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View Full Version : Reopenning Of North Liverpool Extention Line



oritelad
11-10-2009, 03:15 PM
does anyone know if there is any news on openning the north liverpool extention line again to passangers?? the whole track bed is still in place except between walton on hill station and the clubmoor bridge where the line curves around but i have checked google maps and the line can still be connected as they seem to have left space but it cant be in the original possition will this be ok to connect still? or this line can never reopen?

Waterways
11-10-2009, 03:53 PM
Oritelad, the line is mothballed, hence the bridges still intact. Nothing official has been mentioned at all. I don't think it was mentioned in the last two RUS'.

As focus has to shift to Merseyrail as the trams are virtually dead, these lines will be given some thought.

The "Outer Loop", does not need to use the Kirkdale to Rice Lane tunnel to get back to the city centre. It can branch into the Kirkby line just east of Rice Lane station. The cheapest way. The curves from the tunnel to the Outer Loop were stupidly built on. This is not a major show-stopper but another wall in the way.

A new Airport Line can seamlessly run onto the Outer Loop & Northern Line

Do we want the London line, Manchester line and Merseyrail to all call in at an airport station? I would say yes, as those in Warrington and Manchester can get to the airport directly. Those from Crewe and even the likes of Milton Keynes in Bucks could go direct quickly if the flight is what they want from Liverpool.

That means a branch from these lines before the Finch Farm EFC training ground and then run in over mainly fields. Merseyrail can get in that way as well - running around the back of the Jag factory and EFC. That means the airport station is a branch line. One of the Outer Loop curves has a building on it. This is no show-stopper as the free curve can be used using tighter curves using light rail trains. If it is to be an airport through station. Matters are more difficult getting across back to the London/Mcr lines north of the airport. Expensive bridges would need to be built.

It can also be used for freight at the cargo terminal Peel fantasise about at the airport linking Seaforth container terminal and the airport and maybe Garston Docks.

Below: Merseyrail in red, it can use the London line behind the Jaguar factory or the Manchester line - the top line.
The London lines in blue.
The Manchester line in green.
A new Merseyrail station can be built at Hale and Halewood station brought onto Merseyrail. Merseyrail using the London line would mean duel voltage trains using the overhead wires. Using the more preferable Manchester line would mean electrification for the short section from Hunts Cross to the branch and into the airport.

If the Outer Loop is recommissioned, in light blue, it could have a direct line into the airport. This gives huge parts of north, east and south Liverpool direct access to the airport.

EFC are at Finch Farm on the map.

http://i36.tinypic.com/et5zc6.jpg

Connecting Outer Loop at the North End

The line runs past the Long Lane industrial area which the council suggested as location for an EFC stadium. So two birds killed with one stone shifting 30,000 fans an hour per game.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z205/lamdelz/map3a.jpg
The mothballed Outer Loop in red

Above: A branch near Hartley's Hill Aintree, along the Outer Loop to Hunts Cross, which could also have the lines from Walton through Kirkdale and Sandhills (marked yellow) reinstated to 4 tracks if needed.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z205/lamdelz/map4.jpg
by Mke: Connecting the north end of the Outer Loop onto the Kirkby Line at Rice Lane station, using a part of the old Langton Dock branch trackbed

A branch of the Outer Loop into the Lpool-Mcr Line at Broad Green in the 1970s was planned. It was cancelled as the government ran out of money. This can come later after an opening of the Outer Loop when the city expands and finances are available. This gives a more radial link into the city centre.

North Mersey Line - From Bootle to Aintree

This is one track and used for maintenance trains. If this was brought back into commission this would provide an alternative route from Ormskirk alleviating the branch from Kirkdale to Kirkby. This have been mentioned in the last RUS, but not taken seriously enough. Merseytravel always touch on easy to recommission lines, rather than face the crux in the Liverpool's centre.

Light-Rail Carriages

Light-rail has the advantage of easily extending onto Liverpool and Wirral Waters and using very tight curves when connecting existing disused tunnels like the Waterloo tunnel or up a gantry into the Dingle Tunnel. One or two small cars can be used during off-peak hours.

Siemens recently announced the "City" light-rail version of its Desiro car range. It can negotiate tighter curves, ideal for running into Wirral Waters and Liverpool Waters, and reduces track wear - the city centre Wirral Loop line is prone to track wear. This would be suitable for Merseyrail. Using banks of super capacitors at the sides of tracks brake regen can be achieved reducing overhead line size and reducing running costs.

http://www.railwaygazette.com/typo3temp/pics/e83d755695.jpg

pablo42
11-10-2009, 04:07 PM
You know your stuff WW, nice one.

Waterways
11-10-2009, 04:20 PM
You know your stuff WW, nice one.

I am no train enthusiast.I just want the best for Merseyside, which is a comprehensive highly frequent running metro system. That will assist in catapulting the city forwards.

pablo42
11-10-2009, 04:39 PM
I am no train enthusiast.I just want the best for Merseyside, which is a comprehensive highly frequent running metro system. That will assist in catapulting the city forwards.

Couldn't agree more, funny that there seems to be a lot of opposition on here though. Wonder why. Seems common noggin to me.

Waterways
11-10-2009, 05:02 PM
Couldn't agree more, funny that there seems to be a lot of opposition on here though. Wonder why. Seems common noggin to me.

That mystifies me too. I have travelled to many big cities and they all have a metro work properly. Without one they die. They sensibly use these rapid-transit networks as a means of publicising the cities. Liverpool has one and ignores it.

These advanced cities use their rapid-transit networks to shift fans quickly to and from stadia, so avoid traffic jams and inconvenience on all side, especially residents. London will not allow new stadia unless rapid-transit is adjacent shift half the capacity in one hour: Wembley, The Emirates. Liverpool has one and ignores it when the two clubs at the same time are moving home and building large stadia - a once in a 150 years event. Madness took over the city, no one seemed to know the city has a rapid-transit network to use.

Manchester wanted an underground, but it was too expensive so chose trams - Hobson's Choice. Liverpool has a metro which can be highly comprehensive and done so cheaply, but it is ignored for....trams. Yes, trams. Madness again overtook the city.

The politicos and press put forward that this wonderful outdated old-hat technology was to be the cities saviour. Yes, that is what the said. So they all believed it of course.

They the government rightly said it was silly and you do not know what you are doing and cancelled it. To save face they said it was still the saviour of the city.

So, by the time they realise the city has a metro and it can be easily expanded to serve the people in the best and ultimate manner, they would have lost 10 years.

If the city had gone the route of extending Merseyrail 10 years ago instead of going into the low-tech technology trams, Merseyrail would have been serving and promoting the city right now. The city would have been much further down the regeneration track.

Only in Liverpool.

pablo42
11-10-2009, 05:05 PM
Other cities too WW. We're trying to get people to use public transport and they wanna go backwards. It has to be cheap, fast and readily available. Only then will we leave cars alone.

Waterways
11-10-2009, 05:20 PM
Other cities too WW. We're trying to get people to use public transport and they wanna go backwards. It has to be cheap, fast and readily available. Only then will we leave cars alone.

It has to be two-pronged. Get the metro comprehensive and gradually restrict cars. Get rid of the urban motorway along The Strand, pedestrianise the centre, populate the centre and inner-cities, stop road extensions, restrict city centre car parking, have park and ride points in the Wirral and Liverpool side.

Give the city back to the people.

Light-Rail trains can accelerate quickly from station to station. No need for high top speeds like heavy-rail, as the stops will be frequent. Driverless, the trains can be very frequent - people do not like waiting, so one or two car trains can be used in off-peak times to get people to use them like buses. Clean and modern as well.

pablo42
11-10-2009, 05:31 PM
Sounds good to me.