public.

I see the estate on the Herculaneum Dock site has 3 fountains in it.
That's about the same number as the City Centre (if you count Williamson Square as 1).

[Kev]

After noticing a recent increase in activity on the festival site, I went back for a mooch around:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/178/417340682_2c933bb7ac.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417340682/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/157/417340740_be8c462cfd.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417340740/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/179/417340831_fe3dd7d087.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417340831/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/174/417339563_fd853c2382.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417339563/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/151/417341182_e3e088e3b1.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417341182/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/166/417341065_3be30faaaa.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417341065/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/151/417340953_c287ea42fb.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417340953/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/162/417340283_1692273dac.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417340283/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/177/417340184_0e5a0a6ba7.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417340184/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/128/417339998_e9b92c95aa.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417339998/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/165/417340046_88ec554dbf.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417340046/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/148/417339937_dedfd3e438.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417339937/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/133/417339823_2b9ef1e05f.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417339823/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/183/417339756_827475f3da.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417339756/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/130/417339345_a25f07361b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417339345/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/154/417339076_afc9e93964.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417339076/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/148/417338867_a6167fcf2a.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417338867/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/157/417338702_5e1e5bee05.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417338702/)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/179/417338611_081bd50657.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417338611/)
^^Looks like someones been living in there^^

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/172/417338203_3528ea2d90.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/417338203/)

More here (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/sets/72157594581826281/)....

[scouserdave]

Morning folks. Been asked to pass this on. Hope you can attend on the 15th:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

"I am involved with this. At the meeting it was decided that a committee would be formed to look at a campaign. Meeting to discuss this Wed 4th April St Michaels Cricket Club 6.30pm. It was decided at the mass meeting (which was very well attended with over 100 people and standing room only) that a public demonstration be held on the prom near the Britannia pub at 2pm Sunday 15th April. It is suggested that we hand out leaflets, petitions, show a display of the wildlife and destruction etc with a `festival' atmosphere and possibly a march along Riverside Drive (pending permission/legality) or tour/inspection of the site.

We want as many people as possible to attend as this needs to be high profile given local elections and planning committee are approaching. This is not just an issue for the local residents but the whole of Liverpool and wider a field as green space in Liverpool is rapidly becoming an urban jungle with mass developers putting bricks on any available green space all trying to buy a piece of capital of culture and reap the rewards, destroying green space and wildlife havens in their process of making profits. The prom is a beauty spot not just for local residents but for visitors from outside Liverpool, lets keep it as natural as possible and enjoy it along with the wildlife, not destroy it by clearing the site and chopping down trees and habitat of nesting birds.

Please support this important campaign, forward this email to anyone who may be interested (as many as possible). Also if anyone has any ideas of how the garden festival can be used and funded let us know i.e. government funding/grants of certain environmental projects? environmental big businesses etc?- this is a big issue as the developers have the benefit of mega financial backing (and at a recent meeting said they were utilising some national funding re developing garden areas, so if they can do it maybe someone else with better ethics can?) . Environmentally friendly suggestions have included:


Eden type Project -will certainly attract visitors and enhance capital of culture


Environmental Project involving education where schools can come to do their field work


Large garden type centre like stapley water gardens attraction, maybe council can grow their own plants for the city green spaces roundabouts etc instead of purchasing them externally- school kids could be involved in this as part of their practical education.

We want people to do as much as they can, write letters to councillors, MP's local media etc.

Thanks for your support, sorry about the long email but this is something I feel passionate about, once its gone its gone and trees are being chopped down fast.

Karen"

[Kev]

I thought plans were already in place for the site?

[scouserdave]

It's owned by Langtree McLean and apparently they've been rather naughty recently, chopping down trees without planning permission. (http://www.langtreegroup.co.uk/default.htm?http://www.langtreegroup.co.uk/default.asp?PAGE=22)

Ref: http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/03/365765.html

[Kev]

A CYBERSPACE makeover reveals the dramatic transformation planned for the derelict site of Liverpool’s International Garden Festival.

The Otterspool site attracted more than 3m visitors in 1984, but has remained unused for years.

Developers Langtree McLean has teamed up with the Land Restoration Trust and the Mersey Waterfront agency to devise a restoration plan for the gardens.

They have produced a unique fly-through of the future site to give a sneak glimpse of what the gardens will look like in just a few years time.

The impressive display – which can be viewed on the Liverpool Daily Post website – takes viewers on a walk through of what will be Liverpool’s first major public park in 25 years.

The £250m redevelopment, a joint venture between Langtree McLean and the city council, will restore the site to its former glory, and provide hundreds of homes.

The developers have teamed up with the Land Restoration Trust and Mersey Waterfront to cultivate the stunning gardens, including the original Japanese and Chinese gardens.

The 56-acre park will be completely open with no fencing, allowing it to stretch from Riverside Drive directly onto Otterspool Promenade.

continues (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/liverpooldailypost/news/regionalnews/tm_headline=garden-festival-%2D%2D8216%2Dwalk-into-the-future%2D%2D8217%2D%2D-via-cyberspace%26method=full%26objectid=18891786%26sit eid=50061-name_page.html)....

The latest Garden Festival Pictures as it appears now can be sen here (http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2192&page=3)

[AK1]

Thanks, Kev.
I suppose it'll be another gated development, then.
Hope that park is going to be public.

I see the estate on the Herculaneum Dock site has 3 fountains in it.
That's about the same number as the City Centre (if you count Williamson Square as 1).

Actually, no! It will be fully open to the public including the residential area. It's great to finally see a company opening up the city for the public and not gating everything.

[Jericho]

I can't find the fly-through on the Daily Post website. I vaguely recall seeing something a few months ago - is that what it is (looked like an out of town campus)?

[scouserdave]

Friends of Liverpool Monuments Civic Society has just opened a campaign page (http://liverpoolmonuments.co.uk/projects/garden.htm) and yours truly is posing in the 1984 pic:unibrow:

[Kev]

Dave, isn't that one of those 'Pics that changed the World'? :PDT10

As for the 2007 gallery, they are welcome to use mine: Here (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/sets/72157594581826281/)

[scouserdave]

Dave, isn't that one of those 'Pics that changed the World'? :PDT10

As for the 2007 gallery, they are welcome to use mine: Here (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ijob/sets/72157594581826281/)

LOL!:PDT11
Kev, why don't you contact them and offer your pics? I know for sure, they'd love 'em.

[Kev]

I can't find the fly-through on the Daily Post website. I vaguely recall seeing something a few months ago - is that what it is (looked like an out of town campus)?

http://videos.icnetwork.co.uk/icliverpool/riverlands_park.wmv

[Jericho]

Thanks, Kev. It's good that it's not gated and I like the way it integrates with the promenade.

Not many shots of the residential development. What I saw seemed like a cross between JMU student accomodation and a hybrid south docks/ropewalks theme.

The viewing platform and some of the 'furniture' looked a bit tacky but that's probably just a product of the flythrough, the finished result will hopefully be better.

I wonder how locals in the St Michael's area will react to this latest promo? I might pop along to the meeting mentioned by scouserdave to find out.

[AK1]

This, along with the current improvements to otterspool promenade will make the entire area a great place to live and visit. :)

[Max]

Friends of Liverpool Monuments Civic Society has just opened a campaign page (http://liverpoolmonuments.co.uk/projects/garden.htm) and yours truly is posing in the 1984 pic:unibrow:

Why did they have the one were you posing under a pot of flowers?:PDT10

Technically your not wearing the flowers In your hair, otherwise you'd be a hippy.:eek:

[Kev]

Residents are opposing a £250m plan to redevelop the Liverpool International Garden Festival site.

Langtree McLean has submitted plans to demolish the derelict festival hall to make way for about 1,300 homes and restore 56 acres of grounds.

People living nearby are angry that a large number of the trees on the site have been cut down by the developer.

Langtree McLean said it was important to get the trees cleared before the start of the bird nesting season. continues (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6557215.stm).....

[Kev]

A DAY of protest was held at the destruction of an estimated 1,000 trees on the former Liverpool Garden Festival site.

People living nearby are furious at developer Langtree McLean’s removal of part of the woodland which has developed over the past two decades while the site has been unused.

Around 100 protesters took part and said the trees, which had been planted as saplings for the Garden Festival in 1984, had become a significant piece of woodland providing a home to 15 varieties of native or naturalised trees and more than 30 species of birds.

continues (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/liverpoolecho/news/echonews/tm_headline=anger-at-felling-of-festival-site-trees%26method=full%26objectid=18911486%26siteid=5 0061-name_page.html).....

[PhilipG]

The residents who live nearest to the Garden Festival site are by definition living on the first section of that site to be converted to housing.
It seems quite ironic that they are the first to complain, because without their houses the woodland would be even larger today.

[Kev]

JAPANESE experts could help transform Liverpool’s festival gardens.

The site will be split into five zones if they reopen to the public next summer.

Oriental gardeners are to be recruited to help revive the popular Chinese and Japanese gardens, which will join the main lake and spectacular waterfall.

Experts from Japan are likely to be drafted in for the highly-skilled operation, including creating an arboretum on the banks of the lake.

The two existing Chinese pavilions will be refurbished and joined by an extended viewing platform in the Japanese garden.

Langtree McLean will restore 65 acres of the overgrown complex if its £250m scheme to bring the much-loved site back into use is approved by councillors.

Experts have now split the huge site into five “character areas” as they prepare to start work, possibly this summer.

Langtree McLean is now waiting to find out if it will get planning permission from Liverpool council.

If successful, it intends to start work on the gardens this summer, with a finishing date of summer 2008.

The plans are facing opposition from dozens of residents angry at the developer’s decision to fell up to 1,000 trees so surveys could be carried out.

nick.coligan@liverpool.com

[snappel]

It seems quite ironic that they are the first to complain, because without their houses the woodland would be even larger today.
Well spotted!

[Jericho]

I went down to the meeting last weekend. I couldn't quite figure out what the concerns were really about. There seemed to be quite a few people from the St Michaels area as opposed to the post garden festival developments and there was a lot of talk about contaminated land and bird nests. If memory serves me right most of the exisitng 'new' housing is where the storage tanks used to be (Gardenia Grove, Beech Avenue). The Garden Festival site is essentially the old rubbish tip. Was toxic material dumped there? If it's methane from household rubbish and whatnot, I guess there are established ways of managing that problem.

None of the trees in this area is older than the Garden Festival. The more established trees are still largely present in what is now called Priory Wood. I'm sympathetic to wildlife habitats but I find it difficult to believe that that's the whole story. No one seemed to have much of an idea of what to do with the site apart from 'saving it until something greener can be done.' I suggested that the opportunity for retail development in this part of town might improve the mix on offer in this part of L17. No one seemed particularly interested. My claim that a park open to the public that also connected the promenade with St Michaels's station should ideally lead to the Dingle Lane / Promenade Gardens barrier being removed to allow for through traffic so that the wider city could make use of the facilities went down like a lead baloon!

[MariaC]

I thought that it was Shorefields up as far as the cast iron shore. Anyway Im proud to come from the Dingle.

[taffy]

I thought that it was Shorefields up as far as the cast iron shore. Anyway Im proud to come from the Dingle.

And so you should be proud to come from the Dingle !! Really the Shorefields area including the Shorefields School are all in the Dingle. It's interesting to look at the OS map of the area

http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/getamap/

Just type in the word Aigburth and then pan west to the word Dingle and you'll see where officially the area is centred on.

[GingerTheCat]

I don't know why you keep going on about "how the locals deny they live in the Dingle". Perhaps thats because we live in Riverside Gardens! Its a fact.

Personally I have an interest in local history so I am fascinated by the history of the area and the fact that it USED to be Dingle. But it really isn't Dingle anymore.

Not according to my address anyway.

You seem to be justifyably proud of Dingle and Toxteth but won't allow us to be proud of Riverside Gardens.

Mike
www.riversidegardens.org.uk

[AK1]

Riverside gardens is the name of the estate, not the area. The area is dingle.

[PhilipG]

If people would be honest and admit that they live in Dingle, then Dingle could be promoted as including places like Riverside Gardens and the Herculaneum Dock and the perpetuated idea that Dingle is somewhere undesirable to live might start to vanish.
I live near the Ancient Chapel, but my neighbours in Riverside Gardens which is next to the geographical feature that is the Dingle (and even includes Dingle Point!), have, as has been pointed out, even had their postcode changed from L8 to L17, and my other neighbours in the Herculaneum Dock, which is next door to Dingle Bank, have an L3 postcode.
L3 is London Road, etc., for heavens sake, but because the South Docks were private property L3 has been chosen instead of L8.
Of course we all know it's to do with property prices, but it's not doing anything to encourage people living close to each other to get along with each other.
The funniest part of all this is that my neighbours in Riverside Gardens and the Herculaneum Dock live even closer to The Dingle than I do!

[Jericho]

Interesting comments. The locals of course deny the reality that they actually live in the Dingle !! The storage tanks were the Dingle Oil terminal storage tanks and they used to be in Liverpool L8, and not L17 the area has been , by sleight of hand , transformed into today. L17 that must be Aigburth I hear them shout !! Hurrah we live in Aigburth.

Aigburth is so passé these days. L17 is the postcode everyone wants!

If you don't believe me have a look at:

http://money.independent.co.uk/property/homes/article2456837.ece

(I know it's full of inaccuracies, what isn't these days? It's allegedly about Aigburth but it's mostly about L17 south of Aigburth. When people outside the city think of Aigburth they think of Lark Lane)

I'm not sure anyone outside Liverpool can correctly pronounce Aigburth anyway.

RIP Aigburth. Viva L17!

L17:PDT_Aliboronz_11: - you know it makes sense :)

[Jericho]

I don't know why you keep going on about "how the locals deny they live in the Dingle". Perhaps thats because we live in Riverside Gardens! Its a fact.

Personally I have an interest in local history so I am fascinated by the history of the area and the fact that it USED to be Dingle. But it really isn't Dingle anymore.

Not according to my address anyway.

You seem to be justifyably proud of Dingle and Toxteth but won't allow us to be proud of Riverside Gardens.

Mike
www.riversidegardens.org.uk

Great website, Mike.

Riverside Gardens always conjures up an image of Caryl, Warwick or Kent Gardens for me but without the same lifeforce. Anyway, that's another story.

Historically and geographically most of Riverside Gardens is in the Dingle. Look on the map, find where Dingle Vale intersects with Colebrooke Road and draw a straigt line to the Mersey. The area north of that is most definitely in the Dingle.

However, in terms of Liverpool in the 21st Century, Riverside Gardens is not in the Dingle it's in L17. Wasn't it, according to LCC, in the Dingle briefly until the locals asked for the signs to be removed?

The area referred to as the Dingle seems to be a moveable feast. I'm not sure until LCC put up the recent signs that there was ever a clear understanding of where its boundaries lay. The old Dingle tramsheds then bus garage now appears to be in Toxteth and not Dingle, I think. Although the sign for Toxteth is actually north of this area. (Before anyone corrects me, I know that the Dingle is a district within historical Toxteth Park). My preference is for postcodes. I always know where I stand with L17 and L8.

There are at least two sides to this debate. An historical/geographical strand that with one or two fuzzy edges that clearly puts Riverside Gardens in the Dingle! And a psychological / aspirational one that takes it out of the Dingle and puts it in L17!

Because this area was in recent times uninhabited and because no one woke up one day to find themselves living in L17 having gone to sleep in L8, I don't have a problem with this area being seen as being in L17 or claiming to be in L17. The area for the proposed new developments is ARGUABLY for the most part in L17.

Geographical boundaries between districts within cities is not an exact science. Hence calling the developed southern docks area L3 and not L8 can be seen as having some legitimacy. I feel less comfortable about changing the postcode for an area that used to be known by another postcode although I accept that a city has a legal right to do this.

Some people who live in Caldy over on the Wirral state that they live in Cheshire and not Merseyside. Because this area was once known as Cheshire in their lifetime I have some sympathy for them even though all the wishful thinking in the world will never make it Cheshire again.

I sympathise with the argument based on geographical/historical associations that most of the southern docks and Riverside Gardens should be in L8. I think it would mark this city out as very special if this happened.

My head tells me it's never going to happen.

And we all know why.

[marky]

I found this on Flikr a couple of weeks ago...it shows the area around Dingle lane. I wanted to add a comment to this pic but I've searched Flickr looking for the persons account (as there were a couple of other pics of interest). I've searched for Dingle Lane, IGF, Herculaneum etc and still can't find it again. If anyone knows a link, please post.

[PhilipG]

I'm rather tempted to revive the Judas tradition in the Dingle and aim it at the "Deniers".
But, as Jericho says, it'll never happen.

[PhilipG]

I found this on Flikr a couple of weeks ago...it shows the area around Dingle lane. I wanted to add a comment to this pic but I've searched Flickr looking for the persons account (as there were a couple of other pics of interest). I've searched for Dingle Lane, IGF, Herculaneum etc and still can't find it again. If anyone knows a link, please post.

That's a great photo, Marky.
It's about the same time as 4 that Maddieliverpool has put on "Old Lverpool", but I don't know if it's one of his.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/7529968@N05/438443414/in/set-72157600034517305/

[marky]

Yes, that's the one...Maddieliverpool (these early IGF development pics still don't get picked up when I search Flickr, though).

[GingerTheCat]

Its a pity that when they 'created' Riverside Gardens they forgot some of the most important things.

1. Pub
2. Bus Stop
3. Shop

Of course I'm not being completely serious but there is a point to be made. Its not impossible to walk to these three places but it is "just a bit too far". (I realise different parts of Riverside Gardens experience this to a varying extent). This leads to a car culture which leads to a lack of community because you rarely bump into people. And once you have decided to drive whats the point in going to your local pub?

The Pub and bus stop would be within walking distance if there wasn't that other big Riverside Gardens problem. "The fence mentality" It should be just a short walk down to the river (and pub and bus) but there is a fence there to keep the baddies out. But what you gain in security to lose in making a community.

I've just got back from walking up Dingle Lane to the shop to get the paper. I didn't pass one person in Riverside Gardens. I was passed by loads of cars though. Once into 'Dingle' there were loads of people walking to the shop some even talking to each other! :shock:

One last request. Please don't assume everyone is the same. You often see headlines like "Riverside Gardens residents are angry about..." . There are many opinions, we don't all think the same. Most people are in favour of the new development including the official residents association.

Cheers

Mike


Mike

[PhilipG]

There's something to be said for not seeing your neighbours.
Only joking, but every time I bump into mine it turns into a long chat, especially when I'm trying to rush off somewhere.

Mike, you must be in the middle of Riverside Gardens, because the Britannia should be your local and you've got bus routes on Riverside Drive (but I suspect it's not a very frequent service).

[Steven]

Its a pity that when they 'created' Riverside Gardens they forgot some of the most important things.

1. Pub
2. Bus Stop
3. Shop

Of course I'm not being completely serious but there is a point to be made. Its not impossible to walk to these three places but it is "just a bit too far". (I realise different parts of Riverside Gardens experience this to a varying extent). This leads to a car culture which leads to a lack of community because you rarely bump into people. And once you have decided to drive whats the point in going to your local pub?

The Pub and bus stop would be within walking distance if there wasn't that other big Riverside Gardens problem. "The fence mentality" It should be just a short walk down to the river (and pub and bus) but there is a fence there to keep the baddies out. But what you gain in security to lose in making a community.

I've just got back from walking up Dingle Lane to the shop to get the paper. I didn't pass one person in Riverside Gardens. I was passed by loads of cars though. Once into 'Dingle' there were loads of people walking to the shop some even talking to each other! :shock:

One last request. Please don't assume everyone is the same. You often see headlines like "Riverside Gardens residents are angry about..." . There are many opinions, we don't all think the same. Most people are in favour of the new development including the official residents association.

Cheers

Mike


Mike

My mate has to drive from Riverside gardens to The Phoenix or the Bleak House in Cockburn Street. Then we have to take his car keys away from him and put him up for the night.
The Britania is a good place for a meal on the way to Otterspool but it's not what you'd call 'Your local.'

[Jericho]

I've just got back from walking up Dingle Lane to the shop to get the paper. I didn't pass one person in Riverside Gardens. I was passed by loads of cars though. Once into 'Dingle' there were loads of people walking to the shop some even talking to each other! :shock:


Mike

Watch out, Mike. Who knows - you might end up going all native and start talking about the Dingle, rather than Dingle! :ninja: :)

[Steven]

Watch out, Mike. Who knows - you might end up going all native and start talking about the Dingle, rather than Dingle! :ninja: :)

Me feet begin to tingle when I'm walkin' round the Dingle.
:RAP:
Lord have mersey on me.


Billy Marr and 3+1:PDT11

[GingerTheCat]

Watch out, Mike. Who knows - you might end up going all native and start talking about the Dingle, rather than Dingle! :ninja: :)

The weird thing is that my mum comes from Dingle. But not "the Dingle". Its this one. (http://www.dingle-peninsula.ie/)

Mike

[GingerTheCat]

Just received this from John Coyne the local councillor.


This morning, I went to the Executive Board Meeting to "call-in" the decision to proceed with the promenade land transfer and to release the developer from some guarantees.

The Lib Dems took the irregular step of blocking the "call-in" on the grounds that the decision was too urgent.

The Executive then decided not to allow the promenade land to be used.

He says more but as it has a heavy political slant I won't publish it here.

The bottom line seems to be , its all on hold and here we go again.

Mike

[Jericho]

Just received this from John Coyne the local councillor.



He says more but as it has a heavy political slant I won't publish it here.

The bottom line seems to be , its all on hold and here we go again.

Mike

John Coyne' s defection from the Libdems to the Green Party in St Michaels is interesting.

Don't be at all surprised if we end up with five more years of dereliction on that site.

On the other hand if the Libdems increase their hold on LCC, and if John isn't relected, who knows what will happen next :Smiliz_Kingz_PDT_13

[Paul D]

The park was fine but I wasn't impressed with those crappy lowrise apartments they had planned for it.This site should be used for a waterpark or an ice rink or something,something everyone can enjoy.

[ChrisGeorge]

Here's a few photos of the Dingle at Lymm in Cheshire. Had not the philistine Liverpool City Council filled in the original Dingle valley in Toxteth with rubbish ( around 1900), perhaps the current residents of the L17 part of Dingle would like the area to be actually called the Dingle.

There is of course another Dingle in Toxteth: the stream of which forms the lake in Princes Park and flows towards the River Mersey via St Michael's in the Hamlet. Hence the valley slope down Aigburth Rd near the Shell Pertrol station


Hello Taffy

I think the Dingle that flowed through St. Michael's-in-the-Hamlet was known as Dickinson's Dingle was it not? That is how I seem to recall it was described in Griffiths' Royal and Ancient Park of Toxteth.

Chris

[Kev]

CAMPAIGNERS claimed victory last night after halting plans that would have seen a slice of riverfront promenade in Liverpool used for a luxury homes project. more (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/liverpooldailypost/news/regionalnews/tm_headline=plots-for-riverfront-homes-thrown-out%26method=full%26objectid=18978922%26siteid=500 61-name_page.html)

[MariaC]

That's good news Kev but desipie our campaigns it diesn't seem will be able to stop the high rises at the bottom of the ' Bread streets' Near green's Gym. Our lovely views will be lost.

[PhilipG]

That's good news Kev but desipie our campaigns it diesn't seem will be able to stop the high rises at the bottom of the ' Bread streets' Near green's Gym. Our lovely views will be lost.

I'm not going to take sides, but it's interesting that the residents in a new (rather expensive) estate, think they've won their battle, while the residents of the 'Bread' streets think they've lost theirs.

OK, I will take sides.
It was always understood that the IGF site would end up as mostly housing, with just parts (like the Japanese Garden) made into public parks.
Most of the trees planted were only supposed to be there for six months, and it's only because the site has been neglected for so many years that they are now 20 odd years old. They must need a good thinning-out anyway.
It's not even as if the nearby residents are allowed (officially) into the woods.
They are living on part of the IGF site, and the sooner they realise that it's only right that the original plans are allowed to happen, the sooner it will be that the rest of us will be able to enjoy the Japanese Gardens in the way the Japanese Nation wanted us to.

[taffy]

Hello Taffy

I think the Dingle that flowed through St. Michael's-in-the-Hamlet was known as Dickinson's Dingle was it not? That is how I seem to recall it was described in Griffiths' Royal and Ancient Park of Toxteth.

Chris

Yes that's right. See also

http://www.toxteth.net/places/liverpool/history/streams/dickenson.htm

[PhilipG]

Thanks Taffy and Chris.

The Dingle itself was created by a stream that ran down the site of Park Road across what is now Dingle Lane and through the entrance to the Turner Home, then the field at the back, and the recreation ground, then the allotments.
It joined the Mersey at Knotts Hole, where the Festival Hall was.

[Paul D]

Planning Committee to visit Festival site next Tuesday

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/1976/gardenfestivallargemk6im0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[AntiPathos]

Surprised nobody mentioned it: the Johnathon Meades series on BBC2 had a spot on Regeneration and extensively talked about Liverpool and the GF last night.

[GingerTheCat]

Surprised nobody mentioned it: the Johnathon Meades series on BBC2 had a spot on Regeneration and extensively talked about Liverpool and the GF last night.

I wish somebody had mentioned it. Would have liked to see it. Looking at the TV listings I can't see any repeat showings scheduled either.

Anyone got it recorded?

Mike

[Ged]

Meade and his programme gets a mention on the peel thread.

[GingerTheCat]

Meade and his programme gets a mention on the peel thread.

Peel thread ?

[billo]

Peel thread ?

Urban Development page
http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4457
I've just added my 2p's worth :)

[GingerTheCat]

Thanks Billo :)

[Libertarian]

Interesting to see that the police are cracking down on the Otterspool area being misused as a cruising area for Gay men.

As a member of the Gay community myself I welcome this move. This is a misuse of an area that is used by families and other people and it has got to be noted that most of these men down there are married who are too scared to go on the scene due to being 'outed'.

In no way is the police action homophobic it is long overdue. Personally I wouldn't feel very comfortable walking round down there in case anyone thought I was doing something dodgy. Therefore this sort of thing has made the place inaccesible for the law abiding majority.

[GingerTheCat]

Garden Festival Plans approved

Plans to regenerate the derelict Garden Festival site in Liverpool have been given the go-ahead by the city council.

Developers Langtree have been given outline permission to build 1,308 flats and 66 houses on the site, which has been largely neglected since the 1990s.

Full planning permission was also granted for the restoration of the Japanese and Chinese Gardens.

Protesters said the site, designed for the 1984 International Garden Festival, should be used as public parkland.

The decision will now be passed to the Department of Communities and Local Government for consideration.

Haydock-based commercial developer Langtree, which bought the site near Otterspool in July 2004, has joined forces with the David McLean Group to restore the area.

It plans to knock down the derelict festival hall to make way for the new development.

It will also cultivate the site's current gardens - including the original Chinese and Japanese gardens - in partnership with the Land Restoration Trust.

When completed, the gardens will be opened to the public, the developers hope, in time for 2008.

Story from BBC website (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6678575.stm)

The full report itself (Quite a large pdf) (http://councillors.liverpool.gov.uk/Published/C00000307/M00006824/AI00035767/$Item4a1.docA.ps.pdf)


:) or :shock: or :PDT_Aliboronz_24: or maybe even :eek:

[A.D.W]

It plans to knock down the derelict festival hall to make way for the new development.

Story from BBC website (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6678575.stm)

:) or :shock: or :PDT_Aliboronz_24: or maybe even :eek:

Somebody should tell them the hall was removed some time ago.

[GingerTheCat]

Looks like the "Save the Trees" group were right after all. Priory Wood is in for some serious thinning.


There is to be extensive tree removal proposed from both the main body of the site. Mitigation by habitat creation and enhancement will be explored although with all mitigation being in suitable areas.

To maximise pedestrian access to the park by sustainable means, it has
been considered necessary to ensure that the route through Priory Wood
(see separate section) is as safe as possible. This will have some negative impact on ecology and trees but it is considered essential given the likely increase in footfall through Priory Wood in the interests of pedestrian safety.

The Planning Manager is satisfied that any negative impacts can be
adequately compensated for at the southern grasslands and through the
wildlife management plans proposed under the S106 Agreement.

[GingerTheCat]

... and the roads in for some changes ...

the applicant has also agreed to the provision of a number of other measures to be introduced adjacent to the development. These are detailed below:

New Signal Controlled Crossing

Located to the west of the Promenade Garden access roundabout between the proposed new site access priority junction near to the Britannia Public House. This will link the site to existing bus stop facilities and will also incorporate cycle facilities.

New Pedestrian Refuge Islands (3no.)


Located on Riverside Drive close to Moel Famau View, Bempton Road (priority junction) and Beech Avenue. These will assist pedestrians in crossing at these locations along Riverside Drive (by allowing the pedestrian to cross a shorter distance in two separate stages) whilst also assisting in reducing vehicular traffic speeds by reducing the available carriageway widths at these localised points.

Existing Signal Crossing Riverside Drive

This will be upgraded to a ‘Toucan’ facility so that both pedestrians and cyclists can use the facility, helping to link the development site to the nearby railway station. This will improve connectivity between the railway station and the development site, including the proposed leisure and recreational facilities.

[Kev]

Experts will start restoring 67 acres of overgrown parkland in September if the government rubber-stamps Liverpool council’s decision. more (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/liverpoolecho/news/echonews/tm_headline=23-years-on%2D-festival-site-to-bloom-again%26method=full%26objectid=19152749%26siteid=5 0061-name_page.html)

[LunaticLu]

Humm. I do hope they make sumthing nice out of it. Sadly when it's a question of private interests VS public interests and promoters are there for the money they can make as opposed to the wellbeing of the city's residents, we often find ourselves with less than what was actually promised.

I think it would be wonderful if the city redevelopped that park for public interests wich is surely what they are trying to do. Sadly they probably don't have the budget for it. But somehow it strikes me as curious a city would choose to let a promoter build sumthing that sounds like condo's or towers on the land in the hopes to see it redevelopped as a public park. Still better than leaving it abandonned I suppose.

I'm hoping for the best still...

I have a question... does anyone know y it was abandonned in the first place seems like it was quite wonderful at one time?

[Steven]

Hi,

Marie and I walked past the festival site yesterday on our way to Otterspool Prom and then back to the Britania.
It used to be a beautiful place but sadly it was founded on a rubbish tip.

The result of which was methane gas was coming up. For a few years they burned this off and as I drove home down Sefton Street, ( particularly during the winters nights) I could see these flames coming from pipes in the ground.

Our city 'Fathers' are planning to restore some of it when it is safe and have also sold part of it for new housing .

[ourground]

I followed ken's "more" link which took me to the Echo's news site and they often give misleading information to support building projects - for the other side of the Garden Festival story and more details visit http://www.ourground.net

Regarding the methane gas, from the several toxic and domestic landfill sites which the Festival site was built on, it is still continually burnt off. You can see the processing plant buildings on Otterspool Promenade - 10 mins walk along the woodland embankment from Brittania Inn. But the chimney is hidden by buildings which can only be seen from the hill at the back.

By all accounts the Festival site ground is contaminated and is unsuitable for heavy vehicles. If development goes ahead the woodland along the prom will be replaced by a half mile stretch of 8-story tower blocks and the public open space along the Prom will be given to the developers for a building site road.

Festival campaigners are questioning the wisdom of the planning consent and are asking people to support a public enquiry.

[LunaticLu]

Wow!
Thanks for the info steven, and for the link Ourground. That explains alot...dun think would be very safe for them to build homes on it then...awwww well its sad. Not too different than what has happend before in my home town. Once the ground is contaminated it will take decades to clean up sometimes more. They should plant decontaminating plants on the site for a few decades...Some plants have the amazing characteristic of consuming certain polutants, they're more and more used here on old contaminated grounds. Some actually decontaminate grounds sufficiently after a few years or more, but its still all experimental.:PDT_Aliboronz_11:

On a positive note tho heres to the initiatives and all the peeps trying to make a garden out of it again.:PDT_Aliboronz_24:
__________________________________________________ ___
:hug: to all, Lucie

[PhilipG]

Some of this site has had houses built on it and it seems that some of the protestors are the residents of these houses.
Are they also complaining about their houses being built on "contaminated" land?
I think not!

NIMBYS!

[billo]

I remember walking around the site when it was announced that they were building the Garden Festival, there were huge underground concrete tanks covered over with grass to conceal them which my father's old A-Z said were tank farms and something in the back of my mind tells me that they stored fuel and Naphthalene, I guess they were installed during the war.

[Jericho]

Some of this site has had houses built on it and it seems that some of the protestors are the residents of these houses.
Are they also complaining about their houses being built on "contaminated" land?
I think not!

NIMBYS!

I agree. I went to one of their meetings a few week's back and my sense was that the contamination thing was being emphasised because they couldn't say that they didn't want such a large development on their doorstep because of the accusation of NIMBYism that would follow. I'm sure the developers are fully aware of the dangers of building on such a site and will take care to ensure that it is properly managed. Unless they do so no one will want to buy a property there anyway. I'm grateful to the protestors therefore for drawing attention to this issue. It will have the effect of ensuring that the developers do their job properly!

[Jericho]

I remember walking around the site when it was announced that they were building the Garden Festival, there were huge underground concrete tanks covered over with grass to conceal them which my father's old A-Z said were tank farms and something in the back of my mind tells me that they stored fuel and Naphthalene, I guess they were installed during the war.

All of the oil related storage tanks etc were north of Riverside Drive. The tip was south of it. The main petrochemical installations ran from just behind the cricket ground to Dingle Lane and there was a separate development off St Michael's Road where Moel Famau View (No, I'm not having a laugh!) is now situated. ALL of this area is now residential.

[Steven]

How sad. I walked past there a few days ago with Marie and tried to explain just how really good it was, until it was left to go into rack and ruin.
We had a pint in the Britannia to drown our sorrows.

[Kev]

We had a pint in the Britannia to drown our sorrows.

Can you believe the Britannia was only supposed to be a temporary pub? Still standing after all these years.

[Jericho]

Can you believe the Britannia was only supposed to be a temporary pub? Still standing after all these years.

If the development of the festival site goes ahead it will probably turn into a boutique hotel!

Or maybe a travelodge. That would put the cat amongst the local pigeons :PDT10

[PhilipG]

Can you believe the Britannia was only supposed to be a temporary pub? Still standing after all these years.

Who told you that, Kev?
The Britannia was always intended to be a permanent pub.

[Kev]

Who told you that, Kev?
The Britannia was always intended to be a permanent pub.

Something I heard, probably on here :PDT_Xtremez_42:

[GingerTheCat]

The Langtree/McLeans application for the Garden Festival site has been called in for the Secretary of State to determine, after a public Inquiry. The reason given is that the proposals may conflict with important national planning policies for new housingWhich will drag on and on and on...:disgust:

[Jericho]

Which will drag on and on and on...:disgust:

Mike, what are you quoting from?

[GingerTheCat]

Perhaps it wasn't meant for general release yet so I'd better not say. But I believe it to be true.

[Jericho]

Thanks for the quick reply:PDT_Aliboronz_11:

[drone_pilot]

The government has ordered plans to redevelop the former garden festival
site in Liverpool to public inquiry.

Outline planning permission for the Otterspool site was granted to developers
in May by the city council.

The proposal would see more than 1,300 homes and preserve 56 acres of the
Japanese and Chinese gardens.

BBC Read More (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6286778.stm)

[PhilipG]

It's only taken 23 years for the government to get involved. :shock:
I'm beginning to wonder if anything will happen in my lifetime.

[Kev]

Boo Hiss, I hope who-ever is responsible feels ashamed of themselves.

[GingerTheCat]

Statement by Lucy Page, Chairwoman, Save The Festival Gardens Campaign:


"On behalf of the campaign to Save the Festival Gardens I welcome the Secretary of State's decision to call in the planned Langtree Mclean scheme.

·"We want a public inquiry because we believe that the proposals to redevelop this important site have never been given proper scrutiny and assessment. We hope a public planning inquiry will provide the comprehensive re-assessment the scheme needs – and will help rescue the Council from the consequences of its negligence.

"The truth is that the Council approved the Langtree McLean scheme on the basis of a badly flawed assessment by the Planning Officers – and because the Council itself had failed to scrutinise the proposals from their planning officers properly.


Full rant can be read here (http://www.riversidegardens.org.uk/forum/index.php?topic=46.0)

[Jericho]

I'm left with the suspicion that many of the people doing the campaigning want the festival site to become a 'public garden' or 'designated wildlife area' because it would increase the value of their properties.

It will be interesting to see what arguments are put forward at the inquiry.

Apparently it was one of Ruth Kelly's last decisions.

[Jericho]

Just read the 'rant'.

I find it a bit disingenuous. My reading of the design is that most of the residential development would be on land not dissimular from that currently occupied by the current Riverside Gardens (a former petro-chemical storage facility). The actual rubbish tip was largely confined to the area of a line to the left of Southwood Road (if my memory serves me right).

Has anyone actually done toxicity readings for the soil in the proposed development area?

Maybe the inquiry should look at wider developments in this area since 1984. I would welcome the opportunity to see the whole of the area returned to its pristine pre storage depot state. Of course, that would involve removing all residential development between Buckland Street/Dingle Vale, Lane and Road and the Mersey. Just think of what an asset such an area would be to the southend of the city.;)

[GingerTheCat]

Has anyone actually done toxicity readings for the soil in the proposed development area? Well this is what was in the original documents


Considering the site is also a former landfill site, Policy EP3 – Landfill Gas
also applies which advises:-

• That planning permission will not be granted for development on
former landfill sites unless the applicant can clearly demonstrate
that there is no risk from the generation or migration of landfill gas,
or that satisfactory measures can be taken to counter any possible
hazard.

The site is clearly heavily contaminated and due to the major costs involved
in undertaking a full blown contamination investigation ‘at risk’, such a route,
whilst desirable, would be completely commercially unviable given the risks
associated with securing a planning permission. As such, an amount of
preliminary works have been undertaken, and are continuing to be
undertaken.

Methodology
A total of 25 boreholes are proposed in order to continue site investigations
at this site. Both landfill gas and groundwater are to be monitored at
fortnightly intervals in order to establish the existing regimes on site.
Monitoring locations are chosen based on areas of likely exposure to
potential residents of the site, and areas where gas levels have previously
indicated elevated concentrations of landfill gas. A wide range of chemical
parameters will continue to be tested on soils to ensure that they will not
create any long term risks to end users of this site.
The study into the generation of leachate and its potential migration within
the site and its impact on the environment is currently in progress.
The long term management of landfill gas utilising the current gas migratory
pipelines is currently being considered.
Notwithstanding efforts to minimise the amount of ‘cut’ into the site, a
substantial amount of material is proposed to be re-graded between the
developed core and the southern grassland areas that will require complete
characterisation of the material that is to be excavated.

and I thought it was the slugs that were killing my carrots.:shock:

[PhilipG]

I just want what was always promised.
Namely the Japanese Gardens made available to the public, and housing built on the rest of the site.
As for the whole site remaining a park/woodland, I think I'm right in saying that this site is bang in the middle of three public parks, namely Prince's, Sefton and Otterspool.
No other part of Liverpool has such a high percentage of public open spaces.
None of this Festival Gardens site is officially open to anybody, least of all the NIMBY's who want it left to continue to be the biggest blight in South Liverpool.

[Steven]

Well said Philip G.:handclap::handclap:

[AK1]

If you actually look at the plans you can see that the residential bit only takes up about a quarter of the site with the rest of of it being restored and opened up to the public.
This is just another delay for yet another key project in Liverpool. I feel truly ashamed at the lack of co-operation and the blatant selfishness of some people in this city. Whatever happened to looking forward and doing what's best for the city? People only care if it affects them and if they have something to gain from it. It's sad to see.:disgust:

[Howie]

Festival gardens revamp setback

The regeneration of Liverpool’s derelict International Garden Festival site was put on hold once again last night, after it emerged a public inquiry is to scrutinise the project.

More (http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-news/regional-news/2007/07/10/festival-gardens-revamp-setback-64375-19431234/)...


Inquiry into festival site scheme

The government has ordered plans to redevelop the former garden festival site in Liverpool to public inquiry.

More (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6286778.stm)...


Garden festival plan hit by inquiry delay

Long-awaited plans to restore Liverpool’s derelict garden festival site are in doubt today.

More (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2007/07/10/garden-festival-plan-hit-by-inquiry-delay-100252-19433242/)...

[LunaticLu]

The land there thinking of building on sounds pretty contaminated. In order to supply all those appartements taps in water they would naturally have to run the water pipes leading to the buildings under contaminated ground. Now, my concern is this: pipes decay and get leaks in time, this happens to all pipes. Leaks are often long to notice. Wich means that after some years when those pipes buried in contaminated ground crack and leak some contaminants may well get into the water the people living in those appartements are drinking. Now I dunno about other reasons for an inquiry on the project, but I sure would like some questions asked on how they plan on insuring those peoples health that will be living in those buildings, not just now when the pipes are new but in 5, 10, 20, 30+ years from now when those pipes aren't pristine anymore and start making innocent people sick. Once a pipe system has been put in the ground city governments tend to overlook them for a long time until major problems arise. Just mentioning it cause we have had this problem with old overlooked pipes dating quite some time breaking and causing problems in my own town. Luckily for us they were not buried in contaminated ground. But what if they are? Contaminants tend to circulate in the ground even when it's filled in with new soil, even rain has been known to carry contaminants from one place in soil to another as it's absorbed and moves trough the ground. What are the real risks to the people living there? I'd love to see that project come true and for that land not to be left in the current state but I do understand y certain people are raising questions.

[PhilipG]

If the unbuilt on part of the Garden Festival site is contaminated, then so is the land on which the NIMBY's are living, because it was all the same site before 1984.
They don't complain that their houses are on contaminated land, just the rest of the site which they don't want to be built on.
Which leads me to conclude that none of the site is contaminated, except if you consider the methane gas a contaminant, and that is being safely disposed of on-site.

[LunaticLu]

Now thats really interesting to know. Thanks for the info Phil. If your right about that land all being the same then the NIMBY'S should really watch out for whats in there drinking water. And yes I would also, like you, question there motivations as to know why they oppose the project if they are already living on the said contaminated land themselves. As for there being no comtamination well considering its an old garbage dump I'd be amazed if it was only methane emanations that were the problem, knowing what people throw in the garbage and all. The usual contaminants found in dumps here are a combination of heavy metals and other by products of decaying house furnishings like freyon, etc.

Speaking of, does anyone have an old map of how far that old garbage dump spanned exactly? I'd really be curious to know how much land exactly it used to cover.

__________________
thanx for the info y'all:hug:

[Howie]

See also the 'Inquiry into festival site scheme' thread here (http://www.yoliverpool.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5190).

[Howie]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cY5_roZBTY

[Paul D]

Inquiry into festival site scheme

So there should be,giving that prime site up for yuppie flats is just plain wrong.Give it back to the people the city centre has loads of brownfield sites that need developing.I want a waterpark there,I made an inquiry for the one in Southport this week and was told to expect a 2 hour wait,that's how popular it would be.

[Kev]

Well thanks for whoever is responsible for this :handclap::handclap: :PDT_Xtremez_12:

It shall remain closed to members of the public yet open to all manner of antisocial activities including motorbike/ quad bike riding and dog hunting plus other men in white transits :rolleyes:

[Max]

If they would just hand over Otterspool to me It would be a public ninja training ground by now.

The Mersey Is perfect for water element techniques.

The best views for Sun rise and sets to bring out tha fire In a warrior.

The Outdoor gym gear It has will harness the muscles to Improve earth element techniques.

Heavy winds due to being near the mesey will Improve wind powa and flight!

Sea Otters will return and become Sensei's. The Otters will test abdomen strength too by putting a sea shell on your stomach and smash the seashell with a giant rock and see how tough your abs really are.:PDT_Aliboronz_24::PDT_Aliboronz_24::PDT_Alibo ronz_24:

Plus It has two swing parks!:PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Kev]

BUILDING work on a development at Liver-pool’s derelict Interna-tional Garden Festival could start next year, after a date was set for an inquiry into the plans. Read (http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-news/regional-news/2007/08/14/new-hopes-for-08-start-on-garden-festival-site-64375-19622313/)

[AK1]

Hopefully this project will go ahead. I could understand if the entire site was being redeveloped into housing, but it's only about a quarter of it with the rest of it being restored and opened to the public. Even the residential bits are going to be opened up.

[kat2]

I agree, after all in the real world who could support something like the old site that once stood their, its about compromise and, like you have said now there seems to be a balanced approach. My only concerns are around the fact that it was once a rubbish dump and how that may or may not impact upon the health of residents there. Anything though has to be better than the dead lock situation that it currently is in. I do hope people realise that fancy parks cost money (council tax money) and if we are to try and keep a cap on things then this seems to be the best of both.
kat:)

[PhilipG]

BUILDING work on a development at Liver-pool’s derelict Interna-tional Garden Festival could start next year, after a date was set for an inquiry into the plans. Read (http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-news/regional-news/2007/08/14/new-hopes-for-08-start-on-garden-festival-site-64375-19622313/)

Who does the Liverpool Daily Post employ as a proof reader?
An illiterate Chimp?
This ridiculous habit of putting unnecessary hyphens in words has even reached the word 'Liverpool' (and 'International').
It looks so tatty and amateurish.

[mike green]

hwy guys. i am a 20 year student studying at the university of chester at the warrington campus. i know there has been som debates in your sprevously about this. I woz wondering if u ahd the contact details of a woman called lucy page. she is the chairwoman of teh save the garden festival site campagin. if u can help me, post here, or gizz us a bell, on 07747083604.

thanks,
mike green.:034:

[Howie]

Try savethefestivalgardens@googlemail.com

[mike green]

yea howie. have tried that, and just got a funnye-mail back over sigining some petition. do u ahve a direct phone number for kate page?

[kat2]

Lucy Page (Chairwoman) 0151 728 9066 pagelucy@merseymail
================================================== ===
More here too
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/regions/liverpool/2007/04/368655.html
not sure why anyone in their right minds would want to save something thats going to cost the council tax payer more money. I thought the new propsals for park land and development seemed like a good idea, long gone are the days of places like that, you only need to look at the national trend and alot of theme parks have closed, there just not financially viable any more, and liverpool is very fortunate in having alot of lovely parks, more so than most cities.
kat:)
I bet people wouldnt be so keen if they had to foot the bill through higher council tax rates to pay for such venues?

[Howie]

not sure why anyone in their right minds would want to save something thats going to cost the council tax payer more money

See www.geocities.com/savethefestivalgardens (http://www.geocities.com/savethefestivalgardens/)

[kat2]

*lol* those excuses seem very poor, there are large sections of the water front not available to the public! take part of brunswick for example, the only valid argument they have is land contamination. I actually thought the new proposals were very good and offered a good compromise. Get real is what I say theres no way a garden festival site will ever open again, it costs too much money to maintaine, at a time when councils are being forced and forced to cut back to the bone. how many public parks and gardens does liverpool have? more than most.
another pie in the sky dream
I think the developer turned some lovely drawings out and it offers woodland, a park, a lake, looks nice to me. If the garden festival site was so popular how come it went into decline so quickly after?
bit like southports pleasure land, under funded the net result, closure.
kat
:)

[Howie]

The trees should have helped remove a lot of the contamination. You can clean up almost anything with a few willows and earthworms. See, for example, the work of the Brownfield Remediation to Forestry Research Group here (http://www.ljmu.ac.uk/brownfield/).

[kat2]

http://img393.imageshack.us/img393/1456/gardenfestivallargevr7.jpg
I think the proposed drawings if they get the go ahead offers a good solution all round. Lets not forget the site wasnt viable from the outset, and only had a short shelf life. The garden festival site did not pay, it became run down and eventually had to close due to costs.
the above plans at least offer some park land and a lake, yuppy or not, this seems the only viable way forward.
More here by the developer
http://www.festivalgardens.co.uk/
to view the plans please select this download
http://www.festivalgardens.co.uk/pdf/Exhibition_Panels.pdf?f=q&hl=en&q=L3+9JQ&ie=UTF8&z=15&ll=53.409199,-2.993646&spn=0.011921,0.043259&om=1&iwloc=addr
photograph curtsey of skyscrapercity:)
kat

[kat2]

Nice layout what do others think? I think it offers a solution for both the investor and those that wish to retain some parkland.
kat:handclap::hug::disgust::eek:

[Digital Fanatic]

Nice layout what do others think? I think it offers a solution for both the investor and those that wish to retain some parkland.
kat:handclap::hug::disgust::eek:

Totally agree kat2, It would of been great for the whole site to be kept as it was for the IGF, but it's not feasable.

This is a good compromise for all

p.s. this is my first post, but long time reader! :PDT_Aliboronz_24:

[Digital Fanatic]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cY5_roZBTY

AAAhhh.. that brought back so many memories, especially the Chinese garden :handclap:

Anyone else got any video footage from the IGF? :)

[Steven]

Wonderful memories are being destroyed by Kevin Sampson's book *Outlaws*

Released as a film just in time for our 2008 City of Culture.!!!

Do we really need this negative Sh*t. In a City we are PROUD to belong to ?

[chippie]

I,ll say yuppy and yippy to that proposal Kat

[mike green]

hey guys,

thouht keep u updated on the garden fetival ite thing. I nterviewed lucy page on monday, and it was a very intsreting interview.She opened my eyes to what was happening on the site. anways wot i wanted to now woz anyone know to teh intial planning applicapion for the graden festival site? have tried plannin section on the council website but it doen't seem to be there.

[GingerTheCat]

I've got this link (http://councillors.liverpool.gov.uk/Published/C00000307/M00006824/AI00035767/$Item4a1.docA.ps.pdf)but can't remember exactly where it came from

Most stuff is under the 3 Parks Committee (http://councillors.liverpool.gov.uk/mgCommitteeDetails.asp?ID=806&J=2) or Executive Board



Mike

[kat2]

I dont think the initial planning application matters, as, I beleive its been revised anyway. No doubt next year when it goes before government? then things should be alot clearer. I do think though some live in fantasy world if they think the festival site would be revived as a festival site., unless of course you dont all mind paying extra on your council tax for it, and considering how many parks and gardens liverpool has, I cannot see that happening. Yes, you could agrue about the fact that it was a toxic dump not to be built on, but then no doubt over time they will find a work around for this.
pity really because I personally feel the new plans look like a very sensible compromise considering the cost of the proposed new park and lake, yes there will be homes built where the old buildings were, but then nothngs for free.
kat
*lol* I see a traite around liverpool, *sadly*, I want it this way and I want it now*!
kat:)

[Digital Fanatic]

Have they set a date for the public enquiry yet? And does anyone know if they've done any more work on the IGF site? :034:

[Kev]

EXTENSIVE plans to restore Liverpool’s former garden festival site have taken a crucial step forward.

Councillors agreed to hand over land next to the 67-acre site so developer Langtree McLean can start its £250m scheme if it gets the final go-ahead from the Government.

Liverpool council must now wait until the verdict from next month’s public inquiry before it knows if restoration work can start on the gardens, woods and grasslands.

Langtree McLean wanted an extra two acres of land between the festival gardens and Otterspool promenade to help it build waterfront apartment blocks.

But after talks with the council, they will now only need about 0.2 acres, mostly to create new footpaths.

Councillors rejected rumours the prom-enade would close to let the development take place.

IC Liverpool.

[Cadfael]

Personally, I would be very happy to buy a house on that plot of land as long as the little go-kart track was in my garden :PDT_Aliboronz_24: